<bdju>hm launching quaternion with that env var manually also doesn't work
<ss2>I'm not sure if qt5ct is working as expected. It fails to find any installed themes, and it never sets any theme (icon themes have never been set), and have been contemplating to make a bug report regarding it -- but haven't had the time, and it somewhat remains a cosmetic issue for me.
<The_tubular>guix remove: error: package 'bash' not found in profile
<drakonis>wait but i dont understand what you're trying to do here?
<ss2>The_tubular: packages may be removed from your profile, but that doesn't mean that they are removed from your “hard disk”, since said package, that was once part of your profile(s) reman in the store.
<drakonis>also why are you still rooted, haven't you created an user?
<ixmpp>flatwhatson; your emacs native package, are you aware of the fact that every compile results in "Warning (comp): /gnu/store/xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx-emacs-yyyy-n.n.n/share/emacs/site-lisp/yyyy-n.n.n/zzz.el: Error: File error Opening output file"
<zacchae[m]>Does GUIX try to manage your emacs `init.el`? I've installed multiple emacs packages with guix that I can't seem to access them (don't show up in M-x), so I'm wondering if I overwrote
<zacchae[m]> * Does GUIX try to manage your emacs `init.el`? I've installed multiple emacs packages with guix that I can't seem to access them (don't show up in M-x), so I'm wondering if I overwrote something important
<zacchae[m]>I want to try a `(require <packagename>)` statement, but neither the guix repo description nor the original git repo include what the package is called in emacs.
<dongcarl>Installed GuixSD on an ancient iMac today... Installation went well, but GUI is not working. The GPU is a Radeon HD 4670, and when I boot with default flags in GRUB the black screen problem appears. When I boot with nomodeset, things seem to work until shepard is starting gnome (or is it gdm?) and then I get a solitary blinking cursor (no login
<apteryx>dongcarl: I'm guessing GNOME expects some basic 3D support, even in software, but your GPU/driver combo doesn't have any. Perhaps try something more old school like Xfce.
<apteryx>as for the equivalent to journalctl; the closest to see the kernel log would be 'sudo dmesg', otherwise less /var/log/messages
<daveed>zacchae: Again, I don't know how to use emacs. But I would ASSUME it doesn't matter. Does `/run/current-system/profile/share/emacs/site-lisp` contain the plugins? If not, maybe guix is giving EMACSLOADPATH the wrong value.
<zacchae[m]>Actually, I think it is a design choice. Programs should only draw from the intended packages, so it makes sense to keep them seperate. That way my system can update without worry of it affecting the user (or vice-versa)
<wirez>why doesn't guix have its own gnu paste service and uses debian instead?
<vagrantc>it's not worth setting up when there are working ones?
<zacchae[m]>daveed: Actually, it looks like my emacs path updated on reboot (maybe from /etc/profile?). Now EMACSLOADPATH has the user directory first, then the system one. But this only happened after installing emacs as a user, so it may be a bug
<zacchae[m]>does guix have working bluetooth audio with pulseaudio? pulse doesn't seem to be noticing my BT device.
<zacchae[m]>Maybe there is a package I need. I did `guix search blu puls` and that only brought up `guile-ac-d-bus`, but I don't think that's what I want
<iskarian>wirez, I am not an expert, but I believe the answer is yes, as long as you do not prevent the user from installing other software. With the usual GPL caveats about distributing source.
<zacchae[m]>iskarian: The GPL requirements just prevent you from "bundling" anything you make with the proprietary code. i.e., if you make a system that uses both, then you could not legally distribute that system as you could not satisfy both licences
<nckx><software replaced by the user> So attempting to prevent users from installing their own software on their own hardware is sometimes called ‘tivoization’, and it's one of the things that the GPLv3 was made to prevent. So it's definitely not something desirable.
<sawshep>Does anyone have experience developing with Ruby on Rails (or Ruby in general) on Guix? Bundler likes to complain that Ruby's /gnu/store folder is read-only. I've tried re-installing ruby and ruby-rails systemwide, per profile, and in environments (all with gc'ing inbetween), but I get the same error.
<dongcarl>Ah I just needed to authorize my old iMac's signing key on my build machine...
<zacchae[m]>Is there a way to spawn a second, similtaneous, x session from GDM?
