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<sebboh>bavier: thank you
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<quiliro>someone on #fsf says that the hardware is always loaded with nonfree blobs...i told 'em that they are not there is nothing i can do about them
<quiliro>"if the hardware isn't free then there is no hope for truly blob free devices"
<quiliro>which is true...but at least our software provider is not enslaving us
<quiliro>on the other hand...if we are using hardware which is not auditable, it is useless to have free software running it....enslavement can come from a single element because it can fully control the machine.
<OriansJ>quiliro: wrong
<poet>Hello. After receiving some help in here last night, I managed to get Guix up and running, and I've downloaded quite a few packages (over 500) since then. Today, however, I had my first error while trying to install gnucash:
<quiliro>OriansJ: what?
<poet>I opened the (rather large) error log. Here are the final lines:
<poet>Is the build failing because I'm missing webkit2gtk-3.0?
<lfam>poet: Yes, it looks like the package definition for gnucash needs to be changed
<quiliro>poet: did you guix pull?
<poet>Hey lfam, nice to see you again. So, the error isn't on my end?
<lfam>poet: No, it's a problem with our package
<poet>quiliro: Yes, I did, and that brings up another question...
<poet>One second...
<OriansJ>quiliro: your point about free software being pointless on hardware one can not audit. That is incorrect
<lfam>poet: The current version of gnucash in Guix is 3.5 but I noticed your build log refers to 3.4. If you do `guix pull`, that will update the set of available packages and then you can try again. Hopefully the newer package is fixed
<quiliro>OriansJ: why?
<poet>Okay. I literally just finished doing 'guix pull'
<poet>I'll try 'guix package install=gnucash'
<OriansJ>quiliro: freedom is a process that builds on previous success and achievements. Aka you can not have freedom A until it's structural dependencies B, C and D are achieved.
<quiliro>so you agree with the thesis i proposed
<quiliro>whic i have not adopted
<quiliro>OriansJ: freedom A=application, freedom B=operating system, Freedom C=firmware, freedom D=hardware
<vagrantc>you can work on things in parallel
<OriansJ>quiliro: but we have A, B and C with progress being made with D
<OriansJ>D in your example is the one which depends on A and B
<OriansJ>vagrantc: also having 8 freedoms is better than zero freedoms and thus not pointless either
<quiliro>i agree that having more freedoms is better than having less freedoms...but it is not freedom...considering of course that nothing is absolute
<poet>Okay, I did 'guix pull' then 'guix install gnucash' and got the same error:
<quiliro>so....nonmodifiable firmware cannot be considered the software distributor's responsibility
<vagrantc>you can also test hardware to some degree with reproducible builds ... if on a diverse array of hardware/firmware you end up with the same binary, you can have greater assurances there's nothing malicious...
<quiliro>poet: your photo suggests running guix pull
<OriansJ>quiliro: there is no such thing one can obtain as absolute freedom. Your freedom of speech must end where my freedom of association begins
<quiliro>poet: would you please run guix --version
<poet>quiliro: Yes, I always get that message... even immediately after running guix pull
<poet>okay one second...
<poet>guix (GNU Guix) 1.0.1
<quiliro>it is not updated then
<quiliro>did you run the command guix --version
<poet>(7)(markus@alcyone (~))$> guix --version
<poet>guix (GNU Guix) 1.0.1
<poet>Copyright (C) 2019 the Guix authors
<poet>License GPLv3+: GNU GPL version 3 or later <>
<poet>This is free software: you are free to change and redistribute it.
<poet>There is NO WARRANTY, to the extent permitted by law.
<quiliro>No warranty!
<quiliro>i had that problem in the not know how it went away...
<poet>I just downloaded and installed it yesterday....
<quiliro>would you please run guix pull and post the photo of the result
<poet>Is there anywhere I can upload the error log?
<poet>Sure. One moment please...
<quiliro>OriansJ: so what stallman says is also relative and debian is right
<quiliro>poet: maybe use wgetpaste
<quiliro>guix install wgetpaste
<OriansJ>quiliro: depends on one's goals; for example many businesses prefer Weak push over licenses but users benefit more from strong copyleft licenses like the GPLv3. So when one says freedom they need to be aware about what their goals are and thus the correct freedoms can be determined
<poet>Here is the neofetch + guix pull:
<OriansJ>quiliro: so if your goal is smooth the path to freedom for users, Debian's compromises would be a reasonable path to follow. However if your goal is to be the hardliners that refuse to compromise, then clearly Stallman's path is the correct one.
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<OriansJ>compromising control to others who may abuse you is a choice and sometimes it is a better option to get you out of a bad situation where much more abuse is occuring.
<poet`>Did my last paste make it to the channel?
<quiliro>poet: are you running guix only or guix system?
<Guest41935>Hello, everyone. I'm new to GuixSD and I keep running into this bug in the installer. I try to connect to the wireless but every time I put in the password, it just leads to backtrace problem
<poet`>quiliro: guix only
<poet`>Here is the output of neofetch + guix pull:
<quiliro>poet`: then check the last message on your guix pull
<OriansJ>quiliro: It is kinda like saying, it is better to stay in a crack den than in a house with a partner who wants to kill you. So if your choice is between a non-FSF approved Linux distro and Windows; the option is clear, get out of windows
<quiliro>i see your error...can you?
