IRC channel logs

<jab>Anyway, he said that he might be interested in using the Hurd, and perhaps buying a computer from me. But he wants to know more about the Hurd's current status.

<nexussfan>oh

<jab>youpi: rms did not do much coding for the Hurd, but he did give some technical guidance no?

<youpi>I don't think he did much

<jab>You would know more than me.

<youpi>it was all roland & thomas

<nexussfan>jab: it has emacs, i think that's all rms needs

<jab>fair enough.

<jab>anyway, here's where it got funny...

<youpi>also, we do have some usb support, for usb disk sticks

<jab>We do? I thought rumpusbdisk was for a SATA to usb dongle...

<jab>remind me to document how the Hurd can use usb disk sticks then, because I currently do not know how.

<youpi>afaik rumpusbdisk simply uses the usb storage standard interface

<nexussfan>i wonder if hurd works from ventoy

<youpi>and also usb cd

<jab>anyway, when I was drafting to rms some of the Hurd's recent achievements...I started to describe the new ext3/ext4 compatible journal that is in development.

<jab>Then it hit me.

<jab>I am describing ext2 to ext2's author! That's quite funny!

<jab>I am off to bed here soon.

<youpi>disks show up as /dev/ud*, and cd as /dev/ucd*

<jab>youpi thanks for being our maintainer for so long. You are a very good maintainer. Always prompt in following up with emails, etc. The Hurd wouldn't be here if not for you.

<nexussfan>yeah

<jab>jab is going to bed.

<jab>morning hurd friends! I've got a Hurd goal for myself today! My goal is to create a script that will download the latest 64 bit Hurd image, install qemu (if not installed), and then launch the Hurd.

<jab>We get lots of people emailing us or asking on irc, how do I run the hurd virtually. We can completely eleminate that problem by telling people to use this script.

<jab>does anyone have such a script that works already ?

<jab>I've also got an idea to start a Hurd blog that is a little bit like "undeadly.org".

<jab>I also had a really cool thought last night...with the Hurd it was be SUPER trivial to create an emacs-ftpfs.el. or perhaps better yet, get emacs to use Hurd's ftpfs where applicable.

<jab>it would be super easy to make emacs-nfs.el.

<jab>there is an experimental jails framework for NetBSD ...

<jab> https://netbsd-jails.petermann-digital.de/

<jab>oh this is interesting too: https://gist.github.com/jjl/d998164191af59a594500687a679b98d using gcc to make C faster searching for dynamic feature detection

<etno>jab: maybe an image with a config using jslinux ? https://www.bellard.org/jslinux/

<jab`>etno: that's pretty cool. running OSes inside a browser!

<etno>Never tried it with the hurd, but it would definitely be the simplest way for people to have a running system

<jab>oh I'm running an experiment by the way. I'm trying to figure out what a good price is for selling Hurd laptops. https://www.ebay.com/itm/206111412658

<jab>we'll see what happens.

<jab>also, I was pretty surprised to learn yesterday that rumpusbdisk supports usb sticks!

<jab>and usb cd players!

<jab>after I create a tiny script that helps users install qemu, download the live Hurd image, and run it.

<jab>rebooting now be back in a bit.

<jab>ok, making a hurd script to download and install qemu and run the hurd image...

<Alicia>I remember writing a similar script one time. it went a little overboard with getting the thing to run at any cost haha

<jab>Alicia: do you still have it ?

<jab>My idea is that people keep asking on the mailing list / irc that they have trouble running the Hurd in qemu.

<jab>But the Hurd runs WELL in qemu. this should be a solved problem.

<Alicia>jab: probably somewhere, but it was more similar in concept than the specific goal so I don't believe it would be very helpful

<jab> thanks anyway. :)

<yang3>I will try the Qemu on a PC which doesn't have X11, will that be ok, or do I need to run X?

<jab>yang3: you can run the Hurd on a computer without using X.

<jab>so you would just be restricted to console or tty.

<jab>basically your computer screen would look like a giant terminal with minimal to no mouse capability.

<jab>I'm in the process of writing a script which will automate downloading the qemu hurd image and run it.

<jab>also, just a thought, but we could use github to host the hurd wiki. I know lots of people don't like github, but the official hurd wiki is out a date quite a bit. github hosts static websites for free. just throwing that thought out there.

<Alicia>I think qemu with -device curses should work without X

<jab>Alicia: -device curses is only really helpful is you are not using the qwerty keyboard layout.