<zacchae[m]>irfus: when I do that, it just takes me to a "lock screen" (I can still switch back with C-M-f#), and signing in just takes me to my existing session
<char>is there a way to guix build locally, so that the artifacts are just in the current directory?
<iskarian>char: on a guix checkout, `./bootstrap`; `./configure --localstatedir=/my/directory/var --with-store-dir=/my/directory/store`; `make`; and optionally `make install`
<char>thanks iskarian, but I meant if some project contains a guix package definition and I want to build it and just have access to artifacts. There is no way to use whatever build system is in that package definition?
<iskarian>by artifacts, you mean whatever would usually go in /gnu/store/...-package-ver?
<sawshep>I suppose it could, iirc eshell has a unique configuration file similar to .bashrc. But emacs also has many packages that provide the functionality of the ncurses programs you might want to run within emacs.
<leoprikler>The_tubular: w.r.t. dotnet core, it's not in the main repo, because you can't bootstrap it. There might be packages for it out there, but you essentially have to treat it as a blob.
<leoprikler>if your app runs on mono alone however, it should work
<sawshep>Anyone know how to package rust applications? I'm having trouble understanding what packages to put in the inputs section to satisfy the Rust dependencies (also I'm bad at Scheme). I'll post a paste of what I have so far.
<sneek>wirez, nckx says: <software replaced by the user> Attempting to prevent users from installing their own software on their own hardware is sometimes called ‘tivoization’, and it's one of the things that the GPLv3 was made to prevent. See section 6. IANAL; ask your own lawyers to read the GPL to you.
<sneek>wirez, nckx says: Apart from ‘share your modifications to GPL software and derivatives’, this means: don't be an arsehole, don't try to be clever by (ab)using things like code signing. The GPL is quite clear on that. If you or others can update the software in any way (and almost every device does this nowadays), the user must be able to replace it with their own.
<jab>dstolfa: Yeah, I keep seeing more people on the mailing list talk about how it's really hard to get Guix System installed on their hardware. I figured, that I might as well install it on cheap old computers and sell it to 'em.
<dstolfa>heh, i never found guix difficult to get installed. i only bumped into one hardware support issue that i just resolved with an external adapter, but it sure would be nice to have more libre hardware out there
<nckx>char: Concerned? Is it fundamentally incompatible? Else I'd expect ‘someone’ to fix it once their favourite toy needs it.
<char>nckx: the current uglify-js package (used for minify-build-system) can handle "let" or encanced for-loop. both are considered very standard now. The strange thing is that the current uglify-js package is defined in gnu/packages/lisp-xyz.scm ??
<nckx>I'm not much of a fan of implementation-detail.scm either but it sometimes makes sense.
<nckx>Could it not (for certain values of) simply be updated to a newer version that supports let & friends? Or is upstream dead?
<nckx>And would be a plausible explanation for the current package's age.
<Guest92>nckx: Thank you! I don't see anything when launching nextcloud from the terminal.
<Guest92>nckx: Yes, that makes sense. Maybe I should check permissions or this keyring thing you mention. But I don't know where to start...
<char>If I update it though, the new uglify-js obviously wouldn't go in lisp-xyz, but then who knows where that is being imported. I wouldn't want to break things. Maybe just make a new package js-uglify-js
<Guest92>char: find: warning: ‘-name’ matches against basenames only, but the given pattern contains a directory separator (‘/’), thus the expression will evaluate to false all the time. Did you mean ‘-wholename’?
<GuixGuest>Hi there. I'm a bit confused with guix licensing. I'm dreaming about throwing away ugly docker files, apt install / yum install/chef/ansible, etc and replace it with one single tool - guix. In big enterprise. Of course there ARE software under closed-like licenses. Some companies share all their code, some not. However, big enterprise, while
<GuixGuest>achieving theirs' goals also can contribute back and improve the guix itself. It can improve popularity, enlarge the community, etc. If I have private projects is it legal to create my-private-channel.scm, make definitions of my private packages and keep it in my private repository? As result I will end up with multiple channels – guix official
<GuixGuest>and my proprietary one. So, I can contribute back to guix and continue work with my private packages in big enterprise. In other words all my modification of guix.git repo goes public, while my-private-packages.scm/my-private-os-definition.scm stays private.
