IRC channel logs


back to list of logs

<OriansJ>janneke: Your improved build notes really do make much more sense and I think I'll be able to make progress with them
<OriansJ>sneek: later tell janneke that there is a proto-makefile for him to pull for MES. There are a couple missing pieces I still need input for.
<sneek>Will do.
<OriansJ>sneek: botsnack!
***ntm is now known as notthemessiah
<notthemessiah>Is it just me, or do the instructions for installing GuixSD in a QEMU VM provide you with not enough space?
<notthemessiah>It suggested 5GiB for the image size, but I filled up a 4.5 GiB partition with guix system init /mnt/etc/config.scm /mnt
<notthemessiah>I cped the desktop config
<Apteryx>notthemessiah: Ish, do we really advise 4.5 GiB for a full desktop?
<Apteryx>I'm using dekstop-minimal and it can fill this easily.
<notthemessiah>qemu-img create -f qcow2 guixsd.img 5G
<janneke>morning Guix!
<sneek>janneke, you have 1 message.
<sneek>janneke, OriansJ says: that there is a proto-makefile for him to pull for MES. There are a couple missing pieces I still need input for.
<notthemessiah>It's not advised specifically for a full desktop though, but I had expectations when formatting that an install wouldn't be significantly bigger than the unpacked USB image
<brendyyn>Mine's 11.5GiB and I haven't even finished installing everything :/
<janneke>sneek later tell OriansJ: yay i'm really happy we are coming together here, and wow that looks super simple -- what an improvement, thank you!
<sneek>Will do.
<Apteryx>notthemessiah: Right. We should revisit this part and bump the requirements.
<Apteryx>My system is installed of a 37 GiB partition and I find myself running 'guix gc' more often than I'd lke.
<Apteryx>notthemessiah: You can bring it up on '' so we don't forget about it.
<notthemessiah>also, coming from Nix, where the virtualbox appliance is ~1GiB. I'll try the mailing list.
<OriansJ>I am glad you like it janneke
<sneek>OriansJ, you have 1 message.
<sneek>OriansJ, janneke says: yay i'm really happy we are coming together here, and wow that looks super simple -- what an improvement, thank you!
<OriansJ>oh and it actually builds slightly faster, since your previous version seems to repeat steps
<janneke>the snarfing (build-aux/mes-snarf.scm) still misses but we may have to rethink that anyway
<janneke>haha -- yes, make is just way too difficult for me
<janneke>(or i'm too difficult for make)
<OriansJ>janneke: you certainly know how to abuse make in some rather interesting ways
<janneke>hopefully i'll get to redo make in guile some day and make it real simple, correct, robust -- like guix
<OriansJ>janneke: that'll be fun to see
<janneke>ACTION needs to go afk fora bit, bbl
<reepca>Anyone happen to be using a relatively recent AMD GPU on GuixSD with more than one display?
<Apteryx>reepca: Sorry... Wouldn't anything recent from AMD or nVIDIA require blobs to initialize?
<reepca>Apteryx: As far as I've read, it requires blobs to "make hardware acceleration possible" (found that out when I got 10 FPS using llvmpipe on accident to test 0ad). So I'm not sure to what extent it's supposed to be usable without the blobs. My displays are at full resolution (1600x1200), but they're just duplicated and xrandr is... acting strange.
<Apteryx>reepca: OK. Maybe you should look on the side of the mesa and or linux-libre projects to get answers on the state of things.
<reepca>Apteryx: will do, thanks
<brendyyn>Do any of the Guix packages like icedtea have OpenJDK7 in them?
<rekado>brendyyn: all of the icedtea packages provide the JDK
<rekado>(use the “jdk” output)
<rekado>“icedtea-7” (i.e. icedtea version 2.6.10) provides the jdk7.
<rekado>the version mapping is a bit weird.
<rekado>icedtea 1.x -> jdk 6
<rekado>icedtea 2.x -> jdk 7
<rekado>icedtea 3.x -> jdk 8
<brendyyn>ok, thanks
<civodul>Hello Guix!
