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<nickey> can anybody explain what the difference between packages in config.scm, which are installed via `guix system reconfigure...` and manifest file described packages installed by `guix package...`? why not to install all what I need exactly when installing system? by `guix system init...` or `guix system reconfigure...`?
<rekado_>nickey: it’s better to keep user profiles separate from the system, because you’ll reconfigure the system for more than just package changes.
<rekado_>I’d only leave packages in the config.scm that absolutely need to be installed globally
<rekado_>all other package needs for services are taken care of by service definitions already
<nickey>rekado_: ok
<nickey>hm... it would be good to define user-specific packages with... you know... `(user ... (packages ...))`. didn't find anything in documentation. seems like i don't understand something very basic in guix workflow
<OriansJ>nickey: well there are simple ways to support user defined packages like: which then can be combined with guix package -i filename.scm
<OriansJ>(correction guix package -f filename.scm)
<nckx>nickey: Guix already supports that with system-packages. It has serious drawbacks but you're free to do it. Nobody's stopping you from putting libreoffice in your system-packages; I did so for a short while.
<nckx>Having a separate (user …) syntax in the system.scm wouldn't bring any advantages.
<nckx>OriansJ: nickey means ‘user-specific’ as in ‘user profile’ here, not ‘user-defined’.
<OriansJ>nckx: and su into the user and running guix doesn't cover it?
*nckx shruggaroos.
<nckx>Apparently not.
<OriansJ>nckx: well the line always is "we the developers of guix are only putting in features that we ourselves use; however should you wish to contribute that feature we would not reject it if including does not create a large maintance effort"
<nckx>OriansJ: What feature is that?
<OriansJ>nckx: it is a template response to any feature request which a guix developer doesn't feel like working on
<OriansJ>unless of course the feature request is coming from the people/person paying your salary and then there are the political answers
<nckx>You have so utterly lost me.
<apteryx>would python 3.8 be OK at this time for core-updates?
<OriansJ>nckx: breathing and 30 seconds of reflection usually are sufficient
<nckx>OriansJ: I'm just going to assume you're confusing me with someone else, which is fine, but I have no idea what this is about.
<OriansJ>nckx: I guess casual conversation about guix feature inclusion discussion was a bit meta and sudden of a switch in topic... Oh well. Back to the #bootstrapping mines with me
<Minall>Hello guix!
*nckx hands OriansJ a shiny brass lamp, and food.
<nckx>o/ Minall
<Minall>What do I need to share internet in guixSD?, anyone has made it?... I'm unable to, and I think I need some package or something
<OriansJ>Minall: as in dial up?
<Minall>OriansJ: What do you mean?
<OriansJ>Minall: what does ip a show?
<Minall>My devices,
<Minall>wlp2s0 'wireless', the one connected to the internet righ now
<OriansJ>and the device connected to the network shows UP
<Minall>What I want to do is to share internet with my ethernet to another pc
<Minall>Yes, I do have internet
<OriansJ>over a crossover cable or via a hub acting as a router?
<Minall>The thing is that in other distributions I can share internet, entering my ethernet devie and changing IPv4 method to sharing
<Minall>But in guixSD doesn't work
<Minall>Over a cable, ethernet
<Minall>Wifi gets internet, and it gets share through ethernet to another computer
<nckx>Minall: Which programme do you use for that, though?
<Minall>Maybe it isn't installed correctly?
<Minall>The steps are: open with a terminal 'nm-connection-editor'
<Minall>And with that I can manage my devices such as when using nmcli
<nckx>I'm more or less out then, sorry, I don't even have ‘nm-connection-editor’.
<nckx>Have you opened a bug?
<Minall>You don't?, it is installed in any desktop environments, such as MATE, KDE or gnome
<Minall>I'm asking in the mailing list
*nckx doesn't use a desktop environment.
<nckx>If we ship software that has a big (or small…) ‘Share my Internetz’ button and clicking it does not, in fact, share any Internetz then that's a definitely a bug.
<OriansJ>one might be able to do it the old-fashioned way
<nckx>Yeah, I was going to suggest the same. Use iptables masquerading. I did that once, long ago (just don't ask me how), and it should be distro-independent and will definitely work on Guix.
<Minall>I'll try
<Minall>But it should work normally too...
<nckx>And if it doesn't you'll finally get real error messages.
