<lyr3`>does guix accepts any argument to use more cpu processors...It seems as I am installing it with -j1 hahahahahaaha <mange>lyr3`: There's --max-jobs, which defaults to 1. I often run --max-jobs=4 when I'm doing things. <mange>Yeah, apparently cores defaults to "0", which means it can use as many as it wants. You can use --cores to restrict how many cores Guix uses. <lyr3`>oh, my bad. I must to pass qemu some argument to use more cores! lmaaaaaaaooooooooooooooo <pkill9>How do you suspend the system from the comman line? <rekado>echo mem | sudo tee /sys/power/state <efraim>Unfortunately updating pyqt doesn't cause it to build <civodul>pkill9: FWIW i just close the lid of my laptop <rekado>I’m now using EXWM and it doesn’t reliably suspend the system when I close the lid. <pkill9>how do i put xcbgen (from xcb-proto package) in python's path so a package's build process can find it? <pkill9>how do i set an environment variable for the build process? <civodul>PYTHONPATH should get defined automatically if it's needed <pkill9>civodul: it doesn't get set by xcb-proto i don't think <pkill9>if i set PYTHONPATH manually and try to build, it works <pkill9>i guess a search path just needs to be added <pkill9>oh actually it might be just because i was using the wrong variable as an input <civodul>looks interesting but i'm not sure what to think about it <civodul>rekado: did we ever hear from uniq10 on guix-devel? <civodul>i can't even seem to find their email address <civodul>ACTION is doing a terrible job at GSoC mentoring this year :-/ <rekado>civodul: yes, we have heard from uniq10. Last email to guix-devel was on the 9th of May (“Re: Rebasing guile-daemon branch onto master”) <rekado>civodul: there was another email just to the mentors on the 16th. <rekado>civodul: GSoC and Outreachy is a lot to juggle in addition to Guix bugs. <rekado>civodul: you shouldn’t need to do much for GSoC this time. I think g_bor[m] and I have this covered. <rekado>we might need to ask for your insights on tricky daemon internals from time to time, though. ***Salt_ is now known as Salt
<civodul>rekado: oh ok, and yes, i'm happy g_bor[m] & you are taking care of things, it's a relief! <civodul>i was asking because i started merging things from 'guile-daemon' <rekado>civodul: I just took a look at “/var/run/cuirass/cuirass.db” on berlin.guisd.org and saw that it takes up 12G! Is this expected? <civodul>i suspect one problem is that we add more entries in the "Builds" table than needed <civodul>like if two subsequent evals yield the same builds, we add them twice <civodul>i've been suspecting this for a while but i never investigated much <snape>oh... org-contrib depends on qt <jonsger>civodul: so guile-sqlite3 will be a new dependency for guix? <civodul>jonsger: initially an optional dependency, but at some point it'll be a mandatory dependency i guess <rekado>supercollider does not depend on qt, but there’s an IDE/GUI using Qt. <jonsger>civodul: so we should maybe make a 0.0.1 release of guile-sqlite3. That would make packaging in opensuse a little easier <snape>rekado: to me, having something as input means depending on something <snape>but maybe I used the wrong words <rekado>snape: maybe it shouldn’t have qt as an input then. <civodul>we need someone to step up to take care of guile-sqlite3 <rekado>snape: the words were fine :) It was just a surprise to read that it depends on Qt, when I know that it shouldn’t be required. <snape>oh yes, sorry for the misunderstanding <snape>anyway, supercollider doesn't build. I'll report a bug after lunch <civodul>IWBN to have a command in Emacs-Guix that applies a patch, runs lint & build, and prepares a reply <pkill9>weird, my system froze after waking up from suspend and then i had to hard reboot <pkill9>that happened when i ran `echo mem | sudo tee /sys/power/state` <civodul>efraim: any progress on the pyqt front? matplotlib & co. depend on it <efraim>civodul: I'm going to try their dev releases <efraim>pkill9: how about 'loginctl suspend'? <adfeno>Hi all! For those who use Org mode's ox-odt: Are you able to export to ODT? <pkill9>hmm, i did it with both loginctl and `echo mem` and it didn't freeze either time <pkill9>i forgot to