<sneek>civodul, you have 1 message.
<sneek>civodul, paroneayea says: in case you didn't see, I know you wished you got one of the Guix shirts last time, and sirgazil put them up here:
<civodul>heya brendyyn
<civodul>oh there's even Guile stuff there :-)
<brendyyn>Lately I have so many ambitions for Guix that I do not know where to start!
<civodul>heheh :-)
<brendyyn>I actually want to go beyond software and make services that automatically mirror and host archives like the Gutenberg Library
<ng0>with the help of links that should be easy.. and in general depending on the archives used (not at it can be done in a generic way
<brendyyn> links?
<ng0>well project gutenberg is also on
***boegel|afk is now known as boegel
<brendyyn>Once issue is that it's a bit weird to have such things in /gnu/store, and one cannot use rysnc on /gnu/store to update archives
<ng0>newer version of my static websites are server from /gnu/store/… but for very large archives, I don't know
<ng0>I thought you meant a service as in system-service and this is not limited to /gnu/store
<brendyyn>I wonder if it's possible for rsync to use multiple sources for delta transfer
<brendyyn>ng0: Yeah, a system service, or run as a regular user. then I guess it's most sensible to have the data in their $HOME, but I would also like to use Guix's ability to create symlink forests, but from that home directory instead of /gnu/store
<brendyyn>Like, just use that part of Guix like GNU stow... or jus use GNU stow?
***Guest47600 is now known as sturm
<ng0>if there is something which can be downloaded, it can be made into a package. the service part, that's just a matter of rsync, wget or whatever the other end can use
<ng0>I have to go
<Digit>ACTION hopes gnutls doesnt stand in his way this time attempting to update his guixsd and install stuff like git, so he can easily get his fonts package added, so emacs can become legible and useable, so he can have a convenient pleasant environment, while switching from devuan to gentoo on the other machine.
<Digit>nope. k. no idea what to do to get past this. pls excuse my guix noobness. paths of potential remedy did not jump out at me from numerous reads through man pages and the various guix * --help outputs
<reepca>for starters, what command are you running that runs into that error?
<Digit>erm, if i recall, that was the tail end of the output from guic package -i git. but it's been similar for other commands too. currently giving guix pull another shot.
<civodul>rekado: "./pre-inst-env guile -c '(use-modules (gnu packages gcc))'" fails on master, following the recent cross-base changes
<civodul>not sure why
<Digit>yup. even guix pull ends on that same make fails for gnutls. *sigh*
<efraim>`guix environment guix -- guix pull'
<Digit>ACTION will try that next, once this current attempted command finishes failing
<rekado>civodul: oh :(
<rekado>civodul: I can reproduce this.
<rekado>I can load (gnu packages cross-base) just fine, though.
<rekado>Digit: I have no problem with fonts in emacs. Have you tried “fc-cache -f”?
<rekado>civodul: I’m running “make clean-go && make” now, just in case
<Digit>rekado: nah, that's no big mystery problem for me really. just a matter of having copied over my config, and having not yet copied over my fonts. which i then went to git from my repo, n discovered having no git, that git wouldnt install, n guix was in need of sorting out... which it's hopefully doing now thnx to the command suggested by efraim. :)
<rekado>civodul: Guile has no problem compiling the (gnu packages gcc) module.
<rekado>the only problem is loading it?
<rekado>I’m having a problem: I imported as many packages as I could from CRAN and put them into a single (gnu packages cran) module.
<rekado>the problem is that this module is *huge*
<rekado>it’s 250k lines.
<rekado>and that’s before breaking up all descriptions into multiple lines.
<rekado>I’m beginning to build packages from that module one by one
<civodul>rekado: the only problem is loading, yes
<civodul>congrats re CRAN :-)
<rekado>is a really big (gnu packages cran) module something we can accept?