<Minall>So its a bug
<nckx>It's a bug, don't be shy to report is as such.
<OriansJ>Minall: more along the lines of systemd; if I remember correctly
<nckx>But who knows when it will be fixed, and the more you know, the less you have to rely on magic GUIs that *will* one day break your heart and leave you and take the dog.
<Minall>I'll try the link!
*nckx wonders whether things like ’nano -w /etc/dnsmasq.conf’ will have any effect on Guix System; doesn't know.
<OriansJ>nckx: only if one does guix package -i nano
<Minall>WHy wouldn't it have any effect on guix system?
*nckx lols.
<Minall>Aparently, I don't have /etc/network/interfaces
<Minall>Is this normal?
<nckx>Minall: Because I don't know if, by default, dnsmasq is run as a system service (we have one) or started by and managed by NetworkManager (which is common). Let alone who gets to tell it what to do, and if it even reads that file.
<Minall>How can I check if I have network manager installed? maybe that's the problem...
<nckx>Minall: Yes, it's a distribution-specific thing. I think Red Hat? But don't quote me on that.
<Minall>I apparently dont have installed iproute2 in my sistem
<Minall>Is this necessary?
<Minall>I do have network-manager....
<Minall>I dont have nss-certs, even though I have it in my reconfigure, that may be a bug
<nckx>Minall: If you use nmcli and it does things, NM is installed and running.
<Minall>Let me check if it 'does things'
<nckx>Minall: I know you have iproute2 installed because you ran ‘ip a’ just now 🙂
<Minall>I'll change my wifi settings at random
<Minall>Is something happends, then nmcli is working
<nckx>Good plan.
<nckx>What could go wrong.
<Minall>Maybe my pc could explode
<Minall>Yes, it apparently works
<nckx>Minall: Does nmcli (or another UI like nmtui) provide the same ‘sharing’ option? Who knows, maybe that *will* give an error/more info.
<Minall>Yes, it works
<Minall>I'm able to change my wifi connections
<OriansJ>Minall: if your pc explodes, ask Apple for a refund :-p
<Minall>Yes, nmcli does have a way to change it to 'sharing', through the terminal
<Minall>OriansJ: lol!
<Minall>So know it is available
<Minall>So, I know now that nmcli works
<Minall>The question is... Why isn't working when changing my IPv4 method to sharing, which works in other distros
<OriansJ>actually nmcli does a bunch of things through systemd, so just because the binary correctly does a few things does not mean all features in it works...
<nckx>That is indeed the question.
<nckx>OriansJ: Orly? Yay.
<nckx>Minall: No feedback when enabling this sharing through nmcli?
<nckx>I could see whatever Gnome GUI you're using silently dumping errors to the console (Gnome in general loves to do that), at least at the CLI you'd see them…
<Minall>Ok, I've encountered a problem
<nckx>Problems are progress.
<Minall>nmcli and nm-connection-editor are connected right?
<Minall>Changing my ipv4 method to sharing in nm-connection-editor seems to work
<nckx>I don't know. I have nmcli, I don't have nm-c-e, so they're not *that* connected.
<Minall>But when i runned nmcli, It doesn't show it changed
<nckx>And when you change it to ‘shared’ in nmcli?
<Minall>Yes, I did it too but with privileges
<Minall>Ok, now I have it in 'shared'
<Minall>It changed now
<nckx>Damn, I'd just found out how to do that & felt so proud.
<nckx>‘nmcli connection modify MyWiFi ipv4.method shared’
<nckx>Like a child, showing their work.
<Minall>jajaj lol
<nckx>Did it work?
<Minall>Yes, I now have my ethernet on 'shared' method
<Minall>And nope, it doesn't work
<Minall>My ethernet profile is UP
<Minall>But in the PC it is down, it isn't receiving anything
<nckx>And ‘sudo nmcli connection show LeWifi | grep shared’ shows something?
<Minall>Let me try
<Minall>ipv4.method: shared
<nckx>So, lies.
<Minall>It is in shared
<Minall>It should work
<Minall>BUT IT DOESN't!!-rekodwefmsef
<Minall>In another distros works, but I don't like other distros, guix is perfect ( it isn't, but its close)
<Minall>Could this be a dependency issue?
<nckx>It definitely has it's warts. Stuff like this is one of them (although Desktop software like NM having horrible failure modes doesn't help).
