<daviid>taijiavila: i'll leave guix folks answer the second part, but i would keep it as is, because that's a guile 'message', that is what guile will display no matter what locale the user is using, i think (?)
<jackhill>anyone else having problems with some gnome stuff segfaulting after the recent updates? On one comperter Files (nautalus) has the problem and gnome-control-center on another. `guix gc --verify=repair,contents` turns up clean on one computer, but repeadetly "repairs" spice on the second.
<jackhill>also, why would `guix gc --verify=repair` not be able to repair an item?
<apteryx>lechner: perhaps guix deploy? and making the common stuff shared as common modules
<jackhill>wooo, I got rid of the problematic spice (it was from an old generation), but gnome-control-center still segfaults
<unmatched-paren>hnhx[m]: i should have said "no configuration required, unless you want to fine-tune it like ss2 did" :)
<hnhx[m]>ye i think i will go with default settings
<hnhx[m]>also i think i should get a new battery, even though the one i have rn is new too, but it only lasts for like an hour so i kinda feel like i got scammed
<ss2>med_power_with_dipm isn't a default, and may be unstable. But it is the most effective in keeping SSD's in a passive state while keeping the temps down. 10°C alone was a lot I thought once I observed the system cooling down by itself.
<ss2>unmatched-paren: I also got the tp-smapi-module in to the repos too. That's the module where you can manually take control over thinkpads bettery charge. Pretty cool module.
<ss2>with that you can sudo tlp fullcharge, or discharge your battery on a whim.
<ss2>But I'm still wondering why Debian has got a better config still, because the fan there spins down even further.
<nckhexen>Right, smapi doesn't support mine (which is why I never bothered adding it alongside acpi-call-linux-module, sorry you had to 😛). Part of me would be surprised if TLP didn't support $any_backend though, but an equal part of me wouldn't.
<unmatched-paren>I did have an issue once with TLP on my last laptop, when I tried using it on Ubuntu; the kernel panicked when I shut it down.
<nckhexen>ss2: Oh, I meant a friend or acquaintance. I agree it's not a viable business. Have fun even shipping them.
<nckhexen>unmatched-paren: OK, you've made an excellent case not to bother trying TLP after all, thank you.
<unmatched-paren>I think I'll stick to thermald, which has the rather significant advantage of being under the intel/ organisation on GitHub
<unmatched-paren>nckhexen: Eh, it'll probably work much better on a ThinkPad. And I'm not even sure it was TLP that caused that.
<unmatched-paren>Besides, I used it on Guix System on my last laptop for ages with zero issues.
<ss2>I'm pleased with tlp. But yeah, I did mention that it is trial and error to get it right. You're system will crash. It gets even worse with docking stations. I was determined enough that I could at least keep my laptop switched on in this summer's heat wave.
<nckhexen>Okido. I'll let you know if I ever try it, and especially if it goes boom.
<nckhexen>Silly question, but why do you both use these services to begin with?
<ss2>To run them at a lower temperature. Nothing else.
<nckhexen>Does your machine overheat without them? Significant batter life? Something else?
<nckhexen>Well, I'd (perhaps naively) expect that to feed right back into the temperature & hence feedback loop, and it would just downclock sooner, possibly always. I don't really understand why the core temperature sensors would ‘care’ or make assumptions about how much heat they *could* evacuate… But then I'm no TDP science man.
<ss2>no, they'd get so hot you couldn't touch them anymore. Like 45--50°C around the case. With TLP it all went down to 39,40. Surprisingly the biggest difference was with the SSD.
<nckhexen>Interesting (your SSD comment was what prompted my original message. I'm pretty sure I have the same SATA link state by default, but with those results it now bears double-checking.
<ss2>the problem with, for instance my model, is that the sensors where designed around the fact of the machines themeselfs heating up, but the fan is not designed to remove the heat from the whole case. Only the CPU. Which is just a design error, unless you sit in an air conditioned room on a cool table.
<nckhexen>Right. I guess that was my real question, and I was indeed a bit naive.
<ss2>yeah, I never realised that SSDs can be such radiators. But that has to do with the controller not downclocking.
<ss2>tbh, the more modern laptops from the last five years have gotten significantly better, since the main goal has been to keep the battery running for as long as possible.
<ss2>that wasn't the case 10 or 15 years ago. The goal there was more throughput and a bit powersaving.