<rekado>it would be quite a bit bigger than (gnu packages python)
<civodul>rekado: we'd have to fix the compiler memory consumption issue before that
<rekado>but that’s a fix we need in Guile
<rekado>in Guix we can only work around the problem by compiling every module with a different process.
<civodul>though that would take even longer
<efraim>perl.scm is alphabetized, do we want to do that to python.scm also? Or we can stick with unofficial clustering
<efraim>Which somehow reminds me, I have to figure out qtlinguistics
<rekado>perl.scm actually also has clusters IIRC
<jlicht>hello guix!
<civodul>hi jlicht!
<civodul>rekado: i just pushed a cute little fix for the gcc circular-dep issue :-)
<jlicht>How can I get a cross-compiler toolchain on my x86_64 machine, targeting an for example some ARM device?
<Digit>hrm. no joy yet from that run of "guix environment guix -- guix pull". still complained about gnutls.
<efraim>civodul: I've been working from the firefly board, currently working two builds at once, webkitgtk in under 6 hours, but flashing it is terrible
<rekado>civodul: this works: ./pre-inst-env guile -c '(use-modules (gnu packages cross-base) (gnu packages gcc))'
<Digit>methinks next time, i'll tee output to a file i can upload n link.
<Digit>in general, does guix(sd) dislike being neglected for months before upgrading? ... just wondering if that's a factor. ~ rather than my other suspicion it's something i did prior to the weeks long hiatus from guix.
<jlicht>Digit: In general my experience with my netbook and GuixSD has not been stellar, as I only use it once every 5 months or something
<Digit>prly something i did then. yep. heh.
<jlicht>and of course, I should be updating regularly if only for the sake of security updates ;-)
<jlicht>I think this is still being addressed before the Big Bad 1.0 anyway, but if you have any specific issues you could always send a bug report to the ML.
<efraim>Digit: I didn't realize it had been a while, there's been a change somewhere and you'll have to run guix pull against a specific commit to help get you back up to speed
<efraim>rekado: do you know which commit it is?
<civodul>efraim: firefly is the aarch64 board?
<rekado>civodul: thanks for the fix!
<efraim>Its the newest one I just bought, it was on kickstarter, 4 GB RAM, 4xA53 and 2xA72
<efraim>As a kickstarter thanks I got 128 GB of emmc and I'm running off of that
<efraim>Otherwise it is 32 GB of emmc
<efraim>I think with the 6 cores its actually faster than the thinkpad x120e I had before
<jlicht>civodul: RE the js minification, I think we should at some point decide for JS wether to offer some standard build functionality ourselves (via e.g. a DIY guile approach, or a blessed package)
<jlicht>think of minification, tree shaking, packing files etc.
<jlicht>the problem here is of course that our 'object code' will significantly differ from what everyone else on planet Earth uses
<jlicht>so we might run into a whole host of undiscovered bugs that will be very hard to trace
<civodul>rekado: yw!
<civodul>jlicht: i know little about this topic, but surely there's a minifier somewhere that we could package?
<civodul>as opposed to writing our own
<rekado>I worked on a minifier
<rekado>written in CL
<jlicht>civodul: The issue I was referring is that we would use a different minifier than the author of some packages, and in that way run into arcane bugs.
<jlicht>rekado: for js?
<rekado>jlicht: yes
<jlicht>rekado: I'd love to give it a spin. Do you have a link?
<rekado>just a moment
<rekado>I just found my patches
<rekado>will see if they still build
<jlicht>civodul: regarding the gexps-based build systems, am I correct in assuming that any modification to this part of guix leads rebuilding everything?
<OriansJ>sneek: later tell bms_ that I am looking forward to his next update on Coquillage
<OriansJ>sneek: botsnack!
<rekado>jlicht: I successfully built cl-uglify-js
<rekado>… but I don’t know how to use it
<rekado>I don’t even know how to bring the procedures it provides into scope
<rekado>tried (asdf:load-system :cl-uglify-js) and that returns T, but the procedure “ant-gen-code” is not in scope.