<poet`>quiliro: About running 'guix hash'?
<quiliro>poet`: see the part where it says hint
<quiliro>set the path
<quiliro>then guix hash to check
<quiliro>did you do that?
<quiliro>echo $PATH
<quiliro>hash guix
<poet`>Here is what I have in ~/.bashrc
<quiliro>please post results
<poet`>export PATH=/home/markus/.guix-profile/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/X11/bin
<quiliro>ls -l /home/markus/.config/guix/current/bin/guix
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<quiliro>and be sure to reread the manual where it talks about guix binary installation (guix on foreing distros)
<quiliro>check everything it recommends
<quiliro>i think there is your error
<poet`>(15)(markus@alcyone (~))$> ls -l /home/markus/.config/guix/current/bin/guix
<poet`>lrwxrwxrwx 2 root root 56 Dec 31 1969 /home/markus/.config/guix/current/bin/guix -> /gnu/store/033m1hjwl8r7irzhxlqfib09v7pl1x2l-guix-command*
<poet`>(16)(markus@alcyone (~))$>
<quiliro>OriansJ: i do not agree with you...going with ubuntu is not a better choice than windows and will make it more difficult to migrate to a free distro
<poet`>quiliro: I'm not sure I understand. Every package I've tried to install has worked, except one: gnucash.
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<quiliro>poet`: you are installing old packages
<poet`>Meaning... my copy of guix is installing old packages?
<quiliro>i do not guarantee but i think the new gnucash version will be better
<poet`>What's the current version of guix? 1.0.1?
<quiliro>when you type guix --version and it says guix (GNU Guix) 588a0a335d09311197352c7f49d5541ef2717cc8
<bryantz>Has anyone ran into this bug? What's the solution for now?
<quiliro>you will have the one that i have updated to just now
<quiliro>bryantz: do you have this problem? have you tryed just installing a base install first? be sure to save /mnt/etc/config.scm before restarting
<quiliro>poet`: but if you guix pull later, you will have another either case, you will not have 1.0.1
<quiliro>poet`: please check the mailing list also...someone else might have had the same problem
<bryantz>Could you explain what base install means? I might be mistaken but I haven't gotten to those options for packages yet. I was setting up the wireless in the graphical installer
<poet`>quiliro: Okay. I'll try another pull before I go to bed. I wish I could understand what I did wrong though, so I don't make the same mistake again. I was pretty scrupulous about following directions verbatim... or at least I thought I was.
<OriansJ>quiliro: perhaps that is a point we simply will not find agreement on; as I believe the ecologic advantage of half-steps are worth their costs and that demanding all must accept my preferences regardless is something I find most unfair
<quiliro>a base install is nothing added
<poet`>Like I said, I've installed a lot of packages, and only one is giving me problems...
<quiliro>bryantz: oh!
<quiliro>bryantz: so you do not have networking
<bryantz>The SSID shows up
<bryantz>No non-free firmware blobs on this pcie wifi card
<quiliro>poet`: let me be have problems with a certain version of are using an old version of gnucash because you are installing with an old version of must make guix be updated first to get the new version which might work
<bryantz>The mailing lists shows something about the SSID not advertising itself properly, but I don't understand the technical details of it all really.
<poet`>quiliro: Okay, I understand. I downloaded the binary from the official guix website. Can I update my copy from the terminal, or start over from scratch?
<bryantz>Mine shows up but then I put in the password, and *poof* the stacktrace comes on
<poet`>'guix pull' updates guix, or so I thought...
<quiliro>poet`: i have never done it on a foreign distro...sorry don't know
<poet`>quiliro: Ohhhh I see, okay.
<quiliro>it does update guix...but you are not using the updated the error messages you sent me
<quiliro>work with those errors
<poet`>quiliro: I totally understand now.
<quiliro>bryant...sorry...i thought it was nomething else...let me think about it
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<bryantz>It's okay. I think they have it marked to fix but I think I can go through it using the terminal
<quiliro>bryantz: did you do this: "However, hostapd’s config file doesn’t allow empty SSIDs. So I set the SSID to “ ” (a single space), but that’s correctly handled by the installer."
<quiliro>poet: did you try what i suggested?
<bryantz>Hmmm I could only select the wireless names, not edit them. I'm checking it now thanks
<quiliro>bryantz: the error there happens when you have a blank wireless network that your use case?
<poet>quiliro: What was that? Checking the mailing list? No, I have't done that yet, but I will.
<bryantz>You mean editing it to an empty SSID string rather than the correct one I have?
<quiliro>no, checking the path with echo and checking the existence of the file with ls
<quiliro>echo $PATH
<quiliro>ls -l /home/markus/.config/guix/current/bin/guix
<poet>yes this: ls -l /home/markus/.config/guix/current/bin/guix
<poet>One moment please...
<quiliro>check the manual about setting the path...i think that is the key
<quiliro>and run hash guix
<quiliro>post those three results
<bryantz>It's not an empty wireless name. The name of my wireless network shows up when I hit the 'scan' button. I selected it and it prompted me for a password, yet whenever I put in the password, it falls apart.