<nckx>Minall: Sure, it could be.
<nckx>As OriansJ pointed out, it might be trying to talk to something silly like systemd. We don't know because IT WON'T TELL US ANYTHING.
<Minall>Hello guix!
<Minall>Sorry for the disconnection
<Minall>A little bit of a power outage...
<Minall>So... It doesn't work, and I have the 'sharing' method on nmcli
<nckx>*Completely* unrelated to you buggering about with your network.
<Minall>What should I do?, I'm at a loss
<Minall>Yes, unrelated lol
<Minall>I just touched the cable lol
<nckx>Minall: Report a bug? Sorry, that's all I can say.
<nckx>(At our bug tracker, of course, not NM's.)
<Minall>Maybe I should, since I don't have response for the mailing list
<OriansJ>background reference material for the subject at hand
<nckx>‘bits (ones and zeros)’
<nckx>They go deep.
<OriansJ>when in doubt go straight to must be true and build from there
<OriansJ>and the important section:
<Minall>Thank you for the information, I have to go!
<OriansJ>a good chunk of that could easily be incorporated into the guixsd manual as there are only a dozen commands that need to be replaced
<OriansJ>(with their Gnu Shepard and guix equivalents)
<retropikzel>Any way to search which package provides library with guix? I'm looking for libssl
<reepca>retropikzel: "find /gnu/store -name ''" will find it if you've got it in your store anywhere. So far it's found openssl and libressl for me.
<dfeng>Hi guix!
<dfeng>Can you rename a package? In fact, "zile" is "a text editor development kit" but the current editor is "Zemacs". See
<dfeng>see also: (gnu packages zile)
<dfeng>Therefore, the package name should be "Zemacs"
<dfeng>I have opened a new issue about "Zile on Guile":
<ng0>so there's a name colision.. happens all the time
<civodul>dfeng: note that Zile was a text editor at the time
<civodul>and the "zile" package in Guix is still that very same editor, not the Lua-based one
<civodul>could it be that zile-the-framework and zz and zemacs haven't been released yet?
<dfeng>civodul: it seems that the only available release is named zile, formally it is Zemacs.
<ng0>the last commit was in 2014. I would try Email in this case
<ng0>if you really care about resolving this non-issue
<ng0>worked in most cases for me when the commit was really old
<ng0>but I'm still waiting on feedback on the email about the software I took maintainership on from the late 90s.. 19+ years might be the limit in some cases ;D
<kmicu>dfeng: the fact that I need to execute ‘zile’ to enter the editor and not ‘zemacs’ doesn’t help.
<kmicu>Have other distros change the name?
<kmicu>(It looks like five years is not enough to change executable’s name ;)
<dfeng>some development versions are also named zile but include Zemacs, Zz...
<dfeng>it seems that there is one branch for each editor
<kmicu>Those predate 2014 info about Zile as editor.
<kmicu> is very messy, looks unmaintained, and has conflicting information almost everywhere. It should be removed right after SLiM 😺
<ng0>no work doesn't mean it stops working though
<ng0>bugs could gather, but there are users
<ng0>just my opinion.
<janneke>fwiw, /me has been falling back to slim because gdm fails to run several times
<apteryx>rekado: I looked at your package-mapping example, and it seems that there's something fundamental we don't understand about Guile modules; otherwise the following should work: guile -L . -C . -c '(use-modules (gnu packages emacs-custom)) (pk emacs-magit))'
<apteryx>err, replace emacs-magit by emacs-magit-rekado
<pen14641>Hi, has anyone here had luck using virt-manager on Guix? When trying to create a new VM, I get the error '/sys/fs/cgroup/unified/machine/cgroup.controllers': No such file or directory
<pen14641>When I look, I am missing the /sys/fs/cgroup/unified/machine directory, but I have /sys/fs/cgroup/unified/cgroup.controllers
<civodul>hi pen14641
<civodul>pen14641: did you try using the service itself?
<civodul>the libvirt service
<civodul>(i don't use it myself but apparently it's used successfully)
<pen14641>Yes, the libvirtd is running
<dfeng>kmicu: I suggest a renaming to avoid confusions. e.g.
<dfeng>kmicu: e.g.
<civodul>it looks like the project is dormant tho, so it's no big deal IMO
<pen14641>civodul: When I run 'herd status', I see that libvirtd has been started and not stopped. Is there another way I should be checking if it is running correctly?