<jlicht>rekado: Interesting. Is this a packages that is already available somewhere online, or do I need to package it still?
<rekado>I’ve packaged it; still need to send to the mailing list.
<rekado>I don’t know how to install it without using Guix
<jlicht>rekado: Isn't that Guix' end-game ;-)?
<rekado>ah, got it
<rekado>had to enter the package
<rekado>seems to work
<rekado>just ran it on one of my js files
<jamesrichardson>oh my, just tried to perfrom an efi install on a new laptop. I have a grub-isntall error: /gnu/store/...grub-2.02/lib/grub/x86_64-efi/ doesn't exist. Please specify --target or --directory. Wonder what I left out of the config.scm... Rereading the manual.
<brendyyn>Does changing an input to a propagated input not change a packages derivation?
<samplet>Is there an easy way to use Emacs packages in an ad-hoc environment?
<samplet>Just running `guix environment --ad-hoc emacs-*` doesn’t get the packages in Emacs’ `load-path`.
<samplet>I’m thinking about modifying my init.el file to fix this dynamically, but maybe there’s an easier way.
<catonano>samplet: you have to include Emacs in your ad hoc environment
<catonano>samplet: if you don't
<catonano>ten te Emacs your're callnggg is from outside the env and has no access to te modules IN the env
<samplet>catonano: Right. I think I’ve tried that, but I’ll give it another shot to be sure.
<samplet>catonano: That doesn’t seem to make a difference. Even including Emacs and running `$GUIX_ENVIRONMENT/bin/emacs` doesn’t help. Is it possible the package is broken? I’m trying to play around with Clojure, so I’m looking at emacs-cider and emacs-clojure-mode.
<samplet>catonano: I’m trying some other Emacs packages to see if they work.
<samplet>catonano: Same problem with emacs-yaml-mode and emacs-markdown-mode.
<catonano>samplet: did you include Emacs in your ad hoc env ?
<catonano>samplet: ah I read now
<samplet>catonano: Yes. I tried --pure, too.
<catonano>mmm I don't know. I would suggest you to write on the help mailing list
<samplet>catonano: OK. Thanks anyway. I will bang my head against it a bit more and then write to the list if I’m still stuck.
<paroneayea>huh weird
<paroneayea>guix package: warning: Your Guix installation is 233 days old.
<paroneayea>that doesn't seem to be accurate
<paroneayea>I'm running guix from git?
<paroneayea>but I guess I'm doing the ln -s ~/devel/guix ~/.config/guix/latest
<rekado>paroneayea: yeah, you may need to refresh the link
<rekado>gah, I tried to write a wrapper around cl-uglify-js, but sbcl has weird behaviour.
<rekado>I temporarily redirect *standard-output* and *error-output*, but sometimes it just goes totally silent, even outside of the let binding.
<rekado>really frustrating
<rekado>also, (require :asdf) does not work when it isn’t in the top lever.
<Digit>how might i go about finding the specific commit i'm to pull to overcome this blockage i^ve been having? (and what command?~ what/where might i add to, presumably: "guix environment guix -- guix pull") or might i just be better off reinstalling from scratch? :/ ... havnt really got anything plushed up n configured yet. dont even have most of my basics installed yet.
<Digit>ACTION goes for a walk, to take a break from the increasingly stressful predicament
***andreh1 is now known as andreh
<user_trisquel>Can I update from GuixSD 0.12.0 to 0.13.0?
<efraim>Digit: try 'guix pull --URL=
<brendyyn>user_trisquel: yes
<user_trisquel>brendyyn: Update Guix?
<user_trisquel>Then why make GuixSD releases?
<user_trisquel>I think GuixSD is rolling release.
<slyfox>among other things to shrink a gap from release to current state when you install a new system
<brendyyn>All sorts of reasons...