<sektor[m]>Ther we go, making progress. My problem was that I misheard #~ as #`; not so sure how that happened.
<unmatched-paren>ss2: Ah, makes sense that you'd want to get the temperature down as low as possible if you live in a place with summer heatwaves. Fortunately, we don't get serious summer heatwaves (yet; thanks, global warming...) here (in the west of Scotland, not known for warm temperatures :P)
<nckhexen>When I was (extremely reluctantly) choosing a 'phone, it was very interesting to read vastly different reviews on performance & throttling and after a while realising there was a geographic pattern. Mostly India. The subcontinent murders bad cooling, apparently.
<ss2>unmatched-paren: yes, that's the reason. I've been caught in crazy heat waves the last years now and since I've turned my focus on to keeping machines just as cold as possible.
<ss2>Even having to remove plastic modems from being screwed against walls. Everything just melts now. I've even gone that far to move cpu intense processes into the night. Machines will just pop right up to 70°C and don't really want to burn through them either.
<unmatched-paren>I suspect the heatwaves will eventually catch up to us, given the horrific heat in London and the wildfires across England last summer.
<jonsger[m]>apteryx thanks for migrating icedove to gexp! Could you assist me in making the "thunderbird-sources" in native-inputs a gexp as well? I tried in the past but failed...
<ss2>It can be very dry and humid here where the heat will sit for weeks. I'm adjusting to it now.
<Kabouik>I'm facing a "fatal error: linux/limits.h: No such file or directory" when installing some package in R. I think limits.h is something that comes with kernel-headers and/or kernel-devel in other distros, what would be the way to install/compile those R packages in Guix?
<Kabouik>I thought those plugins (either for R and emacs) work only within their "parent" program, so installing them with Guix seems a bit overkill to me (especially if one needs to write the packages definitions in the first place)
<unmatched-paren>Actually, we also have quite a few R packages, since many Guix users are scientists.
<Kabouik>That was my understanding too, but for instance we don't have r-ggplot, which is massively used in R, and I can't imagine no one in the Guix community uses it
<Kabouik>We even have Guix packages that work in combination with ggplot
<unmatched-paren>Kabouik: Well, you already have a collection of local packages that haven't been upstreamed yet, haven't you?
<unmatched-paren>Kabouik: You could also consider starting your own channel for these packages.
<Kabouik>I can't imagine telling my intern "Err, yeah apparently we need that package to solve your issue. I'll submit a patch to Guix and then I can help you. Hold on." I'm joking of course, I'd probably try to package it and build it locally first, but in some cases this may be a huge time sink even if not waiting for a merge
<unmatched-paren>You do have a point, of course. You could maybe use package.install() in the short term, note the package's name down, and then, when you have time, make a Guix package for it.
<Kabouik>(Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining or ranting, I'm trying to clearly understand the workflow of other R uses in Guix before making choices and going in a way that could be suboptimal)
<Kabouik>Typically, should I install packages in my user profile (guix install), in my system (guix system reconfigure), or in some specific profile for R (I don't intentionally use multiple guix profiles yet so I wouldn't know how to do it)? I'm asking because I think every `guix command` gets a tad longer every time I install a package in my profile. Currently with 185 packages it's already much longer than it used to be.
<Kabouik>Could grow substantially if my R packages are installed through guix
***MysteriousSilver is now known as vetrivln
<florhizome[m]><florhizome[m]> "nckxhexen turns out I am getting..." <- I would Like to get back to this: i am getting this in a Mail from my Provider. I use gut sendmail with msmtp as sendmail Program. When i just send normal Mail it works, but Patches Like this, it doesn't.
<sleepydog>Kabouiki: I'm not an R user, but I use guix for ocaml development. I usually just use the `opam` importer for guix to add packages to a guix.scm file that I use `guix shell` with. Sometimes it needs some fiddling, and that's annoying.
<Kabouik>I see sleepydog, thanks. Yes, that "Sometimes" exception is the issue, it usually gets in the way exactly when you can't take the time to deal with it.
