<rekado_>derivations, for example, are pretty-printed with guix-derivation.el <apfel>hm, yea, i moved .emacs.d out of the way and suddenly it does not work anymore. So it is something i installed. Thanks anyway <rekado_>there’s also guix-pretty-print-buffer (part of guix-utils.el) <apfel>probably a good moment to install my emacs packages via guix instead of the builtin package manager <ixmpp>civodul: wip-ipfs-substitutes - what status did you leave this branch in? And is there a chance you might rebase it? <ixmpp>I sent feelers on the mailing list and they were lovingly ignored <ixmpp>If it's functional, i want to try using it. If not, i'd see if i can get it fuctional myself. <char>hello, how does one make a dynamic library available for a package? I have it as an input, but when I build the package, it can't find the .so file. <ixmpp>Im pessimistically assuming the latter, since if it was functional i dont know why you wouldnt merge it <iskarian>char: you mean it is unable to find it at build time? And I presume you mean you have as an input a package whose output contains the .so, yes? <char>yes and yes. when I enter the packages environment, the .so exists, but not in $LD_LIBRARY_PATH <civodul>the (guix ipfs) module was merged, but for other reasons <civodul>not on my list right now, but anyone's welcome to give it a spin :-) <iskarian>char: I could be wrong, but I think at build time you would want it in LIBRARY_PATH, not LD_LIBRARY_PATH <iskarian>that is odd though; the build system should take care of that if one of your inputs' outputs contains "lib/*.so" <char>iskarian: I think you are on to something because LIBRARY_PATH does contain the .so I'm looking for. <iskarian>ah, then the most likely culprit is your package's build system doing something weird. You could try manually setting LD_LIBRARY_PATH before building <wirez>so after a day of reading im gonna try guix <wirez>is it acceptable to make a proprietary for-profit site that runs on guix? always used mit/bsd <wirez>i need atleast some regular income to buy food and stuff so i can put more time into FOSS <pkill9>does anyone run guix on pinephone? <pkill9>preferably as a system, but as a package manager is interesting also <char>pkill9: someone has, but I haven't tried it yet. There was a reddit post about it. <char>wirez: I'm not a lawyer, but I would think it is okay since if you were to distribute your proprietary site it would not include guix. It just happens to be running on it. <wirez>pkill9: i wanna run guix on pinephone too. the reproducibility is a killer feature for power tuning! <wirez>do ppl in the community frown on running proprietary/for-profit site? <pkill9>also the atomic upgrades is a kliler feature like it is for laptop <wirez>you get a pinephone config made, power profile it, then make sure your pinephone only runs configs that you know are power efficient <pkill9>that said i cancelled my pinephone order, it doesn't meet my needs <wirez>no misconfig that causes some disk i/o in a loop that drains it slipping through <pkill9>nothing, i'm just gonna keep using my phone <char>wirez: I think it would be preferable to run a non-proprietary for-profit site if possible. <char>iskarian: I believe the problem is that dlopen is not installed and I don't know what package it is a part of. <char>iskarian: I think the problem is that I don't have dlopen installed and I don't know what package it is a part of. <iskarian>char: is this dynamic library used to actually run the build process (or otherwise needs to actually be dynamically loaded by the build process), or is it supposed to be linked into the program? <pkill9>i dunno whether I should get it as an expensive toy <char>iskarian: I believe it is required at run time. so linked. <wirez>if you buy it get the more expensive unit with more ram. 3GB <pkill9>yea that's the only one that's in stock <iskarian>char: then there's no reason to be messing with dlopen, etc. On Guix gcc's ld is wrapped so that "-Wl,-runpath=libdir" is added for each dynamic library you're linking against <iskarian>so as long as it is provided as a -L argument to gcc in the build process, it *should* work <char>iskarian: it is being used as a foreign library, so not gcc. <ecbrown>hello, which guix package provides `lpr' ? <iskarian>char: I'm not sure what you mean by foreign library. What is the build system? <char>iskarian: asdf-build-system/sbcl <ecbrown>drakonis: maybe i need to install that package and more than the service <ecbrown>i installed cups-service but not the package with lpr, lpq, etc *ecbrown got a new postscript printer today <char>ecbrown: does cups-minimal work? <ecbrown>char: i didn't try the minimal package, its probably in there, too <ecbrown>cool, thanks. printing from emacs for the first time in forever <iskarian>char: unfortunately I know next to nothing about how asdf builds. So I'm not sure if there's a proper way... If you can bake-in the directory for the library, and directory load it with that, that would be preferable. <iskarian>If it does use dlopen, and it produces an elf, and there is no built-in way to set the runpath, you can use `patchelf --set-rpath` <iskarian>ah, there's actually a convenience method AUGMENT-RPATH in (guix build rpath) <iskarian>though I don't actually see it used anywhere in guix... <char>I don't see that in the manual <iskarian>nope, it's not. there's likely a better way to do this, then, but I haven't a clue what it is <Guest52>Which DM and DE/WM would you recommend on Guix System. I currently use GDM+Gnome, but it's riddled with bugs and graphical glitches and I would like a more lightweight alternative. <iskarian>I just run slim + xfce, nothing fancy :) there's still the occasional missing icon, though <iskarian>I'm not sure how it is for running on actual hardware, though (like network support etc) -- it's just a VM <ecbrown>Guest52: sddm + gnome (when local) + xfce (vnc) <Guest52>iskarian: xfce is great. I might try slim too. Thanks for the suggestion. <iskarian>KDE Plasma is beautiful but lightweight? hahahaha <iskarian>Is there a better way to troubleshoot circular package dependencies than manual inspection...? <Guest52>Is there a reason why lightdm hasn't been packaged yet? <The_tubular>This is a very random question, but is there popular packages that rely on bash script ? <ecbrown>The_tubular: i think bash is the default shell <ecbrown>i dont know, maybe you can chsh everything and get away with it <ecbrown>imo bash is the best shell for guix, i have seen weird behaviors with zsh <ecbrown>just keep it and buy me a beer at the next guix conferecne <The_tubular>I mean if bash isn't needed I don't see why I'd keep it <ecbrown>well, if you can delete it from certain profiles and contexts go for it. i hestate to think what a bash-less gnu system looks like, unless you have ash or bourne or something <ecbrown>(i mean, don't go for it, but whatever, save 130k if it is bothering you) <The_tubular>What's the difference between guix pull and guix refresh ? <ecbrown>you can see what would be updated with guix pull, if you run guix refresh <The_tubular>Got it, so if I run guix pull, I don't have to run guix refresh..! <joch>Hi all, question. Where is the best place to define env variables like guix default $EDITOR on a foreign distro? <ixmpp>Wow, guix builds so fast on guix <ixmpp>It built like 200x slower on nix <ixmpp>Nvm that was just the modules ***orvi is now known as Guest3455
