***Server sets mode: +cnt
<kristofer>I am somewhat confused about the conventional way to define the fqdn for my machine. Is the host-name field of the operating-system declaration meant to also be the fqdn? I have been trying to have exim deduce the primary_hostname automatically, but it always resolves my fqdn as localhost <kristofer>forgive my ignorance ha. I didn't have a hosts-file defined <EternalZenith>I recently switched to NixOS, which was far easier than I expected it would have been, but the more I read about, GuixSD the more I want to switch over here <EternalZenith>The only thing that is holding me back right now is package availability; how hard is it to use packages from NixOS or write a new package definition based on something from Nix or the AUR? <EternalZenith>Pardon me if this isn't the place to ask questions such as this. <atw>EternalZenith: this is a fine place! Unfortunately I can't give an authoritative answer to your question and I'm not sure how many other people are awake <EternalZenith>Also, is there anywhere else where Guix is discussed aside from here and the mailing list? The subreddit seems largely dead. <atw>Here, and there are a few mailing lists for different purposes <EternalZenith>There aren't any particular packages I see right now that I'd need aside from /the ones that are not to be discussed/, but I've found it hard to switch away from Arch after having easy access to the AUR for 4/5 of my time using Linux. <kristofer>if you're going to build some packages I find the guix environment to be super duper <EternalZenith>I wonder if it'd be possible to extend guix import to work with AUR packages in some way <atw>guix environment is a killer feature, I use --ad-hoc for non-development work often. I have used the haskell importer; it works well <EternalZenith>How much competency with Guile is necessary to do more than basic system configuration? <EternalZenith>I worked my way through the first 1.5 chapters of SICP before the schoolyear started and I became too busy to do much more <EternalZenith>Thanks, that looks nicely concise for learning the scheme way of things. <`ani`>I want to make a small list of packages that I need and see which are missing in GuixSD. <tune>I'm getting an error trying to guix pull <tune>guix pull: error: Git error: could not open '/home/brad/.cache/guix/pull/pjmkglp4t7znuugeurpurzikxq3tnlaywmisyr27shj7apsnalwq/.git/logs/refs/remotes/origin/wip-rust' for writing: Permission denied <tune>I just did a systemwide pull/reconfigure fine, but my user pull gives an error <tune>I hadn't made any changes, was just hoping to update. <roptat>tune: who owns /home/brad/.cache/guix{,/pull}? <tune>the user and group match the one I'm running it from <tune>actually, one moment, I just checked perms of the .cache/guix folder <tune>interesting, root owns wip-rust specifically if I go all the way deep <tune>if it's related to the language, I did have rust installed as a system package, but it was failing to update so I just removed it a few days ago <tune>should I delete the wip-rust file? <roptat>mh... I'd remove ~/.cache/guix entirely <roptat>it'll take some time to download everything back, but it feels safer <roptat>that removing something under a .git directory ;) <tune>I'm not really a fan of that idea, I think it could take a whole day to compile some of the stuff, like icecat... <roptat>that cache is not your local package set <roptat>actually you can probably delete ~/.cache/guix/pull <roptat>"download everything" meant "download the source repository" <roptat>that's what guix pull uses to build a new guix <civodul>tune: looks like root wrote to the user's ~/.cache/guix <roptat>tune: you did run "sudo guix pull" at some point, right? <civodul>though "sudo guix pull" is supposed to write to "~root/.cache", otherwise it's a bug <tune>I have an alias for sudo -E guix pull... etc. and then one for a regular pull + installing from manifest file <roptat>sudo -E env | grep HOME gives my user's home directory <nckx>What's the convention when A #includes <B.h> which #includes <C.h>? Add C as propagated-input of B (...ew, but that's how we handle .pc requirements, which are similar), or B as input of A (...meh)? <nckx>...s/.pc requirements/pkg-config/; not something with which to frighten Linux kernel devs. ***rekado_ is now known as rekado
<rekado>I’m having problems with channels. <rekado>one of my channels uses (guix git-download) <rekado>while resolving this Guix crashes saying “no code for module (git)” <rekado>I’d really like to express channel dependencies. Then I could say that my channel really just depends on Guix and its dependencies, or that a channel depends on another channel. <civodul>rekado: i think the (git) issue was fixed by 3c0e16391ed9a3e3e4611b940fb393c5f2ecea63 <civodul>re channel dependencies, i agree it'd be nice <efraim>What happens if we redefine functions or build systems? Maybe it needs some namespacing? <civodul>efraim: this question is valid for channels in general, right? <civodul>the answer so far is that you can't do this because Guix modules take precedence <rekado>civodul: I ran “guix pull” moments ago but got that crash anyway. <rekado>civodul: do I need to upgrade (without channels) to that Guix version first? <rekado>is commit 116af86f14f7789831d79815d5b4532afa82058c really correct? I think adding CURLOPT_CAPATH to Octave’s native-search-paths is not the right thing to do here. <runejuhl>oh, awesome with a fix for Octave, saves me from having to do it myself -- thanks a bunch Kei! <civodul>rekado: yes you first need to upgrade without channels; it's a defect <civodul>rekado: re CURLOPT_CAPATH, there was a long discussion ;-), where it turned out that Octave itself does getenv("CURLOPT_CAPATH") <rekado>(I wonder if I really do receive all emails) <rekado>can’t find that discussion in my mailbox. Hmm. <rekado>quick status update on berlin.guixsd.org: yesterday I didn’t manage to mount the external storage in GRUB. It simply didn’t appear at all. <rekado>it was only detected later while booting linux. <mbakke>rekado: I suppose GRUB or your firmware lacks a driver for the storage? <g_bor>I have a test failure form a checkout yesterday, it's gexp->derivation, store-copy, and one more in gexp. <rekado>mbakke: thanks for the link! Looks like I got unsubscribed from guix-patches a while ago… <rekado>mbakke: it seems so. I don’t know about firmware (of what component?) lacking a driver. <rekado>I also wasn’t able to find information on what GRUB module would provide support for the HBA. <g_bor>roptat: istm that the missing error message was some stale cache issue,after a make check I can see the error message. <`ani`>I want to make a quick check with GuixSD packages to be safe that my required software is available. <roptat>guix package has a --dry-run switch <`ani`>guix package: error: build failed: the group `guixbuild' specified in `build-users-group' does not exist <rekado>`ani`: you need to follow the installation instructions. <rekado>the group that should be used must be created by you during initial setup. <rekado>`ani`: you can also use the installer script to have this all set up for you, though. <rekado>huh, RHEL7 applies 260(!) patches to GRUB. <rekado>this includes “0130-May-as-well-try-it.patch” <jonsger>rekado: I guess thats kind of standard in that business. SLES12 has over 200 <demotri>I can no longer "make" my guix checkout: gzip: unbound variable. <ng0>"May as well try it" heh :D <ng0>efraim: build-system can be included from whereever on the path <ng0>that's how I prototype and dogfeed nim-build-system at the moment <rekado>demotri: do you still get this after “make clean-go” and running “./configure …”? <jonsger>could some run "guix system docker-image gnu/system/examples/docker-image.tmpl" with current guix and test if the resulting tar.gz is valid? ***aminb_ is now known as aminb
<rekado>demotri: in what environment do you do this? <demotri>rekado: guix environement guix --ad-hoc <tons of goodies here> <demotri>rekado: I'm also trying to clean clone the repository and try it again. <`ani`>how do I execute the installation script? <civodul>rekado: can we add wip-rust on berlin? <rekado>civodul: I keep forgetting how to add specifications to the database… :( <`ani`>rekado: what is that supposed to be? <rekado>`ani`: it’s a URL through which you can obtain the installer script. <rekado>I just put it there for convenience. <rekado>you can also get it as part of the Guix source code, in etc/guix-install.sh. <civodul>there's the Inputs table in addition to Specification *rekado uselessly wasted a day on visa applications and travel scheduling :-/ <`ani`>zsh: no matches found: /etc/guix* <`ani`>obviously it's missing in the Parabola package of guix. <demotri>rekado: With a clean clone, it worked. Will have to really cleanup my worktree somehow. Thanks <_tibbe>Hi, I cannot build guix for a while now because I don't have guile-gcrypt installed and `guix environment guix` does not install it. Is there a fix for this? <rekado>`ani`: I wrote that it’s part of the Guix *source code*. When you unpack the source tarball you’ll find the file in the subdirectory “etc”. Or you can download it from guix.info/install. <`ani`>rekado: that link gives me a BIN file to download though. <civodul>_tibbe: you can run "guix environment guix --ad-hoc guile-gcrypt" <civodul>_tibbe: if that fails saying guile-gcrypt is not found, then you'll have to run 'guix pull' first <ivegotasthma>is it possible to build everything from source with guix? <pkill9>yes ivegotasthma, by passing the --no-substitutes flag <rekado>ivegotasthma: that’s exactly what the build farms do that provide binaries for those who don’t want to build everything from source. <roptat>`ani`: if you're already using the parabola package for guix, why bother using the installation script? <`ani`>you said I should run the script because I needed the group. <roptat>it's better for you to run the few commands that add the build group and users <`ani`>yeah that's like a book, only a book. <roptat>then report the lack of these users to your distro or whoever provided you the guix package <roptat>(obviously they are not base system users, but they should be