<sleepydog>that is true. I have no time constraints on this work, as it's not part of my day job
<Kabouik>And I doubt colleagues would understand the situation either when they're waiting for my part
<unmatched-paren>Kabouik: You can use ``guix shell'' instead, to avoid installing tons of R packages
<Kabouik>I have an ultimate fantasy goal, learning emacs and using it as my R editor/repl. But until then, there are many small roadblocks that I may hit as I learn Guix (which is expected, and I'm still happy with the process), R packages being one
<Kabouik>Yes I found about ESS when I started that fantasy; still haven't tried though because I still have too much to learn with emacs keybindings first. Interesting about guix.install(), I didn't know about that one. Cool. Not great for sharing scripts with others or for submitting them to material repositories though.
<rekado>you’ll just accumulate definitions for missing packages in ~/.Rguix
<rekado>for sharing scripts with others you can send along the ~/.Rguix file
<Kabouik>Right, that sounds like a relevant use case for it
<rekado>you can share your environment symbolicly for those who use Guix or as a binary blob for those who don’t
<Kabouik>I believe online script repositories and reviewers/editors wouldn't be too happy about it, they'd most likely expect .R or .Rmd files. But for what it's worth, as long as I properly document how to reproduce the work, I might be allowed to send my scripts as a bunch of pdf or even png files. That'd be mean, though.
<civodul>well, i'm not sure why one would be fine with having the system on the wrong timezone
<civodul>i guess that can be the case if that's a throwaway server or Docker image etc.
<apteryx>right. the idea came years ago when I was generating docker images with Guix, and in this context a few things appeared as clutter to the system definition, such as the bootloader and timezone fields.
<antipode>linj,unmatched-paren: I've heard that mrustc supports aarch64-linux nowadays
<unmatched-paren>I meant to send that EditorConfig file ages ago, but totally forgot about it :)
<unmatched-paren>nckhexen: By the way, do you think 85 is a decent "max line length" value?
<nckhexen>I understand what you're going for, and I think it's OK. There's no ‘soft limit’ or ‘show a ruler here’ setting? Although… I guess editors will treat this as a soft limit (no?), so maybe it should be 80?
<attila_lendvai>gnome-shell-extension-clipboard-indicator saves the clipboard history by default to the disk in cleartext, including passwords. and the setting is called something obstruse. does this constitute a security issue? it sure surprised me.
<attila_lendvai>disk encryption is not enough for a simple security hole in a browser that blindly scans and collects well-known files... saving the clipboard to disk greatly increases the attack vector.
<zpiro>anticomputer: the first thing you need to know for crypto in guix, is that is protected from tampering. It is not proected from runlevel tampering, and for your needs in user space your bosses will trust the level of crypto if government trust is required for employment and living.
<zpiro>anticomputer: "above your paygrade and TMSC pay grade level of tampering".
<zpiro>TMSC having Nvidia as the first major customer for their industry level open policy and intellectual property service level and survey of production line.
<zpiro>That is the biggest fab in the world, and biggest and most powerful industry in Taiwain.
<nashdidan[m]>Hi guys. Any idea why importing a crate seems to fail with 'Throw to key
<nashdidan[m]>`gnutls-error' with args `(#<gnutls-error-enum The TLS connection was
<apteryx>it could be more convenient to not require the use of a channel and demonstrates with just what's included in Guix proper, but if there's a good reason to demo Guix Science, I think it'd be OK.
<two[m]>is it possible to get search paths not as bash commads, but as a simple `PATH=/gnu/store/...` like format?
<jcmdln>Ah, looking at `traceroute ci.guix.gnu.org` it's my ISP that has a bad/slow route. Sorry for the noise and thanks for the quick feedback unmatched-paren rekado !
<Cairn><two[m]> "unfortunately it has the same..." <- Darn! Not sure what to say then.
<gunnargrop[m]>Hey everyone! I'm very new to Guix so excuse me if this is a stupid question, but how come GDM can't launch a Gnome Wayland session, but SDDM can?
<cbaines>gunnargrop[m], the GDM can, it just needs configuring to do so
<gunnargrop[m]>cbaines: Oh okay, thank you. I read the documentation on desktop-services where it states you'll need to use the "sddm-service instead of GDM as the graphical login manager" if one wishes to use Wayland, so I assumed it really was the case
<lechner>Hi, is anyone using podman? I see Error: open /etc/containers/policy.json: no such file or directory
<gabber>i get a "guix home: error: no target of type 'activate' for service 'wireguard'" when trying to add a wireguard service to my home configuration. does wireguard-service-type only work for system configurations?