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<MysteriousSilver>tissevert: i had a metered connection so i was wondering if it was able to not remove needed packages <MysteriousSilver>but now that i am understand how a gc works, i feel that question was ill-phrased <tissevert>so I dunno ? ^^' transient error ? cache issue ? both ? <wirez>anyone using guix for serving high traffic sites? curious how stable and stuff it's been <tissevert>raghavgururajan: thanks for the tip, your magic seemed to have solved it somehow <tissevert>MysteriousSilver: not ill-phrased, but yeah, kind of wanting to know how you can hammer a nail with a screwdriver <tissevert>but I think in the use-case of such a connection, you could indeed «pin» the needed packages to a gc root <raghavgururajan>> MysteriousSilver: how do i run guix gc without deleting important packages like curl gcc etc? <raghavgururajan>guix gc doesn't add or remove package in your profile. It cleans up unused/dead store items. If curl is in your current default profile, it stays there even after `guix gc`. <tissevert>although then anyway they'll have to be updated somehow… <raghavgururajan>> tissevert: raghavgururajan: thanks for the tip, your magic seemed to have solved it somehow *raghavgururajan 's witchcraft worked 🤷♂️️ <raghavgururajan>> MysteriousSilver: but i am not aware which packages should be pinned <solene>is there some work to provide a recent Go version? It seems we are limited for many programs by the old Go available in packages <wirez>there's a degoogled chromium i hear <wirez>raghavgururajan: guix users rely on magic for the system to work? that doesn't sound good <Guest18>wirez: When you say "i hear" do you mean you don't use it? <Guest18>So, you don't use a browser on Guix? <tissevert>wirez: not all users, only me (and it wasn't my system, it was the substitutes server, so everything's fine ; ) <Guest18>I have just installed ungoogled-chromium and icecat <Guest18>how do you start ungoogled-chromium? I don't know how to run it. <tissevert>Guest18: or, if it's installed in your profile or your system before starting your desktop environment / window manager whatever you use for graphical session, there should be a .desktop file providing an entry in the launch menu you use <Guest18>tissevert: Cannot find that. I use i3. But anyway, typing chromium in the launcher works. <tissevert>yeah, welle i3 has a launcher more or less similar to dmenu or such stuff <tissevert>that probably either look in your path or in the applications in share/ <Guest18>Yes, I think I read it uses that dmenu thing. <tissevert>that's great ! how are you liking it so far ? <Guest18>So far hoping that everything works, as I find it promising, but I don't know how mature it is or how difficult it is for a non expert person like me <Guest18>I have a problem: my displayport connection to my second monitor is not recognised <Guest18>It works ok with Trisquel, so I guess it should work with Guix <Guest18>xrandr does not show my displayport connected second monitor, it only shows my own laptop screen <tissevert>I'm totally non-expert too, and I've managed to use it for 4 months now : ) <tissevert>but I haven't had any issue with external monitors or anything <Guest18>Is it your everyday desktop computer? <tissevert>more or less : it's my work computer (PhD. Thesis because reproducibility and all that), so definitely everyday and clearly the machine I've spent most of my time on since february <tissevert>but it's not yet on my personal machine, which I dearly miss (it's running an Arch variant at the moment) <tissevert>my opinion so far is that it's really amazing to handle packages, and to provide your own exactly on the same level as «official» packages, which is great <tissevert>it provides me with a great environment for haskell, python development <tissevert>I still haven't had the time to understand what was wrong with ibus and to fix input methods which I need installed on a system to feel at home, and that's possibly the only reason why I haven't found two hours on a weekend to put it to my personal computer <tissevert>but apart from that I really look forward to making the change for my own box <tissevert>and although I tend to separate strictly my professional and personal lives and not use the lab's laptop for personal projects, I noticed it was becoming harder and harder, because I'm starting to feel more comfortable on Guix <Guest18>I'm not a developer, so I'm not sure if I'll stay. If things get very much difficult I will come back to easy Trisquel. <tissevert>yeah, you'll see, there's always that possibility <tissevert>personally I was surprised how little administration there was to do to keep the box clean <tissevert>there are a couple new concepts to learn but they don't translate to a lot of things to do <ecbrown>Guest18: there's no shame in using guix to provide packages where e.g. trisquel is a little stale <ecbrown>i.e. one doesn't need to go all "devops" <Guest18>I'm also interested in the container thing <Guest18>I wanted to try docker, but I did not like the idea of blind trusting binaries <ecbrown>imo guix stomps docker for that reason and others <Guest18>If I manage to make myself comfortable in Guix, then one day I will investigate this container thing <ecbrown>Guest18: guix is a manifestation of the gnu vision of a scheme-orchestrated system <ecbrown>there's some philosophy here in addition to technical features <ecbrown>(i'm appealing to the reasons you may have chosen trisquel :-) <ecbrown>on my to-do list is to investigate tarballs as a means to distribute packages (q.v. ludo's blog post) <ecbrown>^-- reference to Guest18's interest in containerization types <tissevert>ecbrown: I so want to try that too and be able to distribute binaries for my programs <rekado>I’ve tried that and it works well enough :) <ecbrown>tissevert: would it basically to to rest many questions about dynamic/static linking? <rekado>if you want to upgrade the package on the target system *often* tarballs aren’t great <ecbrown>seems to be a point when i wouldn't care if its .a or .so <rekado>ecbrown: the tarball includes everything the package needs. The difference between .a and .so is build time vs run time. <tissevert>update ? no I'm speaking «binaries for people who can't understand how to properly use a computer and who won't upgrade their system anyway» <tissevert>ecbrown: didn't understand your question, sorry <ecbrown>my understanding is rekado is saying that a mega-tarball that changes frequently may be more time consuming than changing a little component <tissevert>yeah, which is the point of having packages and a proper distribution <ecbrown>tissevert: rekado answered it, no problem. my point was, whats the difference between a blob of *.so's and *.a's (dynamic/static linked libraries) if they are going to be stacked inside a self-contained tar <rekado>the difference is that the blob of .so’s is needed at runtime and the .a files just take up space <rekado>you only need them when building new stuff <rekado>but then you would also need a toolchain <rekado>so by themselves they are of no use in a self-contained tarball. <ecbrown>Guest18: one of the biggest problems i run into on e.g. trisquel is that it is hard to try out packages (e.g. explore) and then have a system that doesn't have a bunch of garbage after install. also, i compile code a lot where i really want a pure environment and i'm not sure how to achieve that on systems in different stages <ecbrown>for example, autoconf/automake on an "unrelated pacakge" will find packages and enable features on my debian laptop but not on the server <ecbrown>cuz laptop has a bunch of gui stuff and server is "headless" <apapsch>so in the end it was just a missing #:use-module (ice-9 match) d'oh! ***pie__bnc is now known as pie_