added when the package is installed) <roptat>ok, need to go, I'll be back in an hour or so <_tibbe>civodul: That is awkward... I have pulled yesterday and it still does not work for me. I'll try again. <civodul>_tibbe: make sure you're using the just-pulled 'guix' command (check $PATH and run "hash -r" in Bash) <_tibbe>civodul: My path was messed up. Bash found the guix in my profile and not my config. Thank you :) <taylan>does guix support passwordless login for user accounts? <ng0>is whoever's doing the gitolite service around? what's the status on it? <taylan>ng0: do you know what I need to set in the system config to make a user passwordless? <ng0>okay, I think I'll send a message on the list. I want the gitolite service for taler <kristofer>taylan: a user is not assigned a password at installation. admittedly, I have never tried to authenticate as anyone other than root without a password <taylan>ah ok, I just ran 'sudo passwd -d taylan' and it seems to work (on tty login at least, will test on graphical login in a bit) <ng0>taylan: see the documentation for the definition of users <ng0>hm. there was something about it.. not #f <ng0>i can't help right now, busy elsewhere <taylan>yeah, I checked but could only see #f. no probs, thanks :) <ng0>have you tried an empty string? I know I know how it is done, but can't recall how right now :/ <partj>hey, is there a guixsd equivalent to NIXOS_LUSTRATE? i would like to install guixsd on top of my distro, but can't seem to find any docs about that <roptat>you can install guix the package manager on top of your distro <roptat>then you can run guix system init and that should be enough to install guixsd <NoobsE>Hi, can u help me plz? How can i install github.com/lwfinger/rtlwifi_new on guixsd? There is no /lib/modules folder, ~/.guix-profile/lib also not suitable, but i need this wifi driver >_< <partj>but what about the old root? what happens to that? does it get removed or will it only be overwritten by guix but keeping the rest of the junk? <kristofer>partj: guix primarily lives in /gnu/store and builds a symlink profile for the current environment. the host distro will still exist <partj>what about /etc for example? i don't want to pollute my future distro too much <kristofer>partj: you will want a binary installation of guix rather than guixsd <kristofer>you could also run guixsd in a vm on the host machine to avoid 'pollution' <ng0>where did shpchp go in 4.18? > kernel module not found "shpchp" "/gnu/store/5a5fl0c4i2r257gani4aa41wb0xcqnyl-linux-libre-4.18.9/lib/modules" <pkill9>NoobsE: you have to use nonfree linux <ng0>if no one knows it i'll dig into it, but asking is free :) <partj>kristofer: but i do want to replace my distro with guixsd though, that's the point. nixos has a feature for exactly that, by installing it from another distro <NoobsE>@pkill9: why recompile? It's may be plugged as modeles <kristofer>partj: with some clever partitioning I'm sure you're capable of a clean instsall from a host distro. good luck <pkill9>for two reasons: the guix package definition for the kernel doesn't allow for plugging in linux modules I don't think, and two, it uses linux-libre which patches linux to stop it searching for non-free firmware, which is what rtlwifi is i think <NoobsE>See to ng0 messages - ...linux-libre-4.18/lib/modules - that what i need, but it's on gnu/store, i can't write there <ng0>compiled modules are not yet supported. <ng0>non-compiled modules are easy once you figure it out <ng0>unfortunately I can't talk about the non-compiled here, because it's just the blobs from linux-firmware. <ng0>and pkill9, don't like to such modules here. <ng0>i don't know how the others interprete the topic though.. <ng0>okay, progress on shpchp.. do we compile this in? as it changed from explicit module to compile-in <rockandska>i try to use the manifest file generated by my profile but always have the error "Wrong number of arguments" <NoobsE>Checkout manifest structure in 'info guix', there is you can find examples <NoobsE>I use (specifications->manifest ..) <rockandska>NoobsE: i will take a look, but why the manifest file generated by "guix profile" is not usable as is with "guix profile" or "guix pack", is it normal ? <NoobsE>I dont know, i just a asker, as you:) <ng0>so shpchp is not in $out/lib/modules/modules.builtin *samplet wipes sweat from brow after submitting major Haskell update. <rockandska>NoobsE: i think i've found my answer and the "manifest" can be disturbing if not the same signification depending the case... <rockandska>but despite what ludovic said at that time, i didn't seen it implented :/ <mckinley>I believe it's possible to share packages between nix and guix, is that right? Does anyone here know how to go about installing a package from nix from guixSD? <ng0>it's not trivial in some cases and you will have to get the daemon running by hand with some lines of scripts or your own service <rekado>ng0: that kernel module is no longer part of Linux. <rekado>ng0: you can tell Guix to ignore this. Or you can use the LTS kernel. <samplet>rekado: I hope it’s okay. Like I said, let