<bryantz>However it does the same thing if nothing shows up and I push enter
<bryantz>I meant before I hit 'scan' it does the same thing
<quiliro>poet: why di you not use echo $PATH ?
<bryantz>Now it's telling me that my password is incorrect lol. Sorry I just needed to write that out
<quiliro>bryantz: so we now know it is not related with scan
<quiliro>bryantz: so you solved it?
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<bryantz>Might be another problem haha
<quiliro>we should find where the bug is
<bryantz>the gui installer only accepts 24-25 characters on the Wifi prompt
<bryantz>my password is 27+
<quiliro>oh! there you go
<quiliro>but you said it was a problem before even entering the password
<quiliro>do you manage the access point?
<bryantz>Yes so either way it should not "crash" like it should
<bryantz>Not yet
<bryantz>I can
<bryantz>'t continue unless I can put in a password that fits in this gui prompt
<quiliro>would you please type ctrl+Alt+F12
<bryantz>Okay. I've done that now
<quiliro>there you could have the error message that would guide us
<quiliro>maybe it is in another one: F1 to F12
<quiliro>there you can see messages?
<quiliro>at the bottom of the text
<quiliro>poet: do not go to sleep without leaving a poem
<bryantz>I see the logs
<bryantz>Let me reproduce the error
<poet>quiliro: LMAO!!!!
<quiliro>poet: i do not know how hosh guix works but you have nothing after it
<quiliro>hash guix
<poet>quiliro: That made me literally laugh out loud...
<poet>quiliro: I will do just that, but first I think I might have discovered something...
<quiliro>poet: what is alcvone?
<bryantz>I can't get it to do the error anymore. I guess I could connect via the terminal now but I'm not sure if it is smart enough to skip the gui portion after I do.
<bryantz>All I did was hit scan twice
<poet>quiliro: Alcyone is the brightest star in the Pleiades star cluster.
<bryantz>Waited a little
<bryantz>Then it stopped bugging out on me
<quiliro>bryantz: if you could solve it, please still report it...the time you took could be useful for someone else
<quiliro>on bugs-guix mailing list
<quiliro>did it let you continue installation?
<quiliro>poet: why did you not type 'echo $PATH'?
<quiliro>poet: another test..type 'which guix'
<bryantz>Me type 'echo $PATH'?
<quiliro>so you can compare your 'ls' result with your 'which' result
<quiliro>bryantz: no... poet
<quiliro>bryantz: i was asking you if you could continue installation
<poet>Oh whoa! 'which guix' reports /usr/local/bin/guix
<poet>echo $PATH is /home/markus/.guix-profile/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/X11/bin
<quiliro>which guix will report what is the link to the currently used guix
<quiliro>and the path will define where to search for executables
<quiliro>so the correct path must be defined so the current guix is used and not the original one
<quiliro>i do not understand well how guix on a foreign distro works, so please bear with me on this mutual learning experience
<poet>Hmm. Isn't the current guix at ~/.guix-profile/bin ?
<poet>I guess not!
<dfsafdasfdsa>GuixSD run on my lenove 100s chromebook, I write config to config.scm to generated initrd, but it boot fail, then it goto initrd repl, How can I diagnose this problem?
<dfsafdasfdsa>can I use shell in initrd?
<quiliro>i guess poet gave up without any rhymes
<dfsafdasfdsa>My English grammar didn't learn well.
<quiliro>dfsafdasfdsa: yes...but i would not know how to teach is guile...if you know guile, you can type guile commands
<quiliro>but there must be an error message
<quiliro>can you copy it? or take a photo and send the link
<dfsafdasfdsa>I will find the log file and send it to pastebin.
<quiliro>dfsafdasfdsa: ok
<quiliro>what log file?
<quiliro>and how to access it if you cannot boot...vm or just mount the partition?
<poet>quiliro: My machine froze. Sorry about that. What was the last thing I posted?
<quiliro><poet> I guess not! [20:13]
<dfsafdasfdsa>The error output has exceeded the screen, I can't scroll the screen
<poet>Oh geez, okay.
<quiliro>just post the last thing dfsafdasfdsa
<dfsafdasfdsa>OK, please wait
<quiliro><poet> Hmm. Isn't the current guix at ~/.guix-profile/bin ?
<bryantz>I got wireless working but only in the terminal while I was doing the GUI installer. I'll be back but I think I'll just do it through the shell
<quiliro>poet: you can also see the chat log
<quiliro>bryantz: eble
<poet>quiliro: I'm using ERC on emacs. I don't think I have it set to log.
<dfsafdasfdsa>Does your graphical installer work properly?
<dfsafdasfdsa>I can only use manual installation
<quiliro> [10:04]
<quiliro>*** #guix: topic set by civodul!~user@unaffiliated/civodul, 2019-07-13
<quiliro> 07:45:54
<quiliro>*** Users on #guix: quiliro lfam NewUser-57387-re user_oreloznog vagrantcish
<quiliro> xkapastel vagrantc Guest35710 dustyweb __Myst__ kirisime zaab defaultxr
<quiliro> xelxebar dddddd malaclyps yrk nixo_ notnotdan ngz detrout jonsger lxo ng0
<quiliro> daviid lprndn Jackneill michaelrose nly pagurus wigust- sneek bgardner
<quiliro> slyfox_ rekado roscoe_tw neuromorphic klntsky numerobis shymega narispo
<quiliro> nee` pie__ donofrio reepca Forza jxyzn bricewge cornu[m] englishm bydo
<quiliro> xavierm02 jje IUSR Sleep_Walker dongcarl cpup
<poet>Ahhh man, that sucks. He was really helping me...