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*ecbrown completes mvp packages for dalton, openmolcas, and now python-pyscf libxc xcfun libcint <ecbrown>nice swathe of libre electronic structure theory programs <zimoun>MysteriousSilver: the package name is recutils :-) <ecbrown>wirez: my pleasure (sort of lol) i posted issues on the projects' home pages hoping to find testers <wirez>i havent started using guix yet but i hope to <wirez>do you know if it runs on mac minis? <ecbrown>but you have to know that i find emacs on a console to be an adequate computing experience ;-) <ecbrown>mac mini is a perfect headless server and linux-libre will probably give you what you want for that on this machine <ecbrown>(though i bought a new nuc for this purpose, even though i have a ton of apple equipment each running guix system) <wirez>can't wait to try guix im rock hard <wirez>really minimal desktop, then ofc nothing on servers <wirez>ya but its follow mouse behavior is garbage <wirez>ya but i do stuff that needs mouse, so it's around <wirez>i guess i could turn focus off <wirez>i guess that would force me to not rely on the broken follow mouse behavior and use kb only <ecbrown>so if you are going to install guix on that mini.... be ready with nomodeset nosplash in bios <ecbrown>i don't know if you have amd graphics or intel graphics which is why i am being paranoid <wirez>we can change mac mini bios? <ecbrown>right, otherwise it may switch on amd mode and lock up the computer <lambdanon>I've made sure i got the latest version of gcc-toolchain, so I've ruled that out <lambdanon>Going to update avr-toolchain and see if that improves matters <Guest18>When installing a program... where is its directory? <mekeor>Guest18: you can check with `which the_program_name` and `realpath $(which the_program_name)` <mekeor>what's the most convenient, straight-forward way to have a local, user-custom package declaration? a guix-channel? <ecbrown>mekeor: yes, but then you want to add authentication probably, that's a little trickey the first time <mekeor>ecbrown: can i use file:// as protocol in the ~/.config/guix/channels.scm? <ecbrown>i would kill for that to be ssh://. :-( <ecbrown>(and you may want to try file:/// i never have) <mekeor>ecbrown: in one of the mailing lists, someone got it to work with ssh:// afaik <Guest18>I installed icedove and I cannot manage to enter into the directory where all its files are. I want to locate my icedove profile but I only find links and get lost... <ecbrown>Guest18: i have icedove installed an there is a profiles file in ~/.icedove <ecbrown>i don't know if that's what you are looking for <lambdanon>Heya, anyone here managed to get Arduino sketches to compile on their guix system? <Guest18>I gues tor-client from the repository is ok ***euandreh_ is now known as euandreh
<Guest18>Can I install an old version of a program through Guix? <Guest18>If I want an old version of Icedove, like Icedove 68. Can I get it through Guix? <tissevert>you can even install several versions at once using different profiles <pkill9>Guest18: 'tor' for the repos, then point the ap;plication proxy to localhost:9050 <pkill9>or tor-client, if that works, haven't used it <Guest18>tissevert: But how can I access old versions? <tissevert>I'm realizing as I try to explain to do it that I haven't ever tried that for real and am completely unable to do so ^^' <tissevert>I suppose it involves guix time-machine somehow ? or writing a manifest for the package overriding the version ? <ecbrown>Guest18: the easiest way i know, until guix git search is implemented is to use an inferior to dial in to a guix commit that has it the way you want <tissevert>ok apparently guix time-machine --commit allows you to jump back to a previous version of the guix repository (?) <apteryx_>tissevert: Haven't tried myself too, but 'guix time-machine --commit=$past-guix-commit -- package -p /tmp/some-profile -i some-package should work <roptat>or forward to a future version ;) <ecbrown>Guest18: i do this for tigervnc-server, which i want pinned to 10.1 <roptat>it's a time machine after all :) <apteryx_>tissevert: alternatively you could use a manifest with inferiors ***apteryx_ is now known as apteryx
<tissevert>sounds like I?ll have to, it seems to come back into the conversation pretty often <Guest18>I'm a bit lost. So, what would be the steps to install icedove 68? <tissevert>apteryx: how to find the appropriate commit ? it seems tedious <ecbrown>Guest18: when you get a manifest file `my-tiger-vnc.scm' then you can call it in many contexts like --manifest=my-package.scm <tissevert>the best I have is : clone the repos, git log -S <apteryx>tissevert: it is, as there is currently no integrated way to query such info from Guix proper. The info should be in the Guix Data Service though. <ecbrown>Guest18: it turns out to be a kind of hefty operation the first time you do it because it believe it actually has to build everything up from that point you requested, and it may or may not have substitutes available! <ecbrown>i think there's an interest in searching through git lot to see when a package changed version <ecbrown>well, i'm thinking something like guix git search emacs 27.1 and it finds the commit where that was committed <ecbrown>i thnk maybe authroatitve way would be to search (version ..) field and that sounds like a job for `guix ...'. rather than grepping a git log <tissevert>is there already an implementation on that ? <ecbrown>i think yes, from an outreachy project. i think its getting staged ***podge is now known as patrick