<yang3>OK, yes on a t60 I don't have X on the notebook, and hurd runs in console

<Alicia>jab: probably also if you don't have X :)

<jab>so I use the dvorak keyboard layout, so -device curses ( I think they changed it to -layout curses)...worked for me too.

<jab>Alicia: X is software written in C. If your computer has a display ...it can run X.

<yang3>jab may I suggest Codeberg hosting instead, it's more FOSS friendly. I dunno I think GitHub is owned by M$

<jab>Github is owned by M$, which is why we probably won't host the Hurd there.

<jab>I'm just trying to brainstorm how do we make "https://gnu.hurd.org" up to date ?

<jab>I am currently hosting a mirror of that on hurdos.com/wiki.

<yang3>We had an emacs project previously hosted on GitHub which we moved on Codeberg hosting, it's also free of charge.

<Alicia>jab: it probably can, but in case you don't want to do that

<jab>but I don't think I can afford to host hurd.gnu.org . I think OpenBSD's monthly bill to host their website is $500+ a month or so.

<jab>I wouldn't mind hosting gnu.hurd.org, but on a completely unrelated note...may I borrow $500 a month from you every month for forever ? :)

<Alicia>I feel like hosting and updates would be two separate issues, but I don't know the details about this setup

<gnucode>on a slightly un-related note...irc is odd. I am "jab". This is my alternative nick.

<gnucode>usually "gnucode" is jab but he is using the Hurd on real hardware.

<gnucode>I set it up like this, and I've no idea how I did it.

<gnucode>I also use gnucode, because I like to point people to my blog gnucode.org

<yang3> https://codeberg.org/

<jab>yang3: I am somewhat familiar with codeberg, but do they let one host static web sites for free? Like our wiki ? maybe maybe not...I suppose that I could ask.

<yang3>I think the hosting there is indeed free, you can also ask about the details in #codeberg

<jab>I also have an account on sourcehut. They don't host static websites, but since we are throwing out source code projects.

<jab>yang3 I don't know if we are on the same page...

<jab>here is spacemacs' github repo

<jab> https://github.com/syl20bnr/spacemacs

<jab> https://www.spacemacs.org/ -> that is the spacemacs website.

<jab>I believe that github.com is hosting www.spacemacs.org

<jab>I don't know if codeberg lets you host a static website like that.

<jab>maybe they do. I'll ask

<yang3>Spacemacs.GitHub.io

<jab>yup.

<jab>we are on the same page then

<jab>nevermind.

<jab>nevermind my earlier nevermind! We are on the same page.

<yang3>I think they can offer static hosting and maybe even a wiki

<Alicia>what's going on with the current hosting?

<gnucode>Alicia basically we could update hurd.gnu.org .

<gnucode>You could do it if you want to.

<Alicia>as in the website? or the server it runs on?

<gnucode>but it's manual and time consuming process. It has something to do with the fact that the FSF uses cvs

<gnucode>and it's harder to update quickly.

<gnucode>I think all of the FSF's software webpages uses the same cvs repo.

<Alicia>ah

<gnucode>there's a savannah web page somewhere that documents how to do about updating each individual website.

<gnucode>I believe that tricky process, is a contributing factor for why guix hosts guix.gnu.org and not the FSF.

<gnucode>I will also say that if you want to help us solve the problem, then I invite you to create a mirror of the hurd wiki and host it.

<gnucode>I could help you set something up like that if you want.

<Alicia>I might be up for that, depending on space requirements

<jab>Alicia: sounds good. A cheap VPS that I would recommend is either openbsd.amsterdam or guix-hosting.com

<jab>I think both are about $50 for a year.

<Alicia>oh I'm not looking to rent a VPS

<jab>that's fine, but I'm not sure how you can create a mirror of hurd.gnu.org without a VPS. :)

<Alicia>home server should work

<jab>oh. do you currently run a home server ?

<Alicia>yes

<jab>oh cool!

<Alicia>I don't have a lot of free space though. I should expand that

<jab>I don't think you need a ton of space for the wiki...

<jab>it looks like it's only about 20M for the wiki.

<Alicia>ah! I can definitely host that

<jab>the easiest way to render the wiki is "cd $guix-wiki; guix shell; ./render-locally"

<Alicia>where do I get $guix-wiki from?

<Alicia> https://cgit.git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/hurd/web.git/?

<yang3>I can provide a VPS if needed, if it's only 20MB size for the wiki...

<jab>most likely.