<brendyyn>For example, soon there will be a ncurses based installer, maybe in 0.13.1
<brendyyn>When I tried installing 0.12, there were packages whos sources were no longer available
<brendyyn>New features... Updated manuals... translations... everything
<user_trisquel>guix pull?
<user_trisquel>I will try to test my Parabola now, reboot.
<civodul>sneek: later tell jlicht the switch to build-systems-on-gexp triggers a full rebuild; subsequent changes don't necessarily do
<sneek>Got it.
<davidl>Anyone here been using gnunet who knows how to get connected? Using the default hostlist for bootstrapping doesn't seem to work.
<Digit>efraim: "unrecognized option"~ ah, nevermind. just needed lower-case. :) proceeding. :) here's hoping this gets me back in the land of the guix. thnx for feeding me that fish, though, i'd still rather have been taught to fish, if you catch my drift. :)
<AndChat|217856>Davidl: I'd suggest to take a look at ng0's project, pagmatique
<AndChat|217856>Even though you're not interested in the while project
<AndChat|217856>That's where the most importante gnunet advanceme nts are belong made
<AndChat|217856>Are being made
<brendyyn>davidl: Do you have the latest git version?
<brendyyn>davidl: It should not require any configuration. You just start it up with gnunet-arm -s
<davidl>hi, I have the guix packaged versioned.
<brendyyn>Unfortunately, the packaged version is 3 years old, because there has not been an update in that time, and there may not be another one for a few months yet
<brendyyn>But the gnunet git repo has a guix package definition in it, so it's not that hard to get it
<brendyyn>The latest git version is not compatible with the old 10.1
<davidl>brendyyn: ok, I'll download that one then instead.
<brendyyn>davidl: Once you get that, try commenting out some of the make flags like --enable-hardening since they caused problems for me and are still experimental, then you can run guix package -f guix-env.scm
<davidl>brendyyn: ok.
***andreh1 is now known as andreh
<Digit>ACTION rages, still getting what looks like the same cluster of errors
<Digit>ACTION tries with guix environment
<Digit>nope. 'bouta give up on guixsd. ... or at least this install of it.
<AndChat|217856>What does happen, exactly ?
<Digit>ACTION tees output to a file (like he said he'd do ages back) so he can share something useful
<Digit>uhh... that file's empty. guix and tee dont get along well together??
<Digit>ACTION back to copying last screenful only then
<Digit> is about all i can get to
<OriansJ>stderr doesn't get passed to tee, you need &| or &> to redirect it
<Digit>might be asleep before i get this ball rolling. not giving up yet.
<Digit>ACTION tried a run with &>, but still ended up with a blank file.
<jamesrichardson>ACTION Thinks it takes very long to install a gnome system.
<ng0>sneek: later tell catonano: I just pushed a commit to -texinfo which included putting your copyright in the documentation book. I guess yo uare alright with this :) also, pdf is now fixed.
<catonano>ng0: yes, I'm alrigt with this :-)
<sneek>Welcome back catonano, you have 1 message.
<sneek>catonano, ng0 says: I just pushed a commit to -texinfo which included putting your copyright in the documentation book. I guess yo uare alright with this :) also, pdf is now fixed.
<ng0>documentation is horrible. I have full sympathy with a lack of documentation now
<catonano>ng0: eh ;-)
<ng0>it is a long, long run…
<ng0>necessary but not really satisfying work. I hope in the very long run a book a la 'GNUnet for beginners' can be avoided by a good documentation
<ng0>220 pages now
<rekado>I’ve always liked writing documentation.
<rekado>it’s harder when it’s a document written by many different authors, though.
<rekado>I find it equally challenging to write a paper as a co-author. The hardest part is editing the document to try to make it sound like it was written by only one person.
<catonano>right now I'm entangled in a mess. I can't wait to get back to Guix
<ng0>freifunk connection is terrible right now… lightning on its way. does someone know how many signatures make a "trusted key" for GNU? Just to get an idea how many I have to re-collect on my new key.
<ng0>I have to cycle home.. leave a message in sneek :)