<dstolfa>ixmpp: odd, usually what i do is just install the font as part of my manifest, and then i run fc-cache -rv
<dstolfa>GuixGuest: as pkill9 already said, yeah that sounds reasonable. the GPL doesn't require you to open source anything, it just requires that if you do distribute something to end-users that includes GPL'd code, you have to abide by what the GPL says
<GuixGuest>dstolfa, if I used guix as packaging tool and now I'm going to install my-private-tool to a customer should I open-source my package definition? or my-package? or nothing, because I used guix as is?
<GuixGuest>package definition as code means code (gpl protected) or not...
<GuixGuest>so, can I create my-channel.git repo under another license (company-private) and put my private definitions here?
<dstolfa>you don't have to open source anything, i'm no lawyer, but i think that the only thing that would be required to be free software as per the GPLv3 here is your package definition and any modifications made to guix itself, but the code of the package itself can remain whatever it is
<dstolfa>so, your package definition would download a tar.gz or something from somewhere, that could be under any license. however, the package definition itself i believe has to be GPLv3
<pkill9>which is better, <firstname><lastname>.name, or <firstname>-<lastname>.name?
<GuixGuest>dstolfa, so if I put definitions of package into my private repository, is this repository still must be under gplv3? It is clear for me, if I fork guix.git and make modifications - results in gplv3. But in my private repo with alone guix.scm with define-package? If it must be gplv3 anyway it looks like "no go" for an enterprise.
<char>dstolfa: I did fc-cache -rv again and it worked! ixmpp make sure you install the font that has the characters you need.
<char>GuixGuest: I'm also not a lawyer, but I don't need why your private repo needs to be gpl.
<char>Actaully, I just realized why: because you are going to be using (guix download) (guix build-system ...)
<nckx>GuixGuest: You should really consult your (or any reputable) lawyer on whether your repository is a derived work of GNU Guix. I say yes, it is, and must abide by the terms of the GPL3+, but maybe I'm wrong.
<char>Assuming it does have to be gpl, why is that a deal breaker?
<nckx>(So many licencing questions lately. Well, 2. I guess that's… good?)
<nckx>GuixGuest: I'm also confused why you say it's a ‘no go’.
<char>nckx: because guix is so epic, and imo, it seems some parts of it were designed specifically for enterprise cicd.
<katco>iskarian: your go patches look great! i will attempt to test/review on monday. i'm not a committer, so i can't give you an official +1, but i can lyk what i see. thanks for the patch!
<GuixGuest>char, it is important, because, in my case, I'm trying to "sell" new tool to our dev-department, I'm offering all to go against the stream (docker/ansible/k8s/packer/podman/rhel/centos), use "hard-to-quickstart" tool, force dev/devops to learn scheme, refactor ci/cd, etc. With no clear benefits. Honestly speaking, not benefits, but law risks or
<GuixGuest>security risks. Our sec department will not be happy if we open-source our package building code with all resources, urls, etc. Some code must be closed, strongly on-prem, etc.
<GuixGuest>even link to private unaccessible git repo may be not allowed in public
<nckx>So *your* enterprise, not *an* enterprise. Still my heartfelt commiserations ☹
<char>gpl doesn't mean you have to make code public on the internet.
<nckx>Only if you're handing out modified binaries to people based on (original or modified) GPL'd source code.
<nckx>It's true that you don't have to put it on a public server, but you do have to give copies to anyone who receives such a binary from you and asks for the source, so ‘a public git repo’ is simply the easiest way for most orgs to comply.
<GuixGuest>thanks for your answers. Need some time to think about.. and probably ask company lawyer explicitly..
<nckx>Yes, I strongly recommend that, since unfortunately it's not your decision to make. The company lawyer(s) may be excellent, or they may be ignorant, it doesn't really matter if their ‘no’ is final :-/
<char>thinking gpl code has to be public is a common misconception that your company lawyers might also hold saddly.
<nckx>Anyway, it all hinges on how ‘based on’ in my previous comment is interpreted. If your lawyers say your proprietary-garbage.scm that imports Guix & Guile modules and only does meaningful things when fed to GNU Guix running only on GNU Guile is not ‘based on’ either, well, you wouldn't have to distribute any of your custom code. Again, I think it's not correct, but nor am I a judge.