<pie__>looks like an accidental paste, he'll probably be back in a minute
<pie__>unless that was a ban
<dfsafdasfdsa>What terminal editor do you use to write the scheme?
<poet>I would imagine most of these guys use emacs.. but I'm only guessing.
<dfsafdasfdsa>For me, emacs is an editor with too many features, not suitable for editors, suitable for operating systems.
<reepca>honestly, anything with paredit-like features would be fine for writing scheme.
<bryantz>Thanks @quirilo for the help!
<quiliro>bryantz: are you still there?
<quiliro>i guess that if your name appears, you are :-D
<quiliro>sadly, poet left
<quiliro>without a chime
<quiliro>he probaly did not have time
<quiliro>in such a heft
<quiliro>that was my lame try to make a honour of poet!
<quiliro>i do not even know what heft means
<quiliro>but it rhymes!
<quiliro>will be back in a minute
<quiliro>am back...erased the paste from my emacs log
<dustyweb>quiliro: hello
<dustyweb><poet> Ahhh man, that sucks. He was really helping me...
<dustyweb><pie__> looks like an accidental paste, he'll probably be back in a minute
<dustyweb>that was some time ago tho :)
<quiliro>yes...i read it on the weblog
<dustyweb>as in, closer to an hour ago
<dustyweb>ah ok :)
<quiliro>thanks tho
<quiliro>but he left
<quiliro>it ook me less than 20 minutes to return
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<bryantz>"substitute: updating substitutes from from ''...100.0%" x30000
<bryantz>finally something happened
<quiliro>bryantz: cool
<bryantz>It's day 587. The substitute packages are still downloading. My eyes burn from the sunlight that peeps in from the curtains
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<nalkri> You could use masking tape to seal them.
<bryantz>nalkri yhankd y eys donnt birn anymoir
<bryantz>Not sure why it takes this long to download these packages. It's been three hours and it's downloading like its dialup
<poet>bryantz: Mine has been slow too. Not dialup slow, but definitely slow.
<bryantz>Only thing I can think of is when I found out my wireless card was soft-blocked, I had to do something. I can't remember if it was 'rfkill unblock something'
<bryantz>Tested my connection, and it's all funny with missing packets at times
<quiliro>poet: could you solve your problem?
<quiliro>bryantz: nice that you could install
<quiliro>gotta go now...its 1 am
<bryantz>Thank you for all the help. It'll probably be 1PM with these 56/kbps speeds. I guess i'll see you around!
<poet>Hey quiliro! I'm glad you made it back!
<poet>I haven't had any more problems yet. =)
<poet>Thank you for all the help. I genuinely appreciate it. =)
<quiliro>was back 20 minutes after the attack of the flood
<poet>Oh, I didn't see you.
<quiliro>you could solve your troubles?
<quiliro>be back in about 8 hours
<poet>Okay my friend. Thank you again. =)
<quiliro>np \o
<bryantz>omg its building
<bryantz>1 dependency couldn't be met. Build failed. Should've went with Debian
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<bryantz>Found the problem with a "dependency". It was just set to "Los Angeles" when it should have been "Los_Angeles"
<efraim>ng0: I don't think I've come across any that said "unsupported operating system", but some of them, like rust-fuchsia-cprng, fail their test phase since I don't have any fuchsia libraries
<efraim>mbakke: I think I found the issue, I was missing an 'use-module' inside the lambda in the phase, I'm testing my fix now
<ilikeheaps>How do I find what versions of a package are available? I see that the newest version for 'ansible' is 2.7.10, but I can't install 2.6
<ilikeheaps>Do I have to modify the package to get an older version?
<reepca>ilikeheaps: that would be one way to do it, but another way would be to use package transformations. See section 7.1.2 of the manual for an overview: info guix 'Package Transformation Options'
<reepca>so for example, 'guix build ansible --with-source=ansible@2.6='
<reepca>although having just tried that, it seems the build fails with that particular source
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<alloy>Hi, I've got a problem running guix system reconfiugre. When grub runs grub-install it searches for in the i386-pc direcotry of grub-efi-2.02 allthough I've got x86_64. Any idea what could be the problem?
<sneek>alloy, you have 1 message.
<sneek>alloy, mbakke says: if you have the elogind service from %desktop-services, you can do "loginctl suspend"
<ilikeheaps>reepca: Thanks, I'll see it anyway
<efraim>if I expose a directory to a VM how do I make sure it's mounted in the VM?
<eric-guix>hello, someone know how to install gcc or java on guix? or whene this package will be relased?
<g_bor>Hello guix!
<janneke>eric-guix: See
<eric-guix>well, I solved the problem whit gcc. Now I have no idea for java. Any ideas to install the java toolchain?
<g_bor>hello eric-guix!