<jab>if you look on the bottom of that web page, there should be a "git clone" option.

<yang3>I have rented one at rack nerd,nerdrack hosting provider

<jab>it might be 40M total by the way...

<jab>yang3: do you blog ?

<yang3>Not anymore

<jab>do you host gaming things on your VPS ?

<yang3>No

<yang3>Only bind9

<yang3>Bind9 DNS resolver

<jab>I really don't know much about DNS. so are you letting friends use your DNS resolver ? What do you use it for ?

<jab>DNS over TLS ?

<yang3>Mostly for personal projects and domains

<yang3>No just DNS very basic

<gnucode>hmmm. do you know how to set up I'm not sure what the technical term for this is....

<gnucode>but say you want to host a website, but depending on where the request comes from, the user is directed to a server in Germany, or australia, or Alaska, etc.

<Alicia>geodns maybe?

<jab>probably. I'm talking too much to avoid doing actual work. I'm gonna hunker down and try to write this script...

<yang3>Yes, I don't have the geodns no, I am not familiar with such setup

<Alicia>I'm not sure render_locally is working as it should. It says "querying git for file creation and modification times.." "scanning ikiwiki.setup" and "/home/hurdmirror/web.rendered/ikiwiki.setup independently created, not overwriting with version from ikiwiki.se

<Alicia>tup"

<jab>hmmmm.

<Alicia>and then exits without any html generated as far as I can see. ../web.rendered exists, but only contains ikiwiki.setup

<jab>did you run "guix shell;" then "./render_locally" ?

<Alicia>no. this is not a guix system

<jab>it's up to you, BUT you can install just guix the package manager on top of Fedora or whatever you are using.

<jab>I personally have only ever been successfully able to build the hurd wiki, if I was on Debian or if I used "guix shell".

<Alicia>ah, it is Debian

<jab>well then just a second.

<jab>I'm assuming you downloaded all the depencies ?

<jab> https://hurdos.com/wiki/contributing/web_pages.html#index6h2

<jab>apt install ikiwiki libyaml-syck-perl markdown libsearch-xapian-perl texinfo

<Alicia>yes, as I encountered errors from missing them

<Alicia>I realize now that the issue probably comes from those interruptions

<Alicia>erasing ../web.rendered seems to let it continue

<jab>nice!

<Alicia> https://hurd.ion.nu/

<gnucode>nice!

<gnucode>youpi: we have another hurd wiki mirror: https://hurd.ion.nu/ Alicia set it up.

<yang>gnucode: hm, are there multiple hurd wiki's , what is the reason for multiple wikis?

<yang>and how do these "merge" then?

<gnucode>take a look at gnu.hurd.org

<gnucode>sorry hurd.gnu.org

<gnucode>it's really outdate from the actual wiki.

<gnucode>darnassus is the up to date version.

<yang>okay, but if people are going to edit the wiki, wouldn't that be confusing if there are multiple wikis to edit, or do the changes between them merge somehow?

<gnucode>I do think that new hurd users find this confusing.

<gnucode>there are two ways to edit the wiki. login to darnassus (which is easy to do by the way) and edit the html.

<gnucode>the other way is to email git patches to bug-hurd@gnu.org

<gnucode>and I agree, having multiple wikis is perhaps not the best solution.

<jab>i'm open to other solutions.

<yang>yes _I made an account on darnassus

<jab>sweet! Sometimes editing darnassus can be annoying. It'll be bogged down and then you can't save your changes.

<jab>it is what it is.

<yang3>but having multiple (same) wikis can be also confusing, people who will edit them, won't know which is original?

<gnucode>you cannot edit hurdos.com/wiki via a web interface.

<gnucode>you cannot edit the newer https://hurd.ion.nu

<gnucode>go to https://hurd.ion.nu/ try to click on the "Edit" tab

<gnucode>oh dang! hurd.ion.nu set up searching! That was fast!

<gnucode>I still haven't done that yet!

<gnucode>yang3: but I agree with you. best to just update hurd.gnu.org to the latest version of the wiki.

<gnucode>I would estimate that would take me a week to do working 9am - 5pm.

<gnucode>maybe longer.

<gnucode>yang3: here's an idea:

<gnucode>the guix people don't actually have a wiki.

<gnucode>intentionally. they tell people to contribute to the guix manual. Their manual is a work of art.

<gnucode>I could shift focus a bit and make the Hurd manual actually good.