mention, it froze when using bspwm <efraim>Sometimes enlightenment freezes up on me, I'm not sure if its related to swapping or not <efraim>I found it was worse when I had more zram enabled <jonsger>ACTION wonders how guix-0.14 found its way to openSUSE 15.0 :) <pkill9>it coudl well be, ii've used this laptop for a long time now, and i got it used <efraim>Something I've been playing around with in my head is I think debian runs enlightenment with nice -3 so its less than just 'nice' but under general system processes <jonsger>civodul: together with Sleep_Walker, but only for Tumbleweed. the request to leap did someone else... <efraim>I think Sleep_Walker did the work, I know I wasn't really involved at all despite good intentions <efraim>One of the problems I ran into trying to bootstrap aarch64 without enabling berlin <snape>rekado: supercollider is broken since qt update. Thus the dependency isn't superfluous. <rekado>snape: we should pass -DSC_QT=off then. <Sleep_Walker>jonsger: feel free to report me bug, I'm a bit busy now but I'm interested in Guix on openSUSE <efraim>I also have fixing x265 on armhf and aarch64 on my todo list <efraim>I should spend more time with the gentoo guys, they must see every random bug <efraim>Wow, that is a nice patch, definately worth trying <efraim>I looked and looked, didn't see pyqt's or any other repo on their site <Sleep_Walker>jonsger: could you please check if your Guile packages were built using the same Guile version? <rekado>snape: we should make a separate package for the supercollider IDE and GUI. <rekado>snape: I just built it without Qt. <jonsger>Sleep_Walker: seems to be guile 2.0.14 <Sleep_Walker>jonsger: I can reproduce it in docker, but I'm afraid that it is far beyond my guile-fu <Sleep_Walker>jonsger: I'm afraid that it might be consequence of using guile 2.0 instead of guile 2.2 (which I use in my project home:sleep_walker:guile) <Sleep_Walker>jonsger: if you have spare cycles, please ask on #guile or ML <jonsger>Sleep_Walker: that's what I guessing, there goes something wrong <jonsger>Sleep_Walker: guix in tumbleweed is also failing with the same error ***Digitteknohippie is now known as Digit
<cbaines>I've just seen that Xonotic has hit master! :D <cbaines>This might not be great for my already low productivity concerning Guix patches... <civodul>speaking of patches, the RabbitMQ patches look almost ready, no? <cbaines>There is a locale issue with the service, which it logs about on startup <cbaines>Also, apart from getting the package building, I haven't poked around inside much to check if there's anything lurking in there <jonsger>home:jbrielmaier:branches:devel:languages:misc/guix but OBS seems to a bit slow today... <cbaines>but yes, I want to make some time to look at it <jonsger>Sleep_Walker: I thought it was a instruction for me :) <Sleep_Walker>jonsger: btw, please, report such issues to me if you meet it <jonsger>Sleep_Walker: me too, but get a "new" workstation and installed leap 15.0 and then I saw that guix is availabe for it <Sleep_Walker>jonsger: I tried to fix guile 2.0 problems so it got updated in Factory once again and someone sent it to Leap... <jonsger>Sleep_Walker: on friday in prag at the oSCon :) <Sleep_Walker>I added Leap 15.0 as a built target so you can verify the fix directly from devel:languages:misc <jonsger>for the next guix release we should propably package guile-sqlite3 <pkill9>why does the mpd service use port 6666 instead of the default mpd port 6600? <pkill9>i'm losign track of what i'm doing lol <jonsger>Sleep_Walker: should't we call "guix archive --authorizy > hyrda.gnu.org.pub" in the %post section of guix? <rekado>“<” instead of “>”, and also for berlin.guixsd.org.pub. <jonsger>Sleep_Walker: the patch fixes the problem on tumbleweed. I will test it on leap 15 when its ready <rekado>hey, the “etc/profile” file has two behaviours dependent on whether the GUIX_PROFILE variable is set. <rekado>e.g. when I want to enable a separate profile, why do I have to set GUIX_PROFILE to that new profile’s location before doing “source /path/to/etc/profile”? <g_bor[m]>rekado: do you know something about rukako? I might have missed some communication, but the 