<civodul>you could check /var/log/messages of whichever log file libvirt writes to
<civodul>then you can always report your experience to
<pen14641>civodul: Ok, thanks
<wdkrnls>Hi, I'm trying to write a package to install the window manager I was using before installing guix. guix build tells me a fatal error is occuring since I'm missing X11/extensions/shape.h. Is there a way to search guix for a package which would provide this file?
<reepca>wdkrnls: you can check if it's in your store with "find /gnu/store -path '*X11/extensions/shape.h'"
<reepca>in my store the most relevant-looking package seems to be 'libxext'
<wdkrnls>:) that is a good trick
<wdkrnls>thanks, reepca
<janneke>ouch, mingw cross compilation is broken on core-updates-next, gcc-7 does not build
<iv-so>how can I use third-party guile libraries without explicit add-to-load-path?
<civodul>hi iv-so
<civodul>iv-so: Guile has two environment variables: GUILE_LOAD_PATH and GUILE_LOAD_COMPILED_PATH
<civodul>they tell it where to look for .scm and .go files, respectively
<civodul>when you install guile and guile librarie with Guix, those variables are automatically set
<iv-so>got it
<iv-so>thanks for explanation
<foxmean>Hello, I've install guix package manager ontop of void linux and I've found that install shell script FAIL to detected Init system. May be it's because of runit init system.
<foxmean>"[1568470338.931]: [ FAIL ] Init system could not be detected." is the actual message.
*janneke ^C's a world rebuild for bootstrap guile-2.2
<janneke>i think that gash now works with guile-2.0
<janneke>civodul: do you think we should base the new scheme-only bootstrap on guile-2.2, or stick with 2.0 if we can?
<spk121>civodul: so I got an issue on github about renaming zile, which is think is a 'wontfix', because GNU zile's master branch is still C zile. But if people actually use this fork and need help, feel free to get in touch.
<civodul>spk121: yeah this was discussed on this channel earlier today and "wontfix" makes sense to me :-)
<civodul>janneke: short-term it's easier to stick to 2.0 since there's nothing to change and all architectures can keep using the same code
<civodul>longer-term, we may have to switch to 2.2 someday
<civodul>(or 3.0)
<quiliro>Saluton Guix!
<wdkrnls>I'm writing a package for the window manager I like and thanks to reepca helping me identify a missing dependency, I got it to install. However, I'm not seeing any new executables on my path from it.
<wdkrnls>`guix package --list-installed` shows it is there though :)
<wdkrnls>I'm wondering if I need to do some modification to it to ensure the executables become available on the path: by default the package wants to place them in .../usr/local/bin. Could that be the reason they aren't showing up?
<Minall>Hello guix!
<wdkrnls>This did appear to be the case. Now the executables are available from a /bin and now they appear in path.
<spk121>janneke: for your bootstrap project, I do somewhere have a Guile version of ed, and maybe sed. I might be able to dig that out and fix it if it would help you out.
<cbaines>janneke, there is a bug open about the libvirt/virt-manager issue
<cbaines>actually, that message ^ was meant for pen14641 (who's now gone)
<Minall>How can I change my pulseaudio configurations?, apparently I don't have a etc/pulse/daemon.conf file
<civodul>hi cbaines!
<Minall>Is pulseaudio install with desktop-services?
<janneke>spk121: oh...that could be nice. right now, i am working to resurrect external commands for gash, such as a naive awk, sed :)
<janneke>spk121: samplet wrote a sed and i extended on it, looking at what you have can never hurt.
<janneke>i'm pretty sure our current sed is not good enough for a full bootstrap
<pen14641>Hi again :) I'm not able to figure out why (alsa-service-type) is giving me problems. I get the error "builder of '/gnu/store/...-etc.drv' failed with exit code 1" when running guix system reconfigure
<cbaines>hey civodul, o/
<cbaines>I'm heading out now though, so bye as well :)
<reepca>pen14641: alsa-service-type isn't a procedure, so attempting to call it doesn't work. Try (service alsa-service-type)
<pen14641>reepca: Sorry, (service alsa-service-type) is what I meant. That's what I have in my config
<davidl>If you define a syslog-service with a local file say 3config-file (local-file (config-file "configs/syslog.conf)) or similar
<davidl>and then use that for guix deploy, would that work even if you haven't copied that local file to the target server?