<lambdanon>(Apologies for saying the same thing twice, I was also chatting with a discord server about the same thing) <ecbrown>there will be a small surcharge to your bill, thanks for understanding /mgmt <ecbrown>did you mean you got it working on arduino? <ecbrown>i have a couple in my cabinet and maybe i can try it <lambdanon>ecbrown: I've got the basic void setup () {} void loop () {} on the latest version of arduino <lambdanon>ecbrown: Unfortunately I specifically need arduino 1.0.x as it's what my 3D printer's firmware is built for, and apparently there's bugs in the c++ header files <lambdanon>Ah, figured out what's wrong -- I was launching my pre-workaround arduino 1.0.x <lambdanon>Now I'm getting a java.lang.NoSuchMethodError <tissevert>Guest18: in any case, it appears that commit b14aab6710555f2e94d8e846a07f507860879463 adds icedove, directly to version 68.8 <lambdanon>Fixed by cleaning and rebulding, now I'm back to the previous problem of errors in the header files <tissevert>but if that should work in guix time-machine <tissevert>wow that involves a lot of compilation ? my fans are spinning up <ecbrown>i think basically recreate guix at that point in time, so i expect it to take on the order of building guix source <tissevert>(I only performed a guix search through the time-machine but it appears it was needed to build guix-packages-base.drv) <ecbrown>it is the most brilliant test of disaster recovery ehvah <ecbrown>like, if you had to go it alone without ci.guix.gnu.org <tissevert>ok I'm reading about inferiors and I don't really understand where they come in : it looks like a piece of tapeduct needed to access a channel ? or does it add something I missed ? isn't it possible in guix to access a package in specific channel like I don't know what syntax it would have but, say, my-channel->package "hello" ? <tissevert>but I mean, is that what «inferiors» are ? a piece of plumbing ? <ecbrown>that sounds metaphysical, i'm more of a hacker ;-) <tissevert>I don't usually like to cite nix as a comparison, but that's how I came in contact with store-based systems <tissevert>so I was assuming there was something similar in guix <tissevert>now, reading about inferiors makes me feel like there isn't <tissevert>and the workaround is precisely what inferiors are <ecbrown>i would point out the beneficial results of the outreachy programs whose artifacts are in blogs and in guix <ruffni>is it possible to build packages from ./pre-inst-env ? <roptat>ruffni, yes, ./pre-inst-env guix build foo <roptat>you can run any guix command like that, not just build <wirez>you can mentor ppl and get results without making it about skin color and buttholes <tissevert>wirez: yeah, I mean pretty much all of us are gay, right ? so how exactly could we become any more «diverse» ? <wirez>all Diversity(tm) means is buttholes and skin color <pushcx>wirez: have you tried not being a butthole? <ruffni>it fails to connect to the daemon-socket (i'm on a guix system) <tissevert>plus, we are already so many women here on the chan that I don't feel we could be more similar to what the actual society looks like <roptat>ruffni, mh... did you use different configure options than the recommended ones? (--localstatedir) <tissevert>Guest18: for what it's worth, here's the output of my attempt with guix time-machine, a search result showing icedove 68.8.0 <ruffni>no, none at all. only thing special is i'm on wip-simplified-packages <tissevert>from there it would be possible to install it, albeit as was said with a lot of compilation because there aren't any substitutes for the dependencies of this version so you'd end up recompiling everything yourself <roptat>wirez, we did participate in Gsoc until google kicked the fsf out (or was it gnu?), so outreachy is our only program left <wirez>too much Diversity(tm) even for google? imagine the smell <roptat>I don't think that was their reason ^^' <roptat>anyway, I think all the devs agree to say more diversity is always a good thing, I doubt you'll change our minds <ecbrown>wirez: i am sympathetic to your viewpoint and look forward to the goals of the french revolution in their asymptotic limit <wirez>not trying to change your "minds" <wirez>just weird to see ppl obsess over things that don't matter <wirez>i remember when the internet didn't have that problem. ppl were just what they typed, just their minds <tissevert>you seem to have a high opinion on everyone's tolerance <wirez>now even online, someone's chat messages need to be in the context of buttholes and skin color <tissevert>ah, the good ol' times, when we were all only young white dudes chilling out, no one was different back then <tissevert>wirez: I'd love to know what you mean exactly by «buttholes» <wirez>weird that you project white onto it, like a racist faggot would <ruffni>wirez: i think the issue is more into lowering entry-barriers. the internet *is* just what you type, but funnily enough it's still mostly white male professionals. i'm not sure whether this kind of program really adreesses the root of the issue <roptat>it certainly helps, at least we hope so <ruffni>you're mostly characters on a screen *ecbrown calmly recalls the gnu proper etiquettes for gnu communications <wirez>nah, not with diversity being your main goal. like, that's not even engineering <tissevert>roptat: I don't know if it helps, but in any case, the point being discussed wasn't the means but the aim <wirez>im no longer wirez, i'm black wirez <tissevert>wirez: no, not to every one, only to «racist faggot» me <roptat>wirez, I think that's the misunderstanding: guix is not only engineering, it's also a political project, given it's part of the free software movement and everything <wirez>so when i start contributing code, im not just a contributor, i'm a checkbox of diversity because you don't want code, you want code from $skincolor <dstolfa>is anyone having an issue with ungoogled-chromium where after an update (not sure if it's guix system reconfigure or if it's guix package -u), all the stuff i was logged into just logs me out <dstolfa>i assume it's something to do with cookies... though not sure what <roptat>if you contribute code, we don't care about your skin color <wirez>political is easy to get wrong and that's why it's dangerous and here's the example. if your politics were only software freedom, you exclude noone. but yoyu make it about diversity, now you exclude everyone that's smart <wirez>roptat: your messaging isn't consistent. you can't have it both ways <roptat>no, it's about including people who usually don't even get a chance <wirez>either merit is the goal, or diversity <wirez>merit is the individual, diversity dehumanizes the individual into the group <tissevert>wirez: honestly I appreciate this discussion, and I would really like to understand your point of view better, this is not irony: how exactly is diversity excluding «everyone that's smart» ? <tissevert>but the society with all its biases already dehumanizes a lot of us <wirez>because it's transparently a joke of itself that anyone smart would not take it seriously, or projects making it their goal. because it's saying merit comes from diversity, like skin color, so some skin color is better than another? <wirez>that's a rude PoV, instead of saying the better code is better <pushcx>weird how this guy read a six-month old blog post and then raced here to pick a fight and throw out some slurs which is a totally normal thing that normal people who want to contribute to projects do all the time <wirez>raced here? been here for a day or two already liar <wirez>been reading everything i can find on guix. loved everything till this <wirez>i might still use guix but noway will i contribute ever <tissevert>now, maybe now would as good a time as 15:44:14 to remind everyone, like ecbrown did, that the etiquette matters <tissevert>especially when discussing sensitive issues like this one <roptat>wirez, I do understand it would be rude (and racist) to treat individuals according to their skin color, but I don't understand why you would say guix cares about your skin color, personally <wirez>pushcx obviously mischaracterizing me. it's plain as day ignore it if yoyu want <tissevert>and, by taking the time to take part in this conversation, deserves respect <wirez>Diversity(tm) = buttholes and skin color <roptat>well, please explain that equation, I don't