25th has passed. <civodul>rekado: re etc/profile: the reason the "symbolic" profile name doesn't appear in there is because otherwise profile derivations would depend on site-specific details <civodul>that is, you'd have etc/profile referring to /home/rekado <rekado>I think it would be lovely if we had a simpler command for “enabling” a separate profile. <rekado>currently this involves eval and “guix package -p … --search-path…” <civodul>the changes to 'guix environment' that davexunit proposed a while back would cover this, i think <g_bor[m]>Thanks, I have to go now. Will be back soon. <happy_gnu[m]>It gets a little hot so I am worried about having to compile <rekado>happy_gnu[m]: it’s using an i686 CPU, isn’t it? <rekado>we do support i686, but the build farm is often a little bit behind in building binaries for this architecture. <pkill9>does the mpd service set XDG_RUNTIME_DIR? <rekado>it also doesn’t have as many users as x86_64, which is why you may run into bugs that haven’t been detected by other people. <pkill9>it can't connect to my user's pulseaudio daemon session <pkill9>but it does when i run mpd as my user <rekado>pulseaudio runs as your user, but the mpd service runs as a separate user. <nckx>chewzerita: Pioneer seems to be ‘maintained’ by bavier. If they're not around, the best way to keep your bug report from getting lost in the noise is to send it to bug-guix@gnu.org. <pkill9>rekado: i specified my user in the configuration of the mpd service <lyr3>wow...10GB wont do. 20GB must do as GuixSD relies a lot on /tmp <pkill9>i put /tmp in my /home partition and then specify a bind-mount in my system's configuration <lyr3>Interesting, still, too hackish for me. I like to follow standard pattern of SysOps...meh <rekado>you only need a lot of space in /tmp if you’re compiling a lot of big things from source. <rekado>you can also simply set TMPDIR in the daemon’s environment to something that has more storage. <pkill9>i'll just leave it as it is, since it means all other software will use it <pkill9>rekado: how do you set set an environment variable in the daemon's environment? <lyr3>what is the ip alternative for ifconfig xxx up? <pkill9>what is with all the different internet adapter management programs, e.g. ip, ifconfig ,etc <lyr3>ifconfig relies in earlier implementations of kernel linux. <lyr3>most output of it are lying hahaha <lyr3>net-tools are what everyone are using... <lyr3>wow...-enable-kvm makes everything so fast and smooth <rekado>“guix environment -l foo.scm --root=$PWD/.guix-profile” is neat, but it’s also dangerous, because the resulting thing at $PWD/.guix-profile is not a real profile. <rekado>you can’t upgrade its contents, for example. <rekado>is there a better way to get an environment profile that behaves like something that was created with “guix package -p …”? <civodul>rekado: you can't upgrade because it lacks a level of indirection? <rekado>I forgot why; I just remember that this was a problem we had when developing pigx. <rekado>another unrelated thing that is mildly annoying: why do we need to add an equal sign between long option and value, e.g. in “guix package --manifest=file”? <rekado>civodul: huh, never mind. Updating the profile *does* work after all. <lyr3>verbose arguments are quite common on kernel tools...some (s/guys/people) like it. <lyr3>alias them if you can keep with their verbose <rekado>we accept only “--manifest=file”, but not “--manifest file” <rekado>(of course we also have short options) <lyr3>usually, some arguments are like" lsmod -append=xx or lsmod -a mod... <lyr3>I never see and lsmod -append xx <rekado>Python’s argparse, for example, does support “--foo bar” as well as “--foo=bar”. <lyr3>I knew haha...python boys wont like Unix traditons! <rekado>ACTION doesn’t like Unix traditions either <rekado>that’s a bit of an odd statement to make <lyr3>well...that is a pattern throughout most system admin tools <rekado>lyr3: coreutils (e.g. ls and cut) also support a space between a long option and its value. <lyr3>coreutils aint unix ...haha <lyr3>either way, you can always push yet another argument to guix package dev <rekado>I don’t understand this sentence. <lyr3>haha. you can add that