<Alicia>gnucode: oh yeah, I noticed it wasn't working so I fixed it

<gnucode>The Hurd manual is very sparse. Not much is documented. And probably a fair amount of it is outdated.

<yang3>gnucode, another solution would be having a menu/webpage with mentioning like "original wiki - URL" then below "wiki mirror 1" and "wiki mirror 2" and "wiki mirror 3" etc.

<gnucode>Alicia: how ? I'm using OpenBSD to host hurdos.com/wiki

<gnucode>yang3: we can try that, but there's a change that Alicia's internet bill each month would skyrocket.

<gnucode>Mine would probably go up quite a bit too.

<Alicia>gnucode: I'm using the xapian omega thing that it seems to be set up for already. the database is in web/.ikiwiki/xapian/default

<gnucode>hmmm. I'll have to take a look at my site and see if I can't make some tweaks.

<Alicia>gnucode: my internet bill is fixed for the speeds I get, so if anything it would just be overloaded with requests

<Alicia>but I don't think it would be that bad

<gnucode>honestly it might be cool to create a guix-config.scm that describes how to host a Hurd mirror. Then anyone who has a guix VPS can easily host a mirror.

<gnucode>we could try it.

<gnucode>youpi How do you feel about adding to the hurd.gnu.org wiki a mirror list of hurd wikis ?

<gnucode>youpi: I'm willing to put mine up: hurdos.com/wiki and Alicia has one: https://hurd.ion.nu/index.html

<yang3>I think i have about 4TB monthly limit Bandwidth

<yang3>and also a server with 100/100 unlimited

<gnucode>sneek later tell nexussfan we have another hurd mirror website, and searching works! https://hurd.ion.nu/index.html

<sneek>Okay.

<gnucode>yang3 feel free to create your own hurd mirror. Please be aware, the A.I. bots may start crawling the crap out of it.

<yang3>ahhh

<yang3>I think that 3 mirrors are sufficient ?

<yang3>I could give access to the VPS to someone who would maintain it

<yang3>right now I am gonna try the qemu

<jab>yeah, I'm still working on that install script...I haven't gotten very far...

<yang3>I like this "Copyright © 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019 - Free Software Foundation, Inc. License: GFDL 1.2+ Last edited 2026-03-05 18:50:26 CET"

<yang3>What is the thing to mention so many years, instad of like a year-span?

<yang3>I ment 2002 - 2019

<yang3>I need to pick up the USBtoSATA cable today

<gnucode>when lawyers get involved ... they need to know who ownes what commits.

<gnucode>And there are some years where there might not be any commits.

<yang3>ok

<yang3>I get this issue when trying to start qemu-kvm

<yang3> https://paste.debian.net/hidden/646cc6f7

<jab>yang3 that's qemu telling you that it is mounting the Hurd's filesystems read-only.

<jab>there's a way to fix it...

<jab>just a sec

<jab>you need -format=raw I'll put a paste to my command that I use to run qemu

<jab> https://paste.debian.net/hidden/02a8cafb

<jab>that's the command that I use to run the 64 bit hurd.

<jab>it's a pity the hurd wiki does not document that. I'll add it.

<yang3>hmmm

<yang3>missing the KVM module on Debian

<yang> https://paste.debian.net/hidden/32496eed

<jab>ok, so in my limited opinion, running the hurd via qemu without kvm acceleration is awful!

<yang3>I wonder which "kvm" package do I need to instaoll?

<jab>it's just SO much more stable with kvm acceleration

<jab>I think it should be installed already. I feel like it should be installed. do me a favor

<jab>ls -lha /dev/kvm

<jab>what is the group of /dev/kvm ?

<jab>is your user in that group ?

<yang>ls: cannot access '/dev/kvm': No such file or directory

<yang>i am running from root

<yang>the command

<jab>interesting!

<yang>i installed qemmu-system-x86 and all dependancies

<jab>qemu just uses the kvm linux kernel module

<yang>aqemu - Qt5 front-end for QEMU and KVM

<jab>is your laptop really old ?

<yang>well its old, but I am triyng on a nettop machine, which is amd64

<yang>to use qemu

<yang>I have debian trixie on

<jab>how old is your laptop ?

<yang>laptop is core2duo era

<yang>it should support 64bit

<jab>that should work ish.

<yang>maybe I need to reboot the PC

<jab>you can try it, but I don't know that that will help.