understand <wirez>it's like yoyu're not even trying to be honest, playing a child. as if yoyu don't know everything associated with that word for the past 10 years has been sexuality and race <wirez>before that it was things like ecology *ecbrown notes that the sometimes infinite recursion is *undesirable* <wirez>diversity used to be a term ppl would associate with things like ecology. for the past decade it's been twisted into an obsession on race and sexuality <wirez>wake up buddy, try to see the obvious point <ruffni>wirez: but you see, "has diversity in it" is not the same as using the entire word. and also: words change meaning. pretty much all of them, pretty much throughout history. it's how language works: by adapting to contexts <wirez>man you are totally incapable of seeing outside of yourself <wirez>what a weird zombie sodomite horde this actually feels like <roptat>oh well, good riddance I suppose <tissevert>«ah, those Social Justice Warriors who can't hear anyone disagreeing with them and can't talk» <MysteriousSilver>installed emacs-guix, The command fails at the `Starting Guix REPL` part, am i missing any dependencies? <tissevert>well, actually, it would appear it's just a matter of having numeric superiority <roptat>tissevert, yeah, it does feel like that sometimes *dstolfa isn't sure he wants to read the full backlog <boeg>how do I properly refer to an installed binary in the current system with a full path? Like what would on many other systems be /usr/bin/something, what is that in guix? Doesn't seem to be /usr/bin/something <apapsch>tissevert: yeah, seemed a lot like projecting <tissevert>and kinda sad but interesting at the same time <tissevert>boeg: no, the actual binaries are somewhere in `/gnu/store/` <boeg>yeah, but are they symlinked to a "normal" path or something? <dstolfa>well, to change topic... how do i get cinnamon to work in guix? <roptat>boeg, you have no way to know, although the system installed binaries can be found in /run/current-system/profile/bin <dstolfa>there's no cinnamon-desktop-service-type <boeg>roptat:, ecbrown alright, thanks <ecbrown>boeg: that's the most "friendly" "refrencecable" in the old unix way <roptat>boeg, and user-installed ones are in ~/.guix-profile <apapsch>I also had a question but almost forgot: is the address of the ci.guix.gnu.org record stable? <boeg>alright. So in my specific case, I need to tell gpg-agent where to find the pinentry-gtk-2. Would you set it to ~/.guix-profile/bin/pinentry-gtk-2 then? <ruffni>why is my `./pre-inst-env guix build foo` looking for the store-socket in /usr/local/var/guix/daemon-socket/socket ? <ruffni>i get a "No such file.." error and yes; that's not where the store socket is! <tissevert>sounds like a bad or missing --localstatedir in ./configure, doesn't it ? <ruffni>do i have to set that explicitly? <apapsch>should be good enough for the average php application and is easily integrated in operating-system <MysteriousSilver>does installing guix in user-profile make any difference? (guix package -i guix) <roptat>MysteriousSilver, you should never do that <tricon>apapsch: Oh snapzilla, thanks for this. <apapsch>roptat: seems like an easy foot cannon :-) <roptat>the guix package you're installing in the user profile is always older than the guix you pulled, so if you use that, you're using an older one, and everytime you "upgrade" you're actually downgrading guix <roptat>that's the reason why there's a separate profile for guix pull <roptat>MysteriousSilver, oh, in that case I think it's ok, but still dangerous, you need to make extra sure you're not using the guix from that user profile <vivien>It’s safe to do that, if ~/.config/guix/current/bin comes before ~/.guix-profile/bin <roptat>(and that you have pulled guix at least once) <MysteriousSilver>uhh, "$HOME/.config/guix/current" gets sourced first followed by "$HOME/.guix-profile" <boeg>raghavgururajan: good to know, thanks 👌 <vivien>MysteriousSilver, also make sure that both are sourced in ~/.profile or ~/.bash_profile and not ~/.bashrc, and if you modify something, don’t forget to log out and back in again. Running "which guix" should give you /home/<you>/.config/guix/current/bin/guix <roptat>vivien, MysteriousSilver better run "type guix", to make extra sure what your terminal really thinks <tissevert>raghavgururajan: thanks for sharing ! I had no idea it could be that simple to create a service <vivien>I’ve never understood what "hash guix" means by the way <roptat>it clears your shell's cache of locations <roptat>so, if you never pulled guix before, guix refers to, say, /run/current-system/profile/bin/guix <roptat>and that gets saved in bash, but after "guix pull", which knows it's in ~/.config/guix/... but bash still has its cache, so "guix upgrade" will still use the one in /run <roptat>"hash" clears the whole cache, "hash guix" clears the entry for guix in that cache <roptat>I don't know much about nixos, but if that generates your .profile or .bash_profile, that looks fine <roptat>then that's fine, but maybe you want to use the same code as guix system <roptat>of course you can ignore /run/current-system <roptat>all of them, /run/current-system is a guix thing <roptat>like in "export MANPATH=$HOME/.guix-profile/share/man:/run/current-system/profile/share/man", you probably want to keep only "export MANPATH=$HOME/.guix-profile/share/man" <roptat>you can ignore # Load the system profile's settings <roptat>there's a trick with variables to, in case they're empty, you don't want to have a trailing : <roptat>you'd use ${PATH:+:}$PATH instead of only $PATH <roptat>did you replace the whole /etc/profile? I thought nix would put its own stuff there too? <roptat>weird, did you copy the "unset PATH" line maybe? *MysteriousSilver feels dumb <roptat>I think so, but only for one user <roptat>if you plan to use guix as root, you'll need the same kind of code loaded in your profile <roptat>it's probably easier to stick all of that in /etc/profile in that case <roptat>yes, your user profile is not shared with root, they're separate users for guix <roptat>if you want a package for root and your user, you need to install it both as root and as user <ruffni>or system-wide (thorugh sys config and `guix reconfigure`) <roptat>no, it wouldn't be accessible to other users <roptat>well, if you have only one user, it doesn't matter I guess <roptat>ah, and you'll get duplicates when logging in as anon <ruffni>has anyone here installed packages in octave (via `pkg install -forge foo`)? *ruffni wonder whether that needs special dependencies and whether they should be added to the package <jsoo>has anyone had problems using yasnippets snippets from a snippets directory installed via guix? <TheAsdfMan>Hello, How can i make a virtual service that provides wpa-supplicant, because any networking service requires it, and i don't want it <roptat>TheAsdfMan, sorry, I don't understand the question. You want a service that provides wpa-supplicant because you don't want it? <TheAsdfMan>roptat: a virtual service, it doesn't run wpa-supplicant just says that it provides it <roptat>then add (service fake-wpa-supplicant-service-type) to the list of services ***Server sets mode: +Ccntz