<reepca>pen14641: could you pastebin your config.scm?
<davidl>or is the file-path "configs/syslog.conf" evaluated before the configuration is deployed so to speak, or will it be copied automatically?
<pen14641>reepca: The indentation is a bit off viewed online
<reepca>pen14641: are there any additional lines of output prior to the "failed with exit code 1" message?
<reepca>if not, could you re-run the command with the -v flag?
<janneke>hi cbaines, thanks -- i wondered :)
<reepca>pen14641: ah, I think I've got it - %desktop-services already contains (service alsa-service-type).
<pen14641>reepca: Ah okay, thanks a lot!
<pen14641>Then I just don't know why I can't hear audio from IceCat... (Not that I've heard audio from anything else either)
<pen14641>Oh, sorry... pavucontrol is it's own package. I assumed it would be in the service, when it wasn't in the pulseaudio package. That was a bit stupid. Thanks a lot anyway reepca!
<reepca>👍 hope you get it working, also I've got this line in my ~/.bashrc that I vaguely remember putting there and might be related somehow: export ALSA_PLUGIN_DIR=$HOME/.guix-profile/lib/alsa-lib
<reepca>(I imagine it assumes I've got the alsa-plugins package installed in my user profile)
<pen14641>Ok thanks, I'll save it for later, if I need it :)
<JohnAZoidberg>I'm trying to build the guix package from source. It seems like it builds or at least evaluates all packages in guix. Is that necessary? Can I not just build the guix binary?
<wdkrnls>I wrote a package for the window manager I use and I would like to get it included into Guix so that I can feel confident it will be available if I place it in my config.scm.
<wdkrnls>The manual suggests that I run `guix lint` on the resulting package to make sure it doesn't have any obvious defects.
<wdkrnls>However, I haven't actually gotten a package and this being my first such package, it's not clear what this command is looking for.
<wdkrnls>I just ran guix package -f my-file.scm
<wdkrnls>and then the package was transformed into a folder in the store.
<rekado>wdkrnls: I recommend reading the Contributing section in the Guix manual.
<rekado>wdkrnls: it recommends fetching the Guix source code and writing a patch.
<wdkrnls>Hi rekado: yes I did do that.
<wdkrnls>git diff > my.patch
<wdkrnls>But I basically copied by code into wm.scm from my own file, prefixing license: for the license part of the package following what wm.scm does.
***sneek_ is now known as sneek
<wdkrnls>I was just trying to figure out how to make sure it was okay.
<rekado>use “./pre-inst-env guix lint my-package”
<rekado>(after compiling the Guix source code)
<rekado>to prepare a patch I recommend using “git commit” and then “git format-patch -1”
<rekado>this produces a patch we can apply directly
<wdkrnls>oh, okay. I can do that to make the patch.
<wdkrnls>I just don't really understand what 'my-package' is in the guix lint call.
<wdkrnls>guix lint: error: herbstluftwm: unknown package
<wdkrnls>it shows up in `guix package --list-installed`
<wdkrnls>I guess I only understand packages as scheme data structures and as directories in the store, not as independent artefacts.
<rekado>it appears in list-installed because you’ve previously installed it from a file
<rekado>but that file isn’t part of the modules Guix looks at.
<rekado>can you show us the diff to wm.scm?
*rekado –> afk
<wdkrnls>sure, is there a preferred pastebin to use, or by e-mail?
<rekado>wdkrnls: I applied it to my git checkout and I can run “./pre-inst-env guix lint herbstluftwm” just fine.
<rekado>it complains about the use of tabs
<rekado>(herbstluftwm@0.7.2: tabulation on line 141, column 0)
<rekado>for each line
<rekado>gnu/packages/wm.scm:187:15: herbstluftwm@0.7.2: synopsis should not start with the package name
<wdkrnls>oh, okay. Thanks, rekado. I will remove the tabs and get rid of the package name.
<rekado>wdkrnls: please also add a comment about why the tests have been disabled.
<rekado>the “file-name” field is not needed because the tarball already has a good name
<rekado>the description should be a little more … descriptive :)
<rekado>you should also add a copyright line for yourself to the copyright header near the top of the file.
<wdkrnls>thanks for the very helpful feedback. I will investigate those issues :)