<yang> https://paste.debian.net/hidden/38961eda

<jab>I feel your pain man. I've wanted to run the Hurd far years. People keep talking about how cool it is, and almost everytime I used the Hurd in qemu...I'd get filesystem corruption within a few weeks that was so bad I had to download and start all over....

<yang>ouch

<jab>yeah.

<jab>I personally avoid running the Hurd on qemu, because I've had such trouble using the Hurd in qemu.

<yang>well I am trying to run it in qemu-kvm (but failing) so that I can modify it and transgfer it to the HDD in the laptop

<jab>gotcha....

<jab>let's see how can I best help you...

<jab>a couple of options.

<jab>there is a linux kernel command modprobe that tries to load the various kernel modules that you need

<jab>for intel machines the command is something like

<jab>sudo modprobe kvm kvm_intel

<jab>do this for me

<jab>sudo lsmod | grep kvm

<yang>maybe the default debian kernel doesnt havce a "kvm" module?

<jab>on my intel machine the output that I get is:

<jab>kvm_intel

<jab>kvm

<jab>well it's a bit more verbose that that.

<yang> https://paste.debian.net/hidden/b6dc9887

<yang>ok cool

<Alicia>on my debian I have kvm

<Alicia>it's possible core2 doesn't have the CPU feature required

<yang>this machine is without X

<yang>i am trying on Intel Atom (very old)

<jab>I am running a core2dou intel machine and it has kvm and kvm_intel

<yang>Intel(R) Atom(TM) CPU 230 @ 1.60GHz

<Alicia>oh, I got your devices mixed up

<jab>also a quick google search shows that debian kernels usually include a kvm module

<Alicia>on intel vmx is the flag you need for kvm support, `grep vmx /proc/cpuinfo` should tell you if you have it

<yang>same error as before the modprobe...

<Alicia>according to this website. hm, it seems outdated though

<yang>nope I dont have it in /proc/cpuinfo

<Alicia>nevermind, not outdated I was just looking at the wrong device

<jab>ok a quick duckduckgo is telling me this: The Intel Atom CPU 230 does not support KVM (Kernel-based Virtual Machine) as it lacks the necessary virtualization extensions. KVM requires a processor with Intel VT-x support, which the Atom 230 does not have.

<yang3>ok

<yang3>I will need to test it elsewhere then

<Alicia>it will be slower, but it should work without kvm too

<yang>ok on another PC I have it

<yang>$ lsmod |grep kvm

<yang>kvm_intel 413696 0

<yang>kvm 1396736 1 kvm_intel

<yang>irqbypass 12288 1 kvm

<jab>try it on that pc. :)

<jab>make sure that you are in the kvm group with the "groups" command, which lists out what groups your user is a member of.

<yang>ok

<yang>Alicia: on the ATOM it won't run without kvm

<yang>gtk initialization failed

<yang>maybe it needs X11

<Alicia>yes the default gtk GUI requires X11

<Alicia>you can do -display curses to use the ncurses TUI instead

<Alicia>X11 or Wayland probably*

<yang>that worked , I am doing it over ssh

<jab>nice. go team!

<yang>from root avccount

<jab>I literally just started my hurd in a virtual machine.

<jab>and it has gotten stuck during boot.

<jab>I've been a hurd enthusist for years. And I still struggle with getting the Hurd to run well in qemu.

<jab>not complaining. I'm not telling anyone to fix it. I'm just pointing out that it's confusing.

<Alicia>does it give any potentially helpful information about why it got stuck?

<jab> warning: dmalloc(4096) requested with 10000 alignment, bumping up size

<jab> ext2fs: part:5:device:wd0: Input/output error

<jab>no idea. I really not interested in fixing it at the moment.

<jab>I'm really content with the way the Hurd is running on real hardware.

<yang>jab: does the qemu modifies the original hard drive filesystem? or is it all that it does, only within the .img ?

<jab>yang3: here's my 2 cents of advice.

<jab>qemu does not modify your host operating system's filesystem...in this case qemu does not modify Linux's ext4 filesystem.

<jab>qemu only modifies what in .img

<yang>ok

<jab>anyway, my two cents when using the hurd in qemu:

<jab>always have a back up image.

<jab>that way when your daily .img hard locks up on you, and you have to hard shut off qemu...

<jab>and you reboot it and the Hurd is just junk on that daily .img

<yang>it seems I am stuck with this error https://paste.debian.net/hidden/73e2343e

<jab>You can restart in the .backup

<yang3>ok

<jab>is your linux computer 64 bit ?