option to guix package <chewzerita>For anyone reading the logs wanting to get pioneer working on guixsd: add "RendererName=Opengl 2.1" to ~/.pioneer/config.ini <rekado>ACTION goes to tend to the pumpkins. <pkill9>i can't open the manpage for feh ._. <civodul>lyr3: please avoid elusive sentences, "haha"s, and all <civodul>people are genuinely trying to help and the passive-aggressive style doesn't help us communicate better <ArneBab_work>I got an error when updating my guix emacs package, potentially because I was too impatient and aborted the checking: Symbol’s chain of function indirections contains a loop: guix-newest-available-packages [4 times] <cbaines>I'm having some issues with the new ABI checking in guix records, if a version of Guix without these changes is used to compile the Guile code, then the abi-cookie's are missing <cbaines>It would be good to release a new Guix snapshot with these changes, at least then I think I could avoid the errors by using an updated version of Guix <rekado>someone updated our emacs package, but emacs-minimal no longer builds now. <rekado>fails with “configure: error: The following required libraries were not found: gnutls” <g_bor[m]>Oops... I hope I'm lucky with that... Guix pull is running now... <rekado>oh, and now it has been reverted <rekado>with a comment that says it should probably be done on core-updates. <rekado>it only causes about 383 packages to be rebuilt, but many of them are small emacs packages. ***abbe_ is now known as abbe
<jonsger>ACTION thinks it's maybe time for proper CI builds _before_ pushing to master <nckx>chewzerita-in-the-logs: Glad to hear that you got it to work! <adfeno>Hi all: rekado: I second that request to push the patch now <adfeno>I know I'm not a developer, so please ignore the last message :D <adfeno>I just typed that because I'm somewhat on a deadline, and would like to test ox-odt from new Emacs. <nckx>adfeno: Why not apply it locally? <g_bor[m]>rekado: also CI builds is a great idea, but I have a feeling, that it is not intuitive for emacs to break emacs minimal. It would be much more acceptable the other way around... <nckx>g_bor[m]: I think intuitive is subjective in this case (I'd find an ‘emacs’ that extends an ‘emacs-minimal’ that itself is ‘regular emacs’ with bits removed to be... unintuitive at best). I wonder, though, wether ‘guix refresh -l’ should consider inherited packages to be dependents and how this could be done. <nckx>ACTION has a very ugly WIP somewhere that (ab)uses the properties field to do so. <g_bor[m]>Most probably part of then confusion arises from the fact, that package relations are not easily mapped to iheritance... It would be nice to have a tool to examine inherited packages. <nckx>Right! My reference to guix refresh was simply because ‘guix build `guix refresh -l $foo`’ is 99% of my ‘CI’ solution, but wouldn't have caught this case, and I hacked it to do so. <nckx>ACTION should not be rambling on IRC when completely distracted, sorry. <rekado>atw: this is about emacs-minimal, isn’t it? <rekado>soundtoxin: do you get the same error when replacing the deprecated “title” fields? <soundtoxin>rekado: I don't know how to do that, and it looks like the area effected is related to file systems, so I'm nervous to screw it up. <soundtoxin>looks like it's all the lines that start with (file-system or (file-systems <soundtoxin>is there just a new similar term I should put there? <atw>rekado: I don't think so. I was trying install emacs produced by the linked package definition. Not at all urgent or anything, just curious to me <nckx>soundtoxin: Unless you have good reason to suspect you won't be able to just roll back to a working generation, don't be too nervous. <g_bor[m]>rekado: What should be done with the title fields? I can't find this information... <soundtoxin>that's a good point, I guess, but avoiding problems in the first place sounds even better to me <rekado>soundtoxin: have you looked at the latest version of the manual yet? <nckx>Just replace (device "my-label") (title 'label) → (device (file-system-label "my-label")) <rekado>“device” also supports uuids with (device (uuid "4dab5feb-d176-45de-b287-9b0a6e4c01cb")) <nckx>For anyone