<g_bor>What are you trying to accomplish in java?
<g_bor>I believe you are looking for the package output openjdk:jdk
<eric-guix>I'm studing java at University and for a course I'll install eclipse
<g_bor>I am not sure if we have all of eclipse...
<efraim>i don't think we do yet, does eclipse have a flatpack?
<g_bor>efraim: yes, it does.
<g_bor>See .
<efraim>so I guess that's an option
<g_bor>roptat: I have some time now to try guix-home-manager.
<eric-guix>I saw there are some eclipse subtitute like: java-eclipse* but Which one is the right?
<g_bor>eric-guix: these are parts of eclipse packaged as dependencies of other packages, but I don't believe we have all of eclipse.
<g_bor>I think that efraim's suggestion with flatpack might be the way to go.
<g_bor>Finishing packaging of eclipse seems to be a major project...
<eric-guix>I never used a flatpack What I need to do?
<g_bor>I believe you first have to install flatpack, then follow the instruction on the page I linked above.
<g_bor>I have not tried that thou...
<g_bor>I am trying to use guix package -p ....
<g_bor>I get an error: symlink: no such file:
<g_bor>Any idea what am I doing wrong?
<janneke>"herd: failed to start service tor"
<janneke>when tor (or any other service) fails to start, how do i get more information beyond "it failed?"
<janneke>sure, some services log more to messages
<tune>perhaps try `sudo herd status servicename`
<g_bor>janneke: also some service out might have escaped to syslog or to tty1.
<janneke>tune: yes, that sometimes gives pid and when it does, you can look up the command line that stared and often the config file...but now it is enabled,stopped
<janneke>g_bor: yes, it might but tor only says: Aug 14 12:39:49 localhost shepherd[1]: Service tor could not be started.
<janneke>hmm, cat /proc/1/cmdline gives me ...-shepherd.conf
<janneke>...which lists ...-shepherd-tor.scm
<janneke>but there's prolly a command line interface to all that, somewhere
<ng0>efraim: interesting.. and good :) with NetBSD/pkgsrc I got exposed to the 'everything-is-Linux' side of or at least the hardcoded operating systems some crates do when they are not necessary. with some it is necessary, others don't.
<ng0>eric-guix: someone had a binary package of eclipse posted many months back
<ng0>I used it and updated it, but since then switched to simply using Debian for Eclipse
<ng0>for university as well, found it to be the easiest solution whenever I need it, separating my university needs to another computer
<eric-guix>actualy I installed that wiht faltpack
<eric-guix>thank to everyone for the answer! seeyou next time
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<g_bor>Hello guix!
<reepca>janneke: in my experience it will claim that tor failed to start, when in reality it's actually running fine. For example, it still says it's not running for me, but ps and top show it there and the icecat button works fine
<Minall>Hello guix!
<Minall>quiliro: Kiel vi Fartas!
<quiliro>Minall: Mi fartas bone. Ĉu kaj vi?
<Minall>quiliro: Bonne!
<quiliro>Minall: Mi vidis vian blog-on.
<Minall>I'm trying to add an entry in to GDM, how can I do that on guix?, in other distros would be on /usr/share/xsession I think, but how can I achieve this on a guix system?
<Minall>quiliro: Aún no lo he publicado, pero se que te gustará... Centrate en las anteriores bitácoras..
<Minall>How can I adjust hour in guix?
<quiliro>Minall: ntp
<quiliro>Minall: o sudo date
<Minall>quiliro: thanks!
<quiliro>did you not start the ntp service on your system reconfigure ?
<Minall>I'm on doubt, I'll check it
<raingloom>hey, i'm trying to set up build offloading. what goes into guix archive --autorize? the contents of /etc/guix/ ?
<raingloom>like, what format does it expect?
<raingloom>also, i set up ssh login with an RSA key but I'm still getting some weird nondescript error when i try guix offload test
<Minall>How should I use ntp to set the time?
<raingloom>oh wait, i think i figured it out
<raingloom>it can't access the key file
<Minall>Done!, I have a good date now!
<raingloom>...wait, no, the path is definitely correct and accessible to the root user
<raingloom>which is what guix daemon runs as..... right?
<Minall>How can I add a desktop entry that GDM can read?, I want to enable EXWM, and I don't know how
<raingloom>after all, the default path for the key file points to ~root...
<raingloom>nvm, figured it out, i didn't move the public key when i moved the private one >_<
<Minall>What is the directory on guixSD where I can add desktop entries?
<raingloom>Minall, I think it's best to look at where other WMs add it, eg. i3wm
<raingloom>Minall, i3-wm defines a file in /share/applications called i3.desktop. you should probably patch EXWM to generate a similar file?
<raingloom>anyways, can anyone explain why running `guix environment --ad-hoc blender@2.79b` doesn't use the offloading that I set up????
<raingloom>I ran `sudo guix install guile-ssh` beforehand, on both machines
<raingloom>and `guix offload test` ran succesfully
<raingloom>so what the heck...
<raingloom>maybe if i use (speed 2.0).....
<raingloom>do I need to run `guix build` as root just like I had to with `guix offload test`???
<raingloom>ah, apparently i do. the docs didn't seem to mention that.... but now it's stuck on "waiting for locks or build slots" even though the server isn't doing anything??