<ixmpp>What say you folk to having a /gnu/ipfs path. Does that violate any scriptures? <ixmpp>Im thinking i'll dust off and fixup the ipfs substitution branch, and make it use ipfs filestore instead, with an ipfs daemon sat in /gnu (so filestore can use reflinks etc) and doesnt interfere with a normal daemon <ixmpp>That makes `ipfs add` crazy fast, and the ipfs repo next to nothing in size, cause all data is deduped (safe because /gnu/store is immutable) <ixmpp>Then for substitution, the /gnu/ipfs daemon can fetch, and since it's guaranteed to be on the same FS as /gnu/store, that move is instantaneous too <ixmpp>Already rebased the branch but it seems to me like this approach would be smarter <ixmpp>I feel like i have to ask on that path, since i imagine if i succeed at this it would end up potentially upstream, but that is pretty essential to the functioning <TheAsdfMan>After editing the service a bit i got it working! thanks roptat! *vagrantc wonders how de-duplication works with hardlinks that are also available outside of the read-only part of the store ... <vagrantc>e.g. /gnu/writeable/FILE is a hardlink to /gnu/store/abcde1234...-FILE ... can you write to /gnu/writeable/FILE ? <vagrantc>and will the read-only part ... somehow notice and not break the hardlink ? <ixmpp>vagrantc: Any modification breaks the hardlink <ixmpp>(Depending on fs and type of modification, there might still be some block-level dedup within the file?) <apapsch>which makes sense both links point to the same inode and the permissions are stored for the inode, no? <ixmpp>I suppose that's the specific difference between hardlink and reflink <ixmpp>Reflink mirrors the data, hardlink mirrors the entire file, but in both cases modifying one will break the link <ixmpp>And root can modify anything ;) <soheilkhanalipur>How can I completely remove/purge a package like Ungoogled-Chromium in Guix? <civodul>ixmpp: re IPFS, i don't know! if this sounds good to you, why not <ruffni>soheilkhanalipur: what do you mean exactly? for the system? for your profile? for every profile? <ruffni>do you want the executable files removed? <ruffni>that's not that easy, i think :) you can delete the reference from your /etc/config.scm and reconfigure the system. but then you'd still have to `guix remove` it from every profile. and if you want the files removed, you will then have to `guix gc`.... <dstolfa>there's also generations that contain it <dstolfa>so you'd have to remove all the generations <dstolfa>for all intents and purposes, `guix remove` is probably sufficient <dstolfa>i guess you can just use `guix package -d` <raghavgururajan>sneek, later tell bavier[m]: Congratulations on getting the commit access. :) <ixmpp>Im confused what grafts are again tbh. I thought it was package-rewriting-inputs that generates them, but i'm told that does the replace before build, not after <roptat>input rewriting happens before the build, grafts happen afterwards, using replacements <ixmpp>I think i just forgot how grafts work cause i've not used them yet <ixmpp>It's the replacement field in package, right? <roptat>basically, it rewrites a package output by substituting a reference to a package, by a reference to the replacement of that package <ixmpp>Right, yeah i'd just forgot and confused the concepts <Guest40>guix seems fun, I'm using it along side packman <Guest40>For some reason all the zsh completions for programs i install with guix are broken <Guest40>I get an error message like "function definition file not found" <rekado>Guest40: do you have a reproducible recipe that we could try? <ixmpp>Guest40: likely need to tell zsh where the completions are, in your guix profile <Guest40>I see bash_completion.d and fish but i dont seem to have zsh <Guest40>Is there a way of telling guix to maintain zsh completions too? <roptat>that would depend on the packages, no? <roptat>or do you mean completion for guix commands? <Guest40>well both would be nice but I mean the former. does guix not keep track of things like completion files <roptat>like the completions.d directory you find is there only because some packages define a completion file for bash, but guix itself has no notion of completion <Guest40>so what is the normal solution to this? Should I manually maintain zsh completions, or some how modify the packages <Guest40>also im confused as to why its looking for completion if one didnt get set up. I would have thought a program with out any configured completion would just not have compleation rather then produce an error saying it has no completion <ixmpp>Like i said, just tell zsh where the guix completions are <ixmpp>Theyll be in ~/.guix-profile/etc/zsh or something <ixmpp>Zsh isnt gonna look there by default <ft>you make it by adding that directory to $fpath, before calling ‘compinit’ <sneek>bavier[m], you have 1 message! <sneek>bavier[m], raghavgururajan says: Congratulations on getting the commit access. :) <ft>fpath=( "$HOME/.guix-profile/share/zsh/$ZSH_VERSION/functions" "${fpath[@]}" ) <ft>That will override the functions that come with arch's zsh though. Flip the order of the arguments in the array to make the ones from guix's zsh to be a fallback. <ft>Wait. You just want _guix? Forget what I said then. :) <ft>fpath=( "$HOME/.guix-profile/share/zsh/site-functions" "${fpath[@]}" ) <Guest40>no i wanted normal completion for most packages not just guix <ft>Are you using guix's zsh or the one from arch? <drakonis>Guest40: ah right you had written packman, it is the name of a opensuse repo <Guest40>so this fpath thing tells zsh were to look for completions, but i still need to get completion files for all these programs some how <ft>I just checked. Guix's zsh sets $fpath correctly. It contains /gnu/store/2hsg15n644f0glrcbkb1kqknmmqdar03-zsh-5.8/share/zsh/5.8/functions on this system, which has all the completion functions. <Guest40>okay so iv I install zsh with guix instead of pacman then it will set up completions <ft>I don't quite understand what's not working. Arch's zsh should work irregardless of guix. <ixmpp>Guest40: im not sure thats true either <ft>Is this about the programs installed via guix not being available in arch's zsh? And not about completion? <Guest40>so /bin/zsh is my log in shell so i would need to some how set it to be $home/.guix-profile/bin/zsh <drakonis>the actual question is, what are you trying to get completion for? <Guest40>but if i hit tab it gives me an error (eval):1: _youtube-dl: function definition file not found <Guest40>i also had this problem with zathura <ft>restart zsh via: exec zsh <ixmpp>This is why i dont like multiple package managers <ft>Sounds like an invalid completion cache. <ixmpp>But i do think setting your login shell to something not managed by your system package manager is a mistake <Guest40>okay rm ~/.zcompdump and restarting zsh (in different tty) didnt help <Guest40>I wanted to get used to guix as a second package manager and then hopefully transition to guix propper <ft>I can switch between guix's zsh and debian's on my machine and it keeps working. :) <drakonis>ft: i think vagrant made sure guix worked fine on debian <drakonis>hm, no patches here related to shell things <ft>But I second ixmpp's point about non-system maintained login shells. <ft>drakonis: I'm not using his package on this machine. I only learned about it a week or so ago. <Guest40>okay so if i install youtube-dl both with pacman and guix