<yang3>ATOM runs amd64 debian

<jab>ok. I am selling a Debian GNU/Hurd laptop... :)

<yang>Linux iskra 6.12.73+deb13-amd64 #1 SMP PREEMPT_DYNAMIC Debian 6.12.73-1 (2026-02-17) x86_64

<gnucode>i can confirm that jab is selling a Debian GNU/Hurd laptop, and he is a really nice guy!

<Alicia>haha

<gnucode>$230 and it's yours.

<yang>Yes, I would order one t420, but the problem is that you are probably in USA? And the shipping and customs would be a hassle.

<yang>I am in EU

<jab>that's true.

<jab>I believe it's not too bad to do international shipping, but the shipping cost may be $40 - $60.

<yang>well we pay TAX-customs on imports too

<jab>I bought my pinephone and it was internationally shipped to me.

<yang>which are like 30%

<jab>you might be able to buy a old thinkpad on ebay for a cheap amount.

<yang>I stopped ordering goods from USA, sadly it is just too expenssive

<yang>I have an t60 and this HP/COMPAQ, and also EEEPC

<jab>well your T60 should run the Hurd fairly well. I ran the Hurd on a T43 for off and on maybe a year and a half.

<jab>it was mostly ok.

<yang>yeah it works

<yang>I have a notification on a local electronics forum if an old thinkpad laptop shows up, I am buying it :)

<yang>I think that the HP/COMPAQ might work too?

<jab>it might.

<yang>it's from the same c2d era

<jab>I really wish that I could snap my fingers and get it working for you!

<yang>thanks :)

<jab>when I get a Hurd VPS, I'll give you ssh access.

<jab>I know that you can request ssh access to darnassus.

<yang>ok

<jab>yang you have a full invitation from me to edit the hurd wiki. That's how I help out with the project.

<jab>the hurd could really use some great documentation people.

<jab>I can point you to a page that has all the irc logs, which you can download locally.

<yang>I made an account on darnassus yestrerday

<jab>did you ? nice! I don't think I have an account there, but it is cool.

<yang>is darnassus the (original) wiki on hurd.gnu.org ?

<jab>so ideally, we would host hurd.gnu.org (the hurd wiki) on a hurd machine.

<jab>darnassus is a hurd machine.

<jab>and it is the original most up to date wiki. When Samuel pushes commits into the web repo on savannah, he immedately pushes to darnasses right after.

<yang>ok thats nice

<yang>i have savannah account aswell

<jab>darnassus is a hurd machine -> is a linux machine running qemu that runs the hurd.

<yang>Debian GNU/Hurd forky/sid debian console

<yang>

<yang> login:

<jab>nice!

<yang>qemu went through

<jab>ok, I need to work on my qemu script.

<jab>oh, I think I know why the hurd wiki qemu command does not tell you to use format=raw

<jab>probably because filesystem corruption is so easy to do on the Hurd. If the hurd's filesystem is read only, then you maybe won't get soo much data corruption...

<jab>wait a second....

<jab>I caused the problem with my qemu hurd machine just now.

<jab>I ran the qemu command incorrectly.

<jab>so the hurd did nothing wrong. That was all user error.

<yang>hmmm, the default filesystem for hurd is ext2 ?

<yang>I recall back in the days, it was easy to break it

<yang>becaused it didnt automaticaly fsck

<jab>yang: the hurd might have ext3fs or ext4fs within 6 months - a year ?

<yang>nice!

<jab>there's a hurd developer working on it now. Based on his past commits, it could be added in.

<jab>He's using it now in qemu.

<yang>are all hurd developers volunteers? in the early days AFAIK the hurd was a paid project?

<jab>all current hurd developers are volunteers yes. But you can pay me if you like. Like if you just have this annoying problem of having too much money. I'm happy to take it off your hands. :)

<yang>:)))

<jab>That's why I am starting this Hurd business.

<jab>The open source projects that I really like, they all have paid developers working on the code.

<jab>I want to fund 2000+ developers working on the hurd full time.

<jab>I think that's about how many linux developers there are by the way.

<jab>yang you can donate $ to damo22 by the way. He's the guy spearheading the current SMP support

<jab>zamaudio.com

<jab>ok I'm really leaving irc this time. I got to try to do some work. Nice chatting with you all.

<yang>well I will definitelly donate, it's another project which seems to be for a good cause...I have some projects, where I usually donatre at the end of year

<yang3>Alicia 'ssh -X' enables remote viewing of GTK

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2026-03-05.log