<ngz>raingloom: I don't use offloading but it looks suspicious that you had to run `guix offload test` as root
<rain>ok, great, it started building and froze up the client machine where I was running IRC.
<rain>time for a hard reset i guess
<Minall>quiliro: I'm back!
<bavier>Minall: played any openspades lately?
<raingloom>ngz: the docs also suggest that `guix offload test` should be run as root, notice the `#` prompt
<dongcarl>Does anyone know why I can't import `(guix utils)` from `(gnu build cross-toolchain)`?
<dongcarl>I think that's one of the things that I'm really lost on
<dongcarl>The module system and how some modules can't be imported from others... And circular includes and all that
<dongcarl>sorry, more clearly why I can't import `(guix utils)` in `gnu/build/cross-toolchain.scm`
<dongcarl>This seems to be a runtime error, rather than a compile-time one
<frastanato>hello guixers! Does anyone know how to specify an input version inside an input/native-input section? Say I wanna depend exclusively on gtksourceview 3.24.10, how do I specify the version inside the ("gtksourceview" ,gtksourceview) entry?
<dongcarl>Also, should I include my name on copyright headers of every file I modify?
<bavier>dongcarl: every file where you've made material changes
<bavier>frastanato: pass a package that's pinned to that version
<dongcarl>frastanato: `gtksourceview-3`
<bavier>you may need to define one first
<zacts> <-- this looks cool
<dongcarl>It's already defined
<dongcarl>bavier: thanks
<ngz>raingloom: OK. Then I should shut up :)
<frastanato>dongcarl: omg I must have lost it in guix search
<frastanato>bavier: thanks anyway!
<dongcarl>frastanato: No I think you're confusing the "name" of a package with the guile variable name of the package
<dongcarl>The name of a package is always the same, regardless of version
<dongcarl>the guile variable names are different
<dongcarl>e.g. if you look in `gnu/packages/gtk.scm`
<frastanato>dongcarl: so guix search just displays packages name not variables names, is that correct?
<dongcarl>you'll see that there are two variables: `gtksourceview` and `gtksourceview-3`
<dongcarl>frastanato: exactly
<frastanato>dongcarl: thanks, i didn't know that
<frastanato>next time i'll grep through guix's source
<dongcarl>frastanato: Well, `guix search` tells you the line number...
<dongcarl>So you can just look there :-)
<frastanato>well silly me :D i'll pay more attention. thank you again, bye!
<janneke>dongcarl: the cross-toolchain.scm is used in the build side, see cross-base.scm
<janneke>dongcarl: as cross-base is used by "everyone" maybe just copy the target-mingw? to cross-toolchain.scm and add a comment about it
<Minall>quiliro: Kiel vi fartas!
<alloy>Hi. I'm quite lost after some hours of research. When updating my system with guix system reconfigure I get an error from grub-install which can't find lib/grub/i386-pc/ inside the store. I looked it up and can only find lib/grub/x86_64, conforming to my cpu arch. Any ideas would be welcome! Thanks
<quiliro>Mi fartas bone. Sed mi ne finis
<quiliro>alloy: have you not restarted yet?
<alloy>quiliro: I have restarted, it's just loading the old /boot/efi
<quiliro>so the new entry works but gives a non fatal error?
<quiliro>or no new entry was created?
<quiliro>alloy: ^
<alloy>There is a new entery created, it seems more like grub.cfg and the like are not updated properly
<arshin>hi guix, I installed into foreign distro with .sh script, now can't get rid of locales warning (installed them and set GUIX_LOCPATH). Here's some paste:
<alloy>quiliro: I've looked into the source of grub.scm in bootloader. As far as my basic understanding of scheme goes grub-install is called without a --target specified. The help of grub-install mentions that i386-pc is the default, so that kind of makes sense. But still doesn't really solve my problem
<rmk35>Hi all, just a newbie starting off with GuixSD (switching from NixOS)
<ryanprior>Hi rmk35 :)
<dongcarl>janneke: Okay I'm happy to copy it over, but I'm still not 100% on the concept
<dongcarl>janneke: cross-toolchain.scm is on the build side... what's the other side? The client side?
<janneke>dongcarl: yes, the guix 'client' looks at all guix code, packages and prepares a build recipe for the daemon
<mbakke>alloy: you need to use 'grub-efi-bootloader' if you are on an EFI system
<janneke>dongcarl: that build recipe is also scheme, but because it's run in a container all dependencies must be specified and copied explicitly
<alloy>mbakke: I have that in my config.scm. grub-efi@2.04 gets downloaded
<mbakke>alloy: ah, it looks like you need the regular GRUB instead of EFI GRUB
<mbakke>alloy: Does /sys/firmware/efi exist on your system?
<dongcarl>janneke: okay and the code in cross-toolchain.scm is part of the recipe, and can only refer to other modules that will also be in the build recipe?
<alloy>mbakke: oh, that could be the problem. Thanks, I will try that!