interested in the diff: 9ceeca0880248eee8c2796f5e6ebc172b95277f7 <nckx>Right, but best to change one thing at a time. <nckx>soundtoxin: Mad propz for posting a PNG screenshot of your configuration file. Unfortunately Icecat won't load it. <soundtoxin>I've heard people don't like screenshots of text, but it's never bothered me <rekado>the font is a bit too small when viewed on my laptop display, makes it hard for me to read it. <rekado>atw: emacs 26.1 builds fine for me. <g_bor[m]>I am confused... how do I access the latest manual... <rekado>it’s just emacs-minimal that fails unless you pass “--with-gnutls=no” as a configure flag. <nckx>rekado: I'm still trying to not be disappointed by mu4e. Trying eww will have to wait. <rekado>g_bor[m]: e.g. with Emacs: C-u C-h ~/dev/guix/doc/guix.info RET <rekado>hmm, the error messages don’t look much better :( <soundtoxin>yeah, just lost the title-related bits at the top <soundtoxin>but it's still talking about fstab at the bottom <rekado>soundtoxin: is this Guix from a git checkout? Or are you using “guix pull”? <soundtoxin>I do sudo guix pull && sudo guix system reconfigure /etc/config.scm <g_bor[m]>I just tried info guix after a guix pull... <rekado>g_bor[m]: “guix pull” currently only installs the latest Guile modules. I don’t think it updates the manual (or the daemon). That’s a know defect. <g_bor[m]>Oh,fine my bad... I remember reading something about that. Thanks anyway... <rekado>it’s very unfortunate, because we also don’t publish the latest version of the manual online. <atw>ah, ok, the elisp packages in my manifest were pulling in emacs-minimal, whose build fails on guix@bb82c3d42. Thanks rekado! <soundtoxin>huh? this sounds like a somewhat serious and confusing issue <soundtoxin>I'll admit I rarely look at the manual anyway, but I'd feel a little safer if I had a modern version of it <rekado>nckx: you do get the latest version of the manual when running “guix pull”? <nckx>rekado: I meant: ‘where do you get the latest manual then? git?’ → ‘I do’. <rekado>soundtoxin: I usually get it from git, yes. <rekado>soundtoxin: but that’s just because I use Guix from git anyway. <soundtoxin>so since my reconfigure fails right now, a reboot would just boot the last-working configuration automatically, right? <nckx>Things get risky when the error happens later in the process, but at the syntax-barfing level you're usually safe. <rekado>we had it a few commits ago, then it got reverted. ***snape` is now known as snape
<snape>do we have a place that references ideas of easy (or not so easy) contributions? <snape>for people who want to contribute but don't know what to do <nckx>ACTION can't get the new file-system syntax to work either... <nckx>Is there a(n easy) way to tell Guix/Guile not to ellipsise error messages? <nckx>In unknown file: 1 (find #<procedure 7f96e1c34368 at gnu/system/linux-ini…> …) 0 (string-prefix? "ext" () #<undefined> #<undefined> #<u…> …) is not helpful. <g_bor[m]>nckx: I'm also interested in that... It would make debugging easier... <g_bor[m]>rekado: I remember something about this manual not updated thing, can you tell me why is this so? <nckx>ACTION will take a non-easy way too, but can't imagine the current default ever being useful. <atw>snape: I'd be interested. I have at least one thing that's potentially low-hanging fruit <roptat>is there a way to "grep" a file in guile? <roptat>in a package I need to find every java file that contains "@Named" <g_bor[m]>snape: I believe we have some bugs in the tracker marked as easy. However this flag is not used consistently. <snape>g_bor[m]: yes, but I was thinking about things that are not bugs. <roptat>and then I need to write their names in a file <pkill9>is 60 degrees CPU temperature bad? <nckx>pkill9: Depends entirely on the chip? It's high but not dangerous on your average x86-alike. <nckx>pkill9: Running ‘sensors’ (from the lm-sensors package) should give you a ‘high’ and ‘critical’ reference temperature. <nckx>Usually a lot higher than 60. <rekado>g_bor[m]: it’s just because of the way “guix pull” is implemented. <pkill9>the critical temperatur is a lot higher than 60 degrees <rekado>g_bor[m]: it currently only builds some Guile modules