<axd[m]>Hello fellow guix hackers. I've got a question about the tlp service/package in guixSD. I've got it running, and it's been helping me manage battery life, at least in theory. I have a thinkpad, so it's possible to install the kernel module 'acpi_call' in order to have control over one's battery charging thresholds. The issue is that I can't find a package that provides that. Anyone got that to work?
<RetardedOnion>axd[m]: acpi_call, tp_smapi,tpacpi are all not there as far as i am concerned.
<axd[m]>axd: that's unfortunate. Big difficulties with packaging them?
<axd[m]>damn, I'm the retarded onion heh. I meant to go RetardedOnion
<axd[m]>Is my battery going to wear out more if I can't have these charging thresholds?
<RetardedOnion>axd[m]: if you set the threshholds correctly, you are going to wear out faster without them
<axd[m]>RetardedOnion: Yeah, that's the assumption, seeing as that's their main use case I suppose. I used to have it at 85% max and start charging at 80%, I think it was supposed to help out but I don't really understand battery tech. Any ideas if it's hard to package this kernel module for thinkpads? Hard to believe that #1 libre hackers' laptops' battery threshold module is still not packaged on the GNU's distro.
<pkill9>speaking of thinkpads, i'm thinking of getting one, what's a decent cheap portable one with decent battery life?
<RetardedOnion>axd[m]: guix hasnt got too many packages. so dont expect everything to be there. there are headers for the 4.14 kernel in the repos. so it is possible.
<RetardedOnion>pkill9: the latest ones that arent shite are the xx30 series. x230 or t430 id say. t430 can have easy quadcores if you desire. x230 only if you have a bga rework station and a cpu that cannot be found anywhere.
<RetardedOnion>for a very cheap but still great one get a t420. you have the meme bonus as well. the cpus from ivy (xx30 series) are possible with coreboot
<axd[m]>pkill9: I have an X230 because it is the most modern one that's capable of coreboot flashing (have to use a raspberry pi externally to flash the rom chip. ~$80 investment with all the cables and an SD card if you don't have one already)
<RetardedOnion>pkill9: to replace soldered on gpus/cpus. you dont have that if you ask.
<axd[m]>I think he means that X230 has soldered cpu, so you can't install a quad core.
<pkill9>RetardedOnion: i was thinking of using it like tablet for media consumption as well as for laptop usage, but it was somewhat of an impulse purchase and i didn't research enough to find out the downsides
<axd[m]>pkill9: that's a killed feature, honestly. The utilitarian design also helps with anti-theft ;)
<RetardedOnion>if you want a t420 or a x2x0 is completely up to you. you can have a quadcore on the t. tablet on x
<axd[m]>RetardedOnion: I actually just received a new 9-cell battery for my X230. It's supposed to be new old-stock, that are genuine. What's the proper way to initialize a battery on thinkpads? Should I go starting-% -> 100% -> 0% -> 100%, and then start using it, do the reverse or do neither and just don't think about it after plugging it in?
<axd[m]>RetardedOnion: also do you use GuixSD as the main OS on your X220?
<RetardedOnion>axd[m]: boot into a tlp and tp_smapi/tpacpi_call compatible distro. boot it up, plug the battery in. sudo tlp recalibrate bat0. let it charge until 100%. set up thresholds AFTERWARDS
<RetardedOnion>axd[m]: t420 with quadcore. no i dont. i have it on a secondary ssd. it has so many missing packages which makes it really unsuitable for me at the moment. i run arch.
<axd[m]>RetardedOnion: you mean set up thresholds using tlp on debian for e.g. (that's my backup OS that's on the drive). Will they keep working even once I boot into guix that has tlp without the kernel module?
<pkill9>RetardedOnion: how much did you buy your thinkpad for?
<RetardedOnion>axd[m]: no they wont. they get cleared after a reboot. the ec does remember it in sleep
<mbakke>axd: Lithium-Ion batteries do not need any sort of "initialization".
<RetardedOnion>pkill9: germany. 80 with 900p screen. really good price. 150 is fine as well. 40 for cpu, 40 for ram
<axd[m]>mbakke: RetardedOnion: sooooo, should I do the whole tlp recalibration and setting the thresholds in debian? Do the thresholds get set in the battery firmware and would remain valid on next boot even in GuixSD? Or did mbakke mean that I don't have to do any of this at all. I don't really know how not to keep it at 100% all the time though. I'm a student so it does get some use, but sometimes it may sit in the dock for a few days
<axd[m]>without coming out, constantly plugged in. That's where the thresholds are nice from what I understand.
<axd[m]>oh I see that you said the thresholds won't stick. Is there any reason to do the `tlp recalibrate` at all then?
<RetardedOnion>axd[m]: it is not persistant between reboots as far as i know. you should recalibrate for the ec. especially if you have a xx30.
<axd[m]>Because I'm using GuixSD on my machine primarily. Debian on 20GB on the SSD for extreme cases and another debian in a VM, in libvirt
<RetardedOnion>you should recalibrate for the ec. lenovos genuine hunt hurts more than it should
<RetardedOnion>thresholds just help the battery to survive longer. recalibrating will help the ec to not give you bad information.
<mbakke>I had upwards of 20 hours for two years on a x250 9-cell without any kind of calibration.