then its the guix version that gets run but pacman provides the zsh completions for it <ft>Guest40: youtube-dl brings its own completion, I guess? <ft>Probably so. In that case you'd have to tell guix's zsh the path where the pacman package installs the additional completion file. <ft>I would know the path on debian, but not on arch. <ft>(On debian its /usr/share/zsh/vendor-completions - which is where the zsh package asks all other package maintainers to install their add-on completions to) <Guest40>i belive its /usr/share/zsh/site-functions <roptat>ah, maybe guix and arch have a different zsh version? <ft>Guest40: print ${^fpath}/_youtube-dl(N) <Guest40>here is what I can tell; when I uninstall a program with pacman, the relevant _completion file are removed, and those files dont seem to be being provided when guix installes that package <Guest40>so is that becuase there not in the guix packages or becuase its putting them somewere that zsh isnt looking <ft>vagrantc: Speaking of the debian package (awesome stuff! It'll give me guix at work as soon as we're upgrading to the upcoming stable): What's the intended way to make use of an updated guix-daemon from the system profile? :) <Guest40>whos responsible for completion files? is it zsh, the package manager or the packages?\ <vagrantc>ft: there is no system profile on a foreign distro <ft>Guest40: Zsh provides a *ton* of completions on its own. Like git and tmux and stuff like that. Some packages provide addional completions. <vagrantc>ft: you can of course build a profile somewhere and point systemd/sysvinit/openrc or whatever to use that guix-daemon instead of the provided one <leoprikler>w.r.t. zsh, Guix doesn't handle those, you have to add Guix' directories to your .zprofile <leoprikler>ideally at least Guix zsh would honor some environment variables, but ya can't have everything <ft>vagrantc: I suppose the one associated with the root user. On a test install I added a modified guix-daemon.service at /etc/systemd/system — which works. <vagrantc>ft: i touch on this in the README.Debian shipped in the guix .deb package <ft>vagrantc: Ouch. I may have missed that. *whistle* :) <vagrantc>ft: though notably it just says it uses the /usr/bin/guix-* ... doesn't mention if you might want to do things differently <vagrantc>ft: anyways, hope it works for you. can't say it's terribly well tested at this point. <vagrantc>we'll see how well it works out sticking with an old guix-daemon in the long-term :) <ft>vagrantc: It works well on a test system that I installed the other day. :) <vagrantc>ft: if you used _guixbuild instead, you wouldn't have to manually create that group <ft>vagrantc: ach... crap I pasted the wrong file. <ft>That's the one from the system that doesn't use the package. <ft>On the other it's a copy of yours that just replaces ExecStart and Environment. Sorry about the confusion. <ft>vagrantc: Anyway. Thanks for doing that work! :) <iskarian>for bugs I found with a quick fix, should I first submit a bug and then a patch (in reply to? to guix-patches but referencing the bug?) or just send the patch to guix-patches? <drakonis>hmm, do patches get applied to older release branches or is the focus on following mainline? <Guest79>When I run the starter it tells me "Wrong architecture? 32-bit vs. 64-bit." <Guest79>My computer is 64bit and I downloaded the 64 bit version of the Tor Browser <Guest79>Any suggestion on how to have the Tor Browser installed? <vagrantc>drakonis: usually just on master (or staging, or core-updates, depending on the number of rebuilds) ... unless i'm misunderstanding you? <drakonis>is there a situation where a patch gets backported to any of the release branches? <vagrantc>Guest79: generally downloading arbitrary software doesn't work on guix, as it doesn't have system libraries in places they expect <drakonis>ie: 1.2.0 and 1.3.0 received patches for CI last week <vagrantc>drakonis: ah, i would be interested to know the logic of that too :) <Guest79>vagrantc: Ooooh, I did not know that! <vagrantc>Guest79: there may be some ways to work around that in some cases <vagrantc>normally you would need to build it specifically for guix so it gets the right library paths embedded <Guest79>So, in Guix, if you don't find something in the repository, you have to build it yourself? <Guest79>But something so common like tor-browser... is there any way to contribute to that repository? <Guest79>Well, I am not a developer, but a limted user trying to lear Guix, but I would like to know how to have the Tor Browser installed <Guest79>I don't think so. Well, I have not analyse it. But I know Richard Stallman uses the Tor Browser : ) <sneek>Welcome back jackhill, you have 1 message! <sneek>jackhill, raghavgururajan says: Hmm, thats odd. I didn't get that issue few days ago. Could you try at the commit d02c1d0f8382d14b0df3e3e4f4d5fe0a3956d89f (`guix pull --branch=staging --commit=d02c1d0f8382d14b0df3e3e4f4d5fe0a3956d89f && guix install gajim`)? <vagrantc>oh, i had assumed torbrowser didn't disable the extensions repository search thing (which may contain non-free extensions) ... as that's what blocked firefox <roptat>vagrantc, that's a minor issue no? a short patch could fix it I think <Guest79>well, you might be right, I don't know <roptat>in any case, building tor-browser will be extremely hard <jonsger>bricewge: do you have those webauthn patches somewhere in git? <vagrantc>pretty much blocked by "building modern browsers is hard, and secure ones even harder" from the sounds of it <roptat>Guest79, I use icecat, and I configured it to use tor *vagrantc will wander off and provide misinformation elsewhere for a while :) <Guest79>roptat: Thank you. I will do so too. I was thinking of abandoning Guix. <roptat>wow, just because of the tor browser? <bricewge>jonsger: If you use webauthn in icedove I'll like a feedback since I did not test it <Guest79>Icecat through Tor is not as secure as Tor-Browser, I will have to take it always into account <roptat>ah, I guess I don't mind that much, but you might be right <vagrantc>browser fingerprinting is scarily effective <Guest79>Actually I'm not sure if I'll stay in Guix, I really need TorBrowser <vagrantc>you can run guix on a foreign distro, if you still want to experiment with and learn guix <roptat>I know people have used an "fhs service", although I'm not sure where that service is defined <Guest79>Yes, I come from Trisquel. Some weeks ago I tested Guix as a package manager and liked it very much. Yesterday I decided to try Guix as a system. <roptat>it creates the structure expected by those random binaries, so it would be easier to use the torbrowser <roptat>ah flatpack might work too, never tried <Guest79>I see flatpak is available at Guix repositories. Does flatpak only provide Free Software? <roptat>I don't think so, but I also think we disable the default repository, that provides nonfree software <jackhill>Guest79: flatpak is sort of like a package manager. It depends on on what repositories its configured to fetch from. The flagship flathub.org repository is not commited to only free software, so it's not enabled by default in guix. <ixmpp>Oh, sorry, forget i mentioned it 😘 <dstolfa>ixmpp: just replace craft with test and pretend you're using it from flatpak (: <ixmpp>Is minetest actually any