and makes them available at ~/.config/guix/latest. <rekado>g_bor[m]: we would need a different “guix pull” to include the manual. <rekado>g_bor[m]: civodul and I are aware of this problem, and I’m positive there’s a bug report about an overhaul of “guix pull” to address this. <rekado>civodul: how do you find the relevant bugs so quickly? <rekado>I find it difficult to find bug reports with M-x debbugs-gnu <jlicht>+1 for expert tips on using debbugs effectively ;-) <civodul>rekado: it's just that i knew what keywords to look for :-) <rekado>I should resume work on … what was it called… mumi? <pkill9>anyone know why libcurl isn't reading certs from /etc/ssl/certs even though it finds the file there? I got that issue with weechat and now mpd <civodul>i'm sure you could quite easily recruit people to work on it <civodul>nckx: could it be that you did not recompile everything that uses (gnu system file-systems)? <jlicht>how do people build their recently pulled, but potentially very much unstable guix git repo's? <jlicht>I currently have a 'normal' guix that I use to build my git repo which I update in lockstep with the actual repo, which while functional seems a bit clunky <vagrantc>i've often pondered if the latest symlink shouldn't be versioned much like the user-profiles and system profiles links <janneke>jlicht: i'm using multiple git worktrees <civodul>jlicht: same as janneke, and i just run "make" <vagrantc>i've occasionally had an update go badly enough and pretty much had to pick a guix at random and hope. <janneke>i only update ~/src/guix after ~/src/guix-master built correctly <janneke>yeah, that rarely happens, but when it does...such a waste of time <nckx>civodul: That's possible. I'll try recompiling. Thanks. <jlicht>civodul: ever the Fearless Leader ;) <vagrantc>ACTION still slightly nervously but mostly boldly pulls <jlicht>I will try to work it out with the worktrees, although it is getting a bit out of hand (guix-system, guix, guix-core-updates, ...) <vagrantc>ACTION has a few patches that need following up still <janneke>ACTION has 2 worktrees for wip-bootstrap <cbaines>I also just pull, but I don't use multiple worktrees... it does mean that when I change branch, I do lots of Guile recompiling, maybe I should try using worktrees <civodul>i've come to use quite a few worktrees <jlicht>when is the next core-updates -> master merge? <nckx>Seriously: once you try worktrees, it's very unlikely you'll look back. It's very likely you'll wish you'd switched much earlier. <janneke>come to think of it; why is it that: git clean -fdx; make; would take considerable time? <janneke>worktrees are parallel checkouts from the same .git in separate directories <janneke>quite similar to multiple git clone's, but you don't have to pull patches from one .git to another <snape>so rekado can I push my first patch that removes IDE support to supercollider? That would at least fix the build. <pkill9>is there something i could use to test libcurl/ <snape>(I should add that I don't have time to do another patch for the IDE :p) <rekado>snape: I don’t object, but I don’t use supercollider. <rekado>I don’t know if the IDE is important. <vagrantc>janneke: and it's a little late, but was thrilled to see your report on mes 0.14. so excited to see it progressing! <rekado>it would be nice if we could build it separately, but maybe that’s for later. <janneke>ACTION feels happy and wants to note that all support is so helfpul! <rekado>to make us not feel too bad about removing this feature, would you mind sending an email to bug-guix@gnu.org about this, just so that we remember adding it back at some point? <janneke>vagrantc: just built my first m4-boot using tcc-boot -- it runs but buggy <rekado>pkill9: libcurl on its own doesn’t read anything. <lyr3>pkill9: my feh man page is working fine <rekado>pkill9: users of libcurl are expected to configure it to read the cert bundle from some location. <janneke>vagrantc: working up to building gcc, first build all its dependencies <rekado>pkill9: exactly how that is done depends on the application. <cbaines>Ooh, Guix must have got a new version of magit recently, as restarting Emacs has given me the % key to do worktree