<janneke>dongcarl: right, you'll see that cross-base.scm specifies (gnu build cross-toolchain) in #:modules as part of `cross-gcc'
<rmk35>Not specifically Guix, but I feel like I need to throw this out there as it relates to the beginner experience, the included browser (default desktop configuration) often just displays a white page, though pressing Ctrl-f which brings up a search bar and makes the page render again fixes it
<dongcarl>janneke: So another way we can do the same thing is to add `(guix utils)` in `cross-gcc`?
<janneke>dongcarl: (guix utils) is much too large to copy over, maybe we can find a better place for target-mingw? so that it can be used client side and build side alike, but that's out of my comfort zone too
<janneke>dongcarl: hehe, similar thoughts
<dongcarl>Isn't there selective module importing functionality?
<dongcarl>or does the `#:modules` arugment not support that?
*dongcarl planning on adding comments so this is clearer for the future
<janneke>dongcarl: hmm, interesting thought
<dongcarl>janneke: In fact, if this is supported, we should probably explicitly `#:select` the variables we need in `#:modules` for `cross-gcc`
<janneke>dongcarl: for now, modules is a list of guile modules to be copied over -- there is something about this in the documentation here and there
<janneke>yeah, but we don't have such a feature yet
<janneke>this could be an interesting idea for the daemon rewrite in Guile
<rmk35>One thing I was wondering about, my shiny new GuixSD system takes minutes to boot, any way to diagnose that?
<dongcarl>janneke: Okay, I'll copy it over for now and add a comment, good to know the background tho!
<janneke>dongcarl: yw, good
<quiliro>rmk35: perhaps you have error messages on tty12
<nulux>heya guix
<quiliro>rmk35: Ctrl+Alt+F12
<nulux>two simple questions: 1) sheperd, how can I disable a service to not auto-start 2) how can I change the slim theme, I have one in a folder
<quiliro>rmk35: then return to gui on tty7 or tty8
<quiliro>nulux: sudo herd disable this_service
<nulux>in slim the theme option wont accept the folder
<nulux>quiliro, will this make it not start automatically on boot?
<quiliro>nulux: i suppose so... i only read the manual
<quiliro>i am not sure because everything is managed with sudo guix system reconfigure configure_file.scm
<nulux>i thought it would be something to do in config.scm
<quiliro>why don't you test it?
<quiliro>if you do not place it on your config.scm, the next reconfigure will probably enable it again
<nulux>i will test, and about the slim?
<quiliro>i do not know about it
<nulux>how to place it there?
<quiliro>no idea
<quiliro>but you may search the mailing list archives
<quiliro>if no one has asked, you could post
<quiliro>nulux: ^
<nulux>the disable service wont work on reboot
<nulux>how can I make a service *not* start on boot?
<nulux>and how can I change the slim theme?
<nulux>also... what package provides readelf? or something like ldd
<lfam>nulux: Google says that binutils provides readelf
<rmk35>quiliro: sorry, computer went to sleep as I went away to do something else, I have in my dmesg (assuming that's the same as on Ctrl-Alt-F12, which has now scrolled past boot-time stuff):
<rmk35>[ 10.339719] udevd[514]: failed to execute '/gnu/store/8bdvn1xzacvbsm5w6k8bj5rvylrjz90n-eudev-3.2.7/lib/udev/${exec_prefix}/bin/udevadm' '${exec_prefix}/bin/udevadm trigger -s block -p ID_BTRFS_READY=0': No such file or directory
<Minall>Hello guix!
<Minall>How can I share internet from a laptop to a pc via ethernet?
<Minall>On guixSd of course
<lfam>Minall: I don't have a cut-and-paste answer but it's not a Guix-specific thing. Google should have lots of solutions
<Minall>I'll look for it!
<Minall>Btw... A question that came to my mind that I always had... if an user has can use sudo, I mean, is on for example, the wheel group, isn't insecure... Isn't it best to just have the root to have all the permissions?
<Minall>Speciall on guix, since you don't need sudo to make packages...
<lfam>Is there already a standard way to handle source-only packages in Guix?
<bavier>lfam: I think often the package ends up copying the source into the output
<bavier>for uncompressed sources this is probably not great
***rmk35 is now known as rmk35_phone
***rmk35_ is now known as rmk35
<bavier>but with deduplication probably not so bad
<lfam>bavier: Yeah, it's kind of a waste. But I was wondering about things like a build system, or skipping certain phases by default
<lfam>Maybe not worth the effort yet
<bavier>afaik trivial-build-system is often used
<bavier>I think we'd want to do a survey of uses before trying to define a build system; often the needs are subtely different
<lfam>And it's a fairly rare case
<lfam>The worst part about reorganizing packages is organizing the commits and writing the commit messages
<ngz>lfam: what reorganization are you doing?
<lfam>ngz: Some Go packages
<lfam>So tempting to make one huge commit
<lfam>Thankfully I have yacc (yet another cup of coffee)
<Minall>Hello guix!
<lfam>Hi Minall
<Minall>Should I remove from my config.scm wheel to my users?, since I don't need sudo privileges to install packages...
<Minall>lfam: o/
<lfam>Minall: It's up to you
<Minall>But I mean... It is worth? is it safer like that?
<ngz>Don't you use sudo to reconfigure your system?
<Minall>Yes but, to reconfigure my sistem I can change to root using su...
<Minall>And by that
<Minall>Is worth it thouth?, or is there no problem for a normal user to have sudo privileges?