good? <jackhill>like in this case, Tor Browser Bundle is free software. And to show the packaging difficulty, the flatpak is just a downloader for the torproject.org binaries <Guest79>Ok, I guess I should trust those binaries <ixmpp>I do like that it's in c++ but last i remember it was awful <dstolfa>ixmpp: there are some fun games built on minetest, but it's nowhere near the polish of minecraft when it comes to the actual game <jackhill>what would be super cool would be the the tor folks used guix to build their official binaries like bitcoin :) <jackhill>Guest79: that seems to be what torproject wants you to do at least. Is there Trisquel package for it? <dstolfa>is there some kind of "find out what color this is" in guix? <dstolfa>i wanna click on my screen in a pdf and get the #... for the color <dstolfa>doesn't matter if RGB, HSV or whatever <Guest79>there is not a tor-browser package at Trisquel <Guest79>ixmpp: so you downloaded minecraft through Flatpak in Guix? <dstolfa>roptat: wow that's really buggy on wayland lol <jackhill>Guest79: ah, so I guess you're were trusting the the torproject binaries then too <roptat>dstolfa, ah you're adding a layer of complexity to it :p <roptat>well, just take a screenshot and open it in gimp :p <Guest79>I mean this Flatpak thing being able to download non-free software <leoprikler>your web browser can also download non-free software <jackhill>Guest79: well, so is wget or GNOME-Web or curl… <leoprikler>for instance, adding the itch.io client would be a poor decision on our part, even if there's some free software to be found on it <Guest79>I wold like Guix to be as pure as Trisquel <leoprikler>if there's some patches we could easily apply, you might want to make those changes to the package and send it to the ML <roptat>(or just send enough info, though that won't guarantee someone else will do the job) <dstolfa>isn't flatpak sort of agnostic as to what the upstream is? <dstolfa>sure, flathub packages non-free things, but you can just not use flathub? <dstolfa>that doesn't make guix impure, it just means you chose to enable a source of non-free software <roptat>which distinguishes it from itch.io, which is designed to get things only from one source <roptat>we can patch flatpak to not look for non free sources, whereas we can't change itch.io, so we can package the former but not the latter, right? <dstolfa>why would you even want to do that with flatpak? it doesn't look at any sources by default, you have to explicitly enable it <dstolfa>if you just do a `guix install flatpak`, you don't have a single place to get software from, you have to choose which one you add <dstolfa>if you choose to add flathub, then you get non-free software, but that's a conscious decision <roptat>yeah, I mean, we can patch flatpak to not look for non free software by not configuring it to look for flathub <dstolfa>i don't think it does that right now <dstolfa>it just kind of says: go configure a thing <dstolfa>in order to set up flatpak, you have to do a flatpak remote-add ... <dstolfa>i don't think it has any in by default <roptat>ok, that's also my understanding, I might not have expressed myself clearly, sorry <leoprikler>last used flatpak, but I think dstolfa is right on that <euandreh>what are your views on porting Guix (the package manager only) to other systems, such as FreeBSD? <drakonis>hmm, last i heard it is fine, but work has to be done <roptat>yeah, there's guix on the hurd now <roptat>but if the system doesn't support glibc, it might be difficult <euandreh>are they glibc, bash, gcc, sed, and friends? <roptat>if you want to use something other than glibc, you'll have to introduce a very different process, which might require a lot of code, and a lot of maintenance effort <euandreh>I get the "a lot of code" part, but not the "a lot of maintenence" part, why is that? <ixmpp>I thought local-libcs was a thing <roptat>you'd have to ensure packages build with your libc, maybe have variants of packages to apply libc-specific patches, ... <roptat>it's not very clear what kind of maintenance would be involved, but last time I checked, it was a fear expressed by ludo <drakonis>supporting freebsd is generally maintenance heavy <drakonis>mainly due to wide swathes of software requiring freebsd patches <euandreh>oh I see, the maintenece would be on supporting packages that rely on glibc, not on making Guix support it <ixmpp>I was going to look into musl tbh <ixmpp>Forgot to add it to my todos <roptat>I don't know a lot about the bottom of the graph, so I'm not sure exactly what kind of maintenance would be involved and how different it is from supporting a different architecture <roptat>like, how different is it to support musl vs the hurd <roptat>but, I think there's a lot of places in Guix that assume glibc, so it might be harder to work with a different libc <ixmpp>Musl where possible, glibc where not <jackhill>there's one way to find how muw much work it would be :) <ixmpp>Still probably get space and speed gains <ixmpp>jackhill: Ask a contractor for a quote? <jackhill>I think part of it too is with Guix's size there is value in concentrating our efforts. Compare our archetecture support to Debian. Although we're growing! <roptat>if musl doesn't use /etc/nsswitch, then there's no issue: the app compiled with musl will not load anything from the host glibc ;) <civodul>i don't think we're going to support a second libc <civodul>we have a GCC 10 update to do in core-updates and i'm being told that alone is not so easy :-) <ixmpp>Luckily it doesnt necessarily fall on you to support it. Guix/nix lend themselves to distributed efforts w.r.t maintenance and development, and i wish they'd both lean on that more <ixmpp>Centralisation is the enemy, always <dstolfa>nckx: morning? it's almost bedtime here! :D <ixmpp>In this frame of reference, it's morning <boeg>well, i get this error: build of /gnu/store/c7c50h9fzvdy1k6bjaswlap2jn08ymj3-dbus-system-services.drv faile <boeg>and then it tells me to check the log which is what is in the paste i pasted <ixmpp>Someone's been touching your dbus <ixmpp>Honestly though, no clue. Guix pull and see if it goes away :p <boeg>i tried ... ill try again <jonsger>bricewge: i do not use it, no gmail or the like <ixmpp>boeg: Is there any chance someone's *actually* been touching your dbus? <ixmpp>(read: could your store be corrupted) <boeg>i dunno ... I mean, something can have gone wrong? I dunno. Can i like tell guix to rebuild it completely or something? <boeg>see i tried to install some fonts so i can see that <boeg>ixmpp: well, im hoping it fixes it :) <Guest86>When you install a program through Flatpak. How do you start it? <char>Is there some review process for guix packages. I mean not the package defenitions, but the packages themselves? Can just any package be added to guix repository so long as they have good license? <ngz>char: A very large majority of packages are accepted, but a few were rejected in the past, for different reasons. <char>ngz: so it would be reasonable to use guix as package manager for language X <Noisytoot>Guest86: This channel is about Guix, not Flatpak <Noisytoot>ixmpp: Minetest is good (and if you add mods, it can have as many features as the similar nonfree program that you use) <roptat>Noisytoot, it's fine to talk about flatpak