stuff! <rekado>pkill9: so you’re better off investigating how the application itself sets the bundle location. <vagrantc>janneke: getting that far ... wouldn't have even thought it'd be something to seriously talk about a couple years ago :) <janneke>vagrantc: i've been hacking hard for 2y straight and got a lot of unexpected help <vagrantc>janneke: sorry that i don't have much skill to contribute, just enthusiasm :) <janneke>enthusiasm and support, spreading the word/idea, is so important -- please don't under estimate that <lyr3>did you guys got pdf-tools to work?...still dont know which packages are to be installed <lyr3>my bad. Yep, I prefer to build it through (use-package) <jlicht>lyr3: use-package should work with guix-managed emacs packages <lyr3>jlicht: it does work. well, time to find each package pdf-tools requires to build <pkill9>hmm i can't seem to read manpages of any package in guix environment <pkill9>$MANPATH doesn't seem to get set <civodul>pkill9: for MANPATH to be set in 'guix environment', you need to add man-db to the environment <civodul>otherwise guix doesn't know about MANPATH <jonsger>janneke: did I told you how amazing lilypond is? <rekado>lyr3: I strongly recommend using Emacs packages from Guix, especially for more complicated packages like pdf-tools. <lyr3>rekado: I agree. it aint compiling correctly.. <janneke>jonsger: not sure, you just did anyways -- thanks!!! <janneke>jonsger: i had an amazing life for ~15y working on that together with my dear friend hanwen <jonsger>It's a shame that I discovered the Mutopiaproject just recently... <janneke>oh yeah i thought that might grow to be more important than lily itself <rekado>lilypond is the foundation of my composition workflow. <rekado>Scheme engravers allow me to generate custom Chapman Stick “stafftab” notation. <lyr3>I think I will create some guix custom packages... <janneke>when this mes/bootstrapping stuff is done, i'd like to create a gui for lilypond that enables mouse-shovers to use lily and inspire them to use their keyboard to enter music <rekado>janneke: my partner uses frescobaldi as a GUI for lilypond. How would the GUI differ from that offered by frescobaldi? <snape>rekado: any source and example of that Chapman Stick? <rekado>snape: erm… you mean… a recording? Or a notation example? <snape>I meant a pdf with the output and the source :-) <snape>I've done some Lilypond a few years ago, but I didn't dig into the Scheme code <rekado>the stick parts are in stafftab notation. The shapes of the note heads encode the finger. <rekado>every note also has a string marker that indicates which of the twelve strings the finger should be placed on. <rekado>the note lines double as string indicators. <rekado>the numbers above the notes show the frets. <rekado>the string markers are shifted according to the shape of the fretting hand <rekado>I have a somewhat complicated makefile to produce full scores like that pdf but also per-instrument scores. <snape>yes I can imagine. I thought you had written Scheme code, but I misunderstood <rekado>it’s great for rehearsals (in theory, i.e. if people came prepared ;)) <rekado>that’s the code of the custom engraver <rekado>I play all of them, but for the recording I’ll just play the stick + sing. <snape>impressive. You must have spent so much time doing that <snape>oh you submitted the engraver, of course <rekado>most of the time is lost on rewrites. I easily get bored by the songs, so this happened very often :-/ <rekado>I’ve got all of the songs for this album as lilypond scores in a git repo. <snape>and what about the recordings? :-D <rekado>the drummer is preparing to move to the US, but he really really wants to finish laying down the drum tracks before then. <rekado>don’t know if that will happen, but hard deadlines like this are a blessing. <rekado>(without them we would never ever get anything done) <snape>yeah, so hopefully you'll get it done and recorded <rekado>maybe by the end of this year if all goes well. <pkill9>i wish i knew why libcurl says no CAfile or certs when strace says it reads it <snape>got it. I'll check elephly.net from time to time then :p <rekado>I’ll certainly announce it there to the two or three