<bandali>i mean, it’s your machine, and your user, no?
<bandali>i don’t see how your user being able to sudo would be problematic
<bandali>for me typing my password when using sudo is more convenient than always remembering and typing root’s password directly using su
<Minall>I'm a little confused in the subject... I mean, is it safer to a user to not have sudo privileges, or is it actually the same?
<Minall>Yes, It can be convenient, but I don't know which one is safer, or if it does matter...
<bandali>if you’re the only user on your machine, no afaict it doesn’t matter
<ngz>Without sudo, the attack surface is smaller. So, no sudo is safer, IMO.
<bandali>unless sudo has critical bugs that lead to privilege escalation (but how often do those occur?)
<bandali>+1 to what ngz said, but it doesn’t make much of a difference practically imho
<Minall>bandali: Why it doesn't matter if I'mthe only user?, which I am btw
<bandali>of course, on a multi-user system, you’d better think twice when deciding who you want to be able to use sudo
<Minall>ngz: Thanks!, you're much help
<Minall>I see..
<bandali>Minall, because one way or another, you’re escalating your privileges to root, using either sudo or su
<Minall>So, perhaps it doesn't matter actually...
<Minall>Yep... the diference is that with su, I have to know the password of the root user, which feels just safer.
<bandali>it is true that sudo is an additional piece of software, and therefore added attack surface, but i don’t think it’s had critical security bugs often for it to make a practical difference on a personal desktop/server machine
<bandali>it’s ultimately up to you :)
<Minall>bandali: You're right, I'll have to think about it!
<Minall>Thanks guix!, you're very helpful
<bandali>fwiw i think just about every gnu/linux distro ships with sudo by default, soo…
<Minall>Oh, btw, how can add an entry that GDM would see?, for example, I want to add just a X server that starts emacs, and then start it with exwm... But I'm not sure how to do it on guix, in other distros would be, adding a .desktop file on /usr/share/xsessions, but on guix I have no clue...
<Minall>I readed the manual of X Window, and all I could see is that gdm "honors .xsession files", but I'm not sure how to use that...
<bandali>hmm, not sure off top of my head. i’d recommend looking into service definitions for GDM and/or some of the window manager packages and see if you find any clues there
<Minall>Well, I can perhaps install i3? and check where's the .desktop file?
<bandali>yeah. or look at its service definition
<Minall>like guix edit gdm?
<bandali>Minall, actually, the manual does mention /run/current-system/profile/share/xsessions
<bandali>do you see any *.desktop files there perhaps?
<bandali>and yeah i guess you could try guix edit i3-wm
*bavier just finished a package for SDCC
<bandali>fwiw, the (gnu packages wm) module is full of potential examples of how one might add desktop files
<Minall>Yes, I see 2 files, both from gnome (the only desktop I have), but I tried to add my .desktop file here, but I don't have permissions
<Minall>even with root... So I assume I have to use that of 'honors ~/.xsession files, since I can probably access that, but I don't know what should I do
<bandali>yeah i’m not sure if you’re supposed to manually edit anything in the FS root outside your home or custom partitions
<bandali>i don’t think ~/.xsession is relevant for adding entries on a display manager like GDM
<Minall>Or make a directory named .xsession and place inside it .desktop files, or just have the .desktop files in my ~, but none of it worked...
<Minall>Yep lol,
<Minall>It doesn't seem to be.
<bandali>your best bet would probably be to inherit from one of the existing wm packages (or create a new one if you need) and add the desktop file in the package definition like all the other packages
<bandali>so that when you install your package then the desktop file gets added in the right place
<Minall>Ok, I see something!
<Minall>There's something in the i3-wm package definition
<bandali>alternatively, gdm might have an option to not use the “officially defined” wm’s from desktop files, and instead run your ~/.xsession file which would then try to launch a wm
<bandali>but i’ve never tried it
<Minall>Ok... I'm not sure of this
<Minall>In the i3-wm package definition the directory '/share/xsessions/i3.desktop is showed...
<Minall>I'll try it....
<bandali>:) also, try asking on help-guix@
<Minall>Thanks bandali!, you're super helpful!
<bandali>cheers Minall :) not sure i am, but i try to be
<quiliro>guix version 588a0a335d09311197352c7f49d5541ef2717cc8
<d10n-work>I installed guix in CentOS 7 and I assume it's not preferred but I'd like to install git gui with a single command and without a configuration file. Is there a good way to do this?
<lfam>d10n-work: You can do `guix package --install git:gui`
<d10n-work>lfam: That was easy, thanks! I did some googling but didn't come across something like that
<lfam>d10n-work: The manual (specifically the section on Package Management) should be useful:
<lfam>There's actually a new command `guix install` that simplifies the command to `guix install git:gui`. I'm too old to be using it though
<ngz>Next step: "alias guix='please'" -> `please install git:gui'
<ngz>err alias please='guix' :)
<rekado>with the store on NFS I’d do “alias slowly='guix'”
*rekado –> zZZ
<d10n-work>Looks like this is part of what I needed: - and the other part I need is how to search for some program that is not in a package's default output
<lfam>d10n-work: The output of `guix package --show=git` lists the outputs