<GuixGuest>I see guix is really really underestimated, it IS the silver bullet in packaging, can't wait times it widely used in enterprise (like k8s)
<nckx>(They could try to argue that Guix is a ‘system library’, but honestly: if management like Guix, and don't like the GPL, it's far more likely they'll Do A Violation than bother with excuses. That's the sad truth.)
<nckx>GuixGuest: Thank you for the kind words; as a token of gratitude I shall shut up.
<nckx>(One more: there are orgs like the SFC and (ostensibly) the FSF that can better help you with the hard legal questions. They might take long to answer but their answers will be better informed.)
<nckx>If you submit a patch updating uglify-js by 6 years to the latest ES6 version that actually works and allows Guix JS packaging to leap forward, the villagers will be so grateful you can probably put it in char.scm if you'd want.
<nckx>I mean, don't, but it would be a luxurious problem to have ☺
<boeg>I chose xfce when I installed guix with the graphical installer. If I want to try out gnome3, kde, or something like that, how would I do that, so they are available alongside xfce in GDM login screen? Is it explained somewhere in the manual? I looked but maybe not hard enough?
<TheAsdfMan>Hi, I'm trying to build a custom kernel, but i can't get it to boot the file-systems service fails to start then the rest of the services fail to start aswell, What i want to know is how do i debug this i want to know at which step the file-systems service failed, is there a log stored somewhere?
<char>I'm getting a strange error with -L option. If I do guix build -L ~/guix/gnu/packages ... for every package file, it gives warning failed to load <insert-package-here>... hint: file should start with (define-module (<insert-package-here>)). Each one does start with that (after a bunch of comments). Should I report a bug?
<iskarian>regarding those legal questions: perhaps it would be in guix's best interest to eventually have a page or FAQ addressing them? "we are not lawyers or your lawyer, but here's what we think is likely okay and not okay to do with guix ..."
<char>iskarian: I would appreciate that. It would be simmilar to the very help page about gpl license, but specific to guix.
<iskarian>It's like "call for a quote": most people are just going to move on because they want to have an idea if it's even in their ballpark before they spend effort on it
<nckx>The_tubular: The (free) CDDL is incompatible with the (free) GPL2 in that you can't *distribute* combined binaries. There's no restriction on building or using them, however, so it's fine to include.
<nckx>s/building or using them/building or using them together/, for added precision.
***iskarian is now known as Guest4466
<boeg>Can I add xorg configuration - like configuration you'd normally add to files in /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d - via my guix config? I have a set-xorg-configuration block where i set the keyboard-layout. Can I there also add other random configuration? Like i want to add something like Section "InputClass" ... EndSection ?
<mekeor[m]>boeg: afaics in the manual, there is an "extra-config" field/parameter just at the same spot as "keyboard-layout"
<boeg>mekeor[m]: right, i was not sure if that was for such stuff. Ill give it a try
<raghavgururajan>danialbehzadi[m]: Thank you and congrats on your first contribution. :)
<dstolfa>seems like you may have to modify GEM_PATH to include your GEM_HOME too if it doesn't by default
<dstolfa>at least according to the trustworthy internets
<sawshep>Hmm, so I progressed further with `rails new my-site` when I had $GEM_HOME set to ~/.guix-profile/lib/ruby/vendor_ruby/gems, but now it complains it can't find rails in my gem sources. I'll experiment with changing my $GEM_PATH too.
<sawshep>ok, so it still complains about read-only filesystems when I properly set my GEM_HOME and GEM_PATH.
<char>What is suggested way to test packages new packages before they are upstream? guix pull ~/guix ?
<dstolfa>char: you can use ./pre-inst-env guix to do it, or if you prefer, you can set up a channel to your local git repository with your changes and use `guix pull --disable-authentication` and then just use guix
<bricewge>Reventlov: It works well to specify a channel in your operating-system but it need some changes before being submitted
<zacchae[m]>I'm migrating my old emacs config to my guix machine. Is there anything guix specific I need to worry about? For instance, if my config installs a package, but then I install the same one through guix, how does package loading get resolved?
<char>dstolfa: If I add it as a channel, how does it know what to do with all the duplated packages?
<dstolfa>sorry, i meant replace guix's channel from savannah to your local repository :)