me know if I can make anything easier for you. <jabranham>while we're on kernel modules, iwlwifi isn't included in linux-libre, right? <ng0>i juts reported a bug about this <g_bor_>Any luck with the grub issue on berlin? <ng0>i did not set this up with this module. if we really need it, do you know of a replacement? <rekado>ng0: also about “compiled kernel modules” being “not supported”: you *can* build more kernel modules and load them. I don’t know what you mean by “not supported”. <ng0>rekado: as soon as you require hte kernel source of the kernel you are running right now, it won't work without additional lines of code in the linux package, as discussed a while back on one of the mailinglists <mckinley>jabranham: no, iwlwifi isn't included in linux-libre <g_bor_>rekado: can we get some more information about what is used there, and what were you trying to achieve exactly? <g_bor_>only thing I know, is that there is some network storage, and grub should see a volume there. <jabranham>mckinley: thanks. I guess it has binary blobs somewhere. The driver itself is GPL AFAICT. Contemplating switching my laptop to guixsd but that driver is gonna be an issue :-( <mckinley>ng0: ah, I see. Do you know of a good write-up on the process? Or if you have the time, to detail the process of how you obtained firefox from the nix archives (I believe I saw you mention this before)? <rekado>g_bor_: it’s a server with an internal RAID controller and two HBA PCI cards. <rekado>the HBAs are redundantly connected to an external storage array. <ng0>I don't really want to share it unless I know it is okay in guix. So far I think having this kind of support for Nix in Guix is out of scope. <ng0>of course if you want an nix-service or juts a simple shell script and I am told that it is okay within guix, I will share it. <rekado>g_bor: when booting Linux the external storage is available via /dev/sdb and /dev/sdc, one node for each of the HBAs. <rekado>g_bor: unfortunately, that’s not what I see in GRUB. <jabranham>perhaps I'll just rip the nonfree wifi card out and replace it with one that works with linux-libre. <mckinley>jabranham: depending on your appetite for building packages locally, it's possible to compile the kernel yourself and add in the module manually; I do this for brcmfmac <rekado>g_bor: in GRUB all I see is the disk via the internal RAID controller. <jabranham>mckinley: that's what I just did but the compile time is... not great <ng0>mckinley: the process is, for now I have my own nix package + a nix-primitive.sh I start on demand, but I'm working towards less experimental nix support. <rekado>g_bor: I want to have /gnu/store on the external storage because it is much larger, but since the kernel is in /gnu/store it needs to be available before Linux has booted. <g_bor_>rekado: how is grub configured there? <rekado>g_bor: I can’t get support from Dell because we aren’t using GRUB from RHEL. <rekado>g_bor: we use GuixSD on that server. <rekado>(that’s why I looked at the GRUB sources as they are used on RHEL today) <rekado>g_bor: A way around this might be to copy whatever is needed for booting to the local disk, and modify the boot process to bind-mount /gnu/store from the external disk as soon as it becomes available and before any other service has been started. <rekado>but that’s not currently supported by “guix system”, obviously *rekado is very happy about the changes in wip-ui <g_bor_>rekado: most probably we ave a similar setup here, and it is not yet in the server room. I guess I can give it a try to reproduce in my office. <mckinley>jabranham: ah... yes, it is a little unpleasant. I don't know the difficulty of setting up a hydra instance, but it's been in the back of my mind how useful it would be for some of the 'extra' packages (chromium in particular, which I can't seem to get a successful build out of) <rekado>g_bor: do you have a Dell server with Dell HBAs? <g_bor_>rekado: also, is there any problem with moving off everything to the storage, and for example iscsi boot from there? <rekado>g_bor: you can test this by entering the console in GRUB and typing “ls”; this should show you more than just (hd0), but in my case it doesn’t. <rekado>I haven’t tried iscsi booting from the external storage. <rekado>actually, the goal was to set up multipath access <g_bor_>rekado: I guess so, but haven't had the chance to have a look yet, they've just arrived, and I'm not immediately responsible for this aquisition. <rekado>we only have one other system like this and it’s in production (it’s a file server) <rekado>I also can’t really do that with berlin.guixsd.org, because that would make the build farm unavailable. <g_bor_>I guess I will have at least a week to play with these, so if they are similar enough I might have a good idea... <g_bor_>we intend to use debian on them, and on of them has already an os installed. <g_bor_>I will have a look at that tomorrow. <jonsger>rekado: Dell Server with Dell HBA, which is something for SAS. is this correct? <jonsger>rekado: I could have a look at work too. We tend to have a lot of Dell hardware around...