<RetardedOnion>mbakke: he said the battery was used. also the ec improved on the xx50 series. was still shite at the xx40 series
<mbakke>It was probably good for three more years.
<mbakke>Somehow I managed to not try TLP in all these years :P
<RetardedOnion>mbakke: tlp doesnt have a background daemon. it has a service that sets thresholds. (systemd, dont know about anything else). so it cannot do that. there are udev rules if you like. it also gets triggered when connecting power, disconecting and so on.
<axd[m]>RetardedOnion, so EC where the battery firmware lives? What do you mean when you say "lenovos genuine hunt hurts more than it should"? The battery isn't used, but it's new old stock, meaning it was manufactured sometime 2014-16 (is there a way to check by the serial), and lost some capacity, just sitting in storage, according to the seller.
<RetardedOnion>axd[m]: the battery firmware lives mostly in the ec. as in every notebook. yes. it has lost capacity. that is why you should recalibrate for the ec to notice.
<RetardedOnion>lenovo tried to verify geniune batteries since the t61(i think) (so forever) and they fucked up badly. that is why you pretty much have to recalibrate them before using them. the ec isnt really analyzed at all on the thinkpad. even with libreboot it doesnt get replaced/changed in any way
<pkill9>axd[m]: did you mean to say 'killer' instead of 'killed'?
<pkill9>RetardedOnion: which packages are you missing from GuixSD?
<axd[m]>RetardedOnion: oh really? Interesting, well, I'll be back then. Thanks for the suggestions and the discussions.
<RetardedOnion>pkill9: that is true. also if you use it extensively and it gets warmer, you get noticable latency. its more fragile as well. id strongly recommend against tablets. they are fine for collectors. i actually have an x220t and an x200t.
<axd[m]>pkill9: I just realized that I messed up. The `killer` comment was actually in reference to what onion said about holding a thinkpad by the battery hump of the 9-cell battery. I have never used a thinkpad tablet in person. Although, I've seen someone use one a few years back, and I thought it was the coolest thing ever, seeing how they had the proper stylus and everything setup and were able to just "flip" and have a tablet on
<axd[m]>such a workhorse of a machine. They were using microsoft's os, so had good driver support. The tablets, I think, are bit more "proprietary" than a usual X230/220 and harder to install coreboot on, so I didn't bother. I use Emacs as my Window Manager, so it's not like I was gonna get much use out of the touchscreen, although with GNOME, it could be something. But the screen resolution remains a bit lacking.
<RetardedOnion>i dont know about gnome on a tablet. xfce is not good. kde eats a lot of power but works kinda ok. i guess. the hardware issues, coreboot compatibility and not so good screens really dont make them good machines for usage imo.
<RetardedOnion>also: batteries are smaller and not easy to get. expensive as well.
<RetardedOnion>i have a fetish for the older thinkpads. i dont own any thinkpad, but a shit ton. if you got questions about them, just ask
<RetardedOnion>doesnt really matter, its max 17w afaik. should be fine if you clean it. i got rid of my x60t a long time ago. it wasnt too warm
<RetardedOnion>good thermal paste should be fine though. thermal grizzly kryonaut should already be overkill, but its not that expensive. so get that. make sure you clean everything
<apteryx`>hello! given that the 'doc' output of gnucash is a symlink to the gnucash-docs output, shouldn't "gnucash-docs" be part of gnucash's inputs rather than native-inputs? (otherwise a gc might remove it after GnuCash is installed, right?)
<efraim>I'm working on the qt-5.11.1 update, I assume I should push it to a new branch?
<civodul>efraim: probably a qt-update branch, to isolate any issues
<snape>civodul: fixed: for some reason my primary MX (opensmtpd) didn't start after reboot. But my backup MX was working and did receive the emails, so I don't really understand why the bounces were sent
<efraim>civodul: sounds good, so far 5.11.1 is looking good
<civodul>efraim: and then just guix build everything guix refresh -l mentions, or wait for berlin/hydra
<civodul>snape: cool! this is opensmptd on GuixSD?
<civodul>"the desired level of reproducibility can be chosen freely"
<civodul>as opposed to those who impose just too much reproducibility!
<roptat>we can also build a minimal docker image :)
<rekado_>“For reproducible data science, it is crucial that software libraries and tools be provided via an easy-to-use, unified interface, so that they can be easily deployed and sustainably managed. With its ability to maintain isolated software environments, integration into major workflow management systems, and lack of requirement for any administration privileges for use, the Conda package manager is the ideal tool to ensure sustainable
<nckx>I obviously don't really like GitHub or think their ‘2FA’ adds much of value (sure, it adds some more trouble for a would-be attacker, but just by adding more trouble for the *user* which the attacker would want to impersonate).
<nckx>So I agree on the security theatre part. But as a non-phone-owner I almost believed the FUD about needing one to contribute. That's why I don't like that post.
<nckx>GitHub is already SaaS, and GitHub is already unfree, while the 2FA can actually be done with entirely free software.
<civodul>right, that's good, and it's true that the post i mentioned above assumed a phone was needed
<civodul>(which is also what i thought before reading responses)
<cryptocat1094>So, for optional features of programs, manual package overrides are the standard way, correct?
<payphone>Hello. I'm having a bit of trouble with running `guix pull` as root. The command procedes without error, but afterwords `guix system reconfigure` will not work. The error is 'guix: system: command not found.'