***mbanck_ is now known as mbanck
<m4t3>How far is the Hurd 64bit port? <youpi>the kernel boots, the first process does some system calls <m4t3>Thank you. I am of the opinion that we have to aggressively pursue this port, 64bit has a large user base. <m4t3>We need more people trying and testing the Hurd both in VMs and baremetal (let's give YouTube runboxers more content), moreso we need new eyes, young blood and old wisdom. <curiosa>m4t3 I think we need a lot of marketing for that <curiosa>one idea I had is that maybe the hurd should make an ecosystem <curiosa>something like PyPI or CPAN, but for hurd servers <curiosa>there are things you can find on the net that are not part of the main hurd, such as two audio drivers <curiosa>that feels like abandonware from the outside <curiosa>I have a concern on how much hurd servers are meant to be composed <curiosa>but if that was a possibilty, for instance by having servers using other servers under the hood <curiosa>you see how much an ecosystem could provide a cooperative boost to the hurd <curiosa>another thing would be to break compatibility with POSIX <curiosa>at least from the marketing standpoint <curiosa>for instance a windowing system that is not wayland or X11 <curiosa>but uses Mach RPCs for mode settings and resource allocation <curiosa>a console that includes tmux support <curiosa>I am not sure how much people really care about 64bit; SMP seems a more powerful abstraction performanewise <youpi>the console is already tmuxified <youpi>you can connect several console clients to it <curiosa>but a 64bit port would be a great marketing boost <youpi>we do care about 64bit for year-2048-ness, and addressing space, we do have problems with building large packages <youpi>SMP is an important thing too <curiosa>youpi I was thinking that the console could also support remote multiplexing through ssh <youpi>both flock together actually: they'll both be easier once we get rid of the linux code from gnumach <youpi>curiosa: for the ssh case you can use tmux <youpi>there is no need to reinvent it <curiosa>just integrate it better, there are hooks for terminal emilators in tmux <curiosa>by the way these kind of stuff could be implemented in an ecosystem where everyone could contribute, that what I meant by ecosystem <scm>Hi all, I'm looking forward to installing Hurd and helping out with documentation. <curiosa>youpi: what I really meant was not specific to the kernel or to the console; there might be many other things <curiosa>reinventing wheels could be a good strategy since it allows people to be very ideosynchratic <curiosa>if they are allowed to be dirty of course, hence an ecosystem <youpi>reinventing wheels also means having to mainting them <curiosa>I was wondering about composability of translators <curiosa>this seems like a loss of time, but in fact allows other to take care of maintenaince of code they didn't write <curiosa>of course there is no reason why translators wouldn't be as composalbe as software libraries <curiosa>is __GNU__ is the correct define for hurd specific code? <youpi>because it provides the BSD interface <curiosa>it doesn't provide arc4random_buf apparently <curiosa>What would be the ideomatic way in the Hurd to get the executable path from a program? <youpi>if you look for a very hurdish way you have proc_get_exe <youpi>but otherwise reading proc will work, yes <curiosa>youpi thanks, will #include <hurd.h> suffice to call that RPC? <curiosa>proc_get_exe(getproc(), getpid(), buf); <curiosa>works, but how this avoids buffer overflows? <curiosa>I was expecting buf to be char **, but instead it is char * <youpi>it's not char*, it's string_t <curiosa>would have been nice if the compiler warned <curiosa>there is /* XXX */ next to string_t definition, does it means that it will eventually change? <youpi>we'd like to avoid hardcoded 1024 yes <youpi>when you get a segfault, use gdb to know where exactly that happens <curiosa>but how do you avoid to hardcode 1024 if you don't pass a size parameter in the RPC? <youpi>normally the compiler should have warned about the poniter incoherency <youpi>did you pass -Wall -Wextra ? <youpi>thus the "XXX" that has been there for long <curiosa>maybe they were imagining there would be a structured string type of the kind (size_t len, buffer), in any case introducing that would break the rpc