occasional readers. <rekado>pkill9: do you have a test case that I could try to reproduce? <rekado>pkill9: I assume you have set all the common SSL environment variables? <janneke>rekado: last time i checked, in frescobaldi you use the keyboard to enter .ly, not the mouse like in commercial programs <lyr3>cant find cc under guixSD anyone knows which package is to be installed <janneke>rekado: installing frescobaldi to check, but sadly it's building QT <pkill9>rekado: i'm writing a command that you can use to see if you can reproduce the issue <rekado>lyr3: there is no “cc” executable, but many makefiles accept CC=gcc <rekado>lyr3: to use the GCC compiler toolchain you only need the gcc-toolchain package. <lyr3>rekado: that is it! haha thanks <rekado>janneke: yes, in frescobaldi you can use either type of keyboard: a computer keyboard or a MIDI keyboard. <pkill9>rekado: this will make a temporary directory, run weechat with that directory as the session directory, and run '/script' when it runs weechat which on my system gives an error that it cannot find CAfile: mkdir /tmp/weechattest && guix environment --ad-hoc weechat -- weechat --dir /tmp/weechattest --run-command /script <rekado>pkill9: thanks. Give me a moment and I’ll try it. <snape>oh I remember you talked about it months ago <pkill9>it's for downloading plugin scripts from the weechat website <pkill9>it tries to download a list of plugins when you run it <pkill9>i ran it with strace and it reads the global CAfile successfully <pkill9>someone here was helping me debug it <rekado>yes, I see in strace that “gnutls_ca_file” is set to a valid file. <rekado>but that’s for gnutls; it’s not necessarily used by curl. <rekado>I also don’t see any code in weechat that would configure libcurl to set the CAfile. <rekado>URL_DEF_OPTION(CAINFO, STRING, NULL), <rekado>that’s done #if LIBCURL_VERSION_NUM >= 0x070402 /* 7.4.2 */ <rekado>we may need to patch the weechat code in src/core/wee-url.c to make sure that CURLOPT_CAINFO is given a value, preferably the return value of getenv("SSL_CERT_FILE") or similar. <pkill9>do all programs that use libcurl need to set CURLOPT_CAINFO? could curl specify the default certificates store as /etc/ssl/certs like gnutls does? <rekado>pkill9: yes, that’s possible, but there are drawbacks to doing this. <rekado>it also makes it impossible for unprivileged users to change the set of certificates. <janneke>rekado: ah, midi keyboard -- i managed to run frescobaldi <janneke>the guix i envision would make it possible to click on a staff with your mouse, and enter notes like that <janneke>i think it's *really* clumsy, but that's how most people create music with a computer <rekado>ACTION also always writes GUIx when trying to write “GUI” ;) <janneke>using midi keyboard is probably the best, second best is keyboard; most choose for mouse-shoving <rekado>I used the mouse long ago before I knew anything about notation. <janneke>rekado: that's what i think and hope: awareness, awareness, awareness <rekado>most important was the fact that it played the note as I dragged across the staff. <janneke>people do and use what they see or are indoctrinated to do <rekado>I let go of the mouse as soon as it sounded right. <rekado>but a MIDI keyboard would have been far superior. <pkill9>rekado: why would setting a default path to CA bundle prevent users settings their own? <rekado>pkill9: it wouldn’t necessarily do that. But libcurl will just pick the default if none other is specified. <janneke>not everyone owns one -- i bought one once, pretty expensive but great piano, and it turned out its midi was not compatible with linux <pkill9>i found a configure option for curl --with-ca-bundle, i'll try inheriting curl and adding that config flag and using that as input for weeechat <pkill9>i didn't think of that because i was under the impression the CA bundle stuff was being handled by gnutls <rekado>janneke: yeah, I bought a Doepfer with 88 hammer keys from my music teacher later. It was really lovely, but much too heavy :) <rekado>now I use a very cheap USB MIDI keyboard. <pkill9>thank you for helping debug rekado <rekado>pkill9: I think we should do something about the libcurl defaults. 