<buenouanq>are the think penguin wifi dongles plug and play with guixsd, or do I have to install something? <ng0>the kernel is modular, if that's what you mean <civodul>(i don't think it's different from Debian actually) <buenouanq>civodul: debian I had to manually install the fw drivers <buenouanq>just downloading texlive is going to take all day <mekeor>what's the guix-package for the "reset" command called? <mekeor>well, the xmonad-contrib package still depends on the "old-locale" package <OriansJ>buenouanq: Well we could always add torrent support to guix and thus solve that scaling/performance question but the question simply becomes who is going to do it... <buenouanq>have everyone"s /gnu/stores automatically published <buenouanq>you should be able to install guix entirely from gnunet, never touching any of the normal internet protocols at all <mekeor>what's the guix-package providing the "scp" command? <mekeor>oh, right, i added openssh-service but i didn't install the package ;) – thanks :) <OriansJ>buenouanq: Whoever does, decides. So if you want gnunet instead of torrents, you'll probably want to get that done before someone else implements torrent functionality. <buenouanq>I'm trying to install things to actually make it usable right now, but it's slow going. <buenouanq>problem right now is that the version that in everybody"s repos is incompatible with the current git <buenouanq>we desperately need the next version to be release and have it get out into the major distros <ng0>If I could decide, there would be an alpha release / pre 0.11 and marked as such, but I do not decide. Public image, community building etc is important. Like now it's just 2 bugs left. could be between 5 weeks and 5 months (realworld time) depending on when christian finds time to code it. https://gnunet.org/bugs/view.php?id=4909 is a relatively trivial task I was told. in case anyone wants less talk and more <DoublePlusGood23>How do I start the ssh server? openssh, sshd, opensshd, openssh-daemon, ssh-daemon all give me "could not be found" with herd. <ng0>it is ssh-daemon in case it even is in your system config <ng0>if you wrote earlier about it, I wasn#t here. you do run GuixSD? <ng0>as unprivileged user: guix pull; guix system build /etc/config.scm; as privileged user then guix system reconfigure /etc/config.scm and then reboot <ng0>that is if you run GuixSD <ng0>there's a section about this reconfigure etc in the documnetation, but I'm off now <buenouanq>DoublePlusGood23: it's very difficult and slow to insert things into freenet <buenouanq>and if they are not popular, they die very quickly <buenouanq>DoublePlusGood23: very. Two things need attention though: 1) our build is dated and incompatible with their current git so you won't be able to find or download much. 2) someone really needs to make us a nice gnunet-service so it runs in the background on a dedicated user accessible by anyone. <buenouanq>I'm leaving in a few days and going to be gone until June, or I would. <buenouanq>If it's still not taken care of when I get back, I will give it a shot. ***ZombieCh1cken is now known as ZombieChicken
<DoublePlusGood23>It seems to be lacking the right "package module" listed? zsh isn't the correct one? <CalGuixSD>After I've done cow-store /mnt, can I unmount /mnt somehow? The system kept saying it was busy, and when I killed one of the processes using it, I couldn't even type "ls". <DoublePlusGood23>to change guixsd shell to zsh use the line (use-package-modules shell ...) instead of just zsh. <CalGuixSD>DoublePlusGood23: The Shepherd processes said FIFO next to them. I avoided killing those. <CalGuixSD>I killed the one that did not say FIFO and did not look like Shepherd. <CalGuixSD>DoublePlusGood23: Is someone else asking about ZSH? I wasn't. <CalGuixSD>DoublePlusGood23: Doing what build? I tried to unmount /mnt long after system init failed and came to an end. <CalGuixSD>I need to unmount /mnt so I can reformat it and save install.sh to it. <CalGuixSD>DoublePlusGood23: "herd stop cow-store /mnt"? <CalGuixSD>Hm. UUID changes, even though I partition in the exact same way every time. This is not good. I'll have to edit the config every time. :-( <buenouanq>CalGuixSD: this is why labels are the recommend way to refer to partitions I imagine <buenouanq>ok so with (console-keymap-service "dvorak") in my config, all the ttys are how I need them, but SLIM is still in qwerty <buenouanq>I assume this will require altering the %desktop-services or something yeah? is there an example anywhere? <buenouanq>ok, after some searching, the solution that works for everyone else involves changing /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-evdev.conf <buenouanq>I feel that manually editing configs like this goes against the guixsd way - I hope there's a really easy way to just set this in my os config.scm. <DoublePlusGood23>buenouanq: I was able to append to the hosts file. Maybe something similar? <buenouanq>CalGuixSD: either supply them when you make the partition or use e2label after <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: I can assign them when the partition is made. I don't care. I just don't know how to do that in the scheme file <buenouanq>ok, so which file do I need to append what to? <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: The guide said to copy the file in /etc/, and the file in /etc/ uses UUID. <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: I'm talking about the info manual. <DoublePlusGood23>there really needs to be some sort of P2P thing for guix. these download times are kinda annoying, but the 404s are really the biggest issue <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: The help document on TTY2, when you boot the installer. <CalGuixSD>And in 7.1.5 Proceeding with the Installation, it says to "cp /etc/configuration/desktop.scm /mnt/etc/config.scm". <rekado_>buenouanq: about changing the xorg configuration: you can do this by modifying the slim-service-type <rekado_>buenouanq: it’s a bit awkwardly nested <DoublePlusGood23>ng0: thanks for the ssh help, seems to be working. I also have my oh-my-zsh back :D <rekado_>buenouanq: “slim-configuration” has a “startx” field, and the “xorg-start-command” has a “#:configuration-file” thingie. <rekado_>“xorg-configuration-file” takes an argument for “#:extra-config” <rekado_>I’m using that to add configuration for a trackball <buenouanq>can I point #:extra-config? to a file, or should I declare it earlier in the same config like I assume you are there <rekado_>I have a separate file and slurp that in. <rekado_>to avoid annoying string quoting issues. <rekado_>I feel that xorg configuration should be easier <rekado_>it’s a bit weird to have it nested so deeply in the slim configuration <buenouanq>we need more examples like this in the main docs <rekado_>slim configuration and xorg configuration should be separate. <rekado_>buenouanq: I might submit some changes to the manual soon. <buenouanq>rekado_: back on systemdebian I used to fix screen tearing by adding a file /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/20-intel.conf - Is this #extra-config how/where I would add this now too? <rekado_>I don’t have experience with this particular issue, but that’s where I would add it. <buenouanq>#extra-config takes just a normal list it looks like? <buenouanq>so I can just chain them in the (list ...) in your example? <buenouanq>man, I wish I had know about this months ago <rekado_>not sure if the evdev xorg config change will have any effect on slim, though <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: (I made the change you linked to, in using labels instead of UUID.) <CalGuixSD>Wait... buenouanq linked to the doc for that. I'll RTFM. <CalGuixSD>The LUKS example in "using the configuration system" uses the (uuid "haosuehceohusoa8guasr8oueaohs8gsoa8gue") thing.. <buenouanq>CalGuixSD: there are multiple uuids for things <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: You said I could use labels, so the script will work. <buenouanq>blkid will spit out a uuid="..." and a partuuid="..." <CalGuixSD>So I don't have te edit the .scm every time. <buenouanq>I don't know about luks, I thought you were just going for a normal install. <buenouanq>in my main config, I'm just the path (not recommended as this can change if things get plugged in or removed) <brendyn>I guess Guix doesn't support Windows, hey? <rekado_>brendyn: Guix can compile binaries for Windows, but I don’t think it runs on Windows directly. <buenouanq>but now I have Unbound variable: slim-service-type <rekado_>buenouanq: you need to load the services module that defines it <rekado_>buenouanq: according to the manual it’s defined in (gnu services xorg) <rekado_>in the manual I hit “i” (for “index”) and typed “slim” <rekado_>the hint brought me to section “6.2.7.5 X Window” <rekado_>Support for the X Window graphical display system—specifically Xorg—is <rekado_>provided by the ‘(gnu services xorg)’ module <rekado_>hmm, cuirass has only built upstream packages; none of my custom packages were built. <rekado_>ACTION goes back to tweaking the configuration <rekado_>brendyn: do you need it on Windows or on GNU? <brendyn>GNU, but I was just wondering if there was anything special I needed to do to take windows builds into account <rekado_>we don’t usually take Windows cross-builds into account at all <rekado_>I guess this would happen on a case by case basis <buenouanq>shepherd: Service user-homes could not be started. <brendyn>Fair enough, I'll just leave it then <buenouanq>this is a newer error I only started seeing recently <rekado_>buenouanq: I get the same. Haven’t looked at it yet. <buenouanq>restarting to see if this took care of my screentearing <CalGuixSD>Cross-building is important. I keep a "bug out" flash drive with free GNU/Linux ISOs, Windows Rufus (ISO writer), several free programs compiled for Windows and MacOS, my dotfiles, and my SSH/GPG keys. <CalGuixSD>Oh yeah, and several free programs written as locally hosted JavaScript that can run in any browser. <CalGuixSD>Just in case running executables is not allowed, I can still run JavaScript programs. <rekado_>cross-building is a little under-supported in Guix at this point. <rekado_>so it’s fine to ignore it for now when adding new packages <rekado_>we do try to fix issues with cross-compiling to Hurd, though <rekado_>if there are problems cross-compiling to Windows they can be addressed with later patches <buenouanq>irssi is actually having display issuse so (including in what I posted which was just aliased) I'm just seeing ? boxes brendyn <brendyn>It was Japanese, since your emoji had Japanese characters <buenouanq>well, if I could see it, I could prolly read it <CalGuixSD>Does the live system's console support Japanese? <CalGuixSD>My system declaration will never work. Maybe I shouldn't start from a template at all. <buenouanq>CalGuixSD: what sort of crazy frankenmonster file is this? <Apteryx>civodul: can I still send a patch for core-update? <buenouanq>so CalGuixSD, it seems like your problem is that you're trying to automate creation of your os config.scm this for some reason... to get the correct uuid, you could call luksUUID and save it as a var called as the device name or something crazy that will only cause you more problems I imagine <Apteryx>I found what causes the broken link in gimp documentation. Our compress-documentation phase in gnu-build-system has a small defect. <buenouanq>have you gotten this up and running at all yet? I'd focus on that before this automation project. <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: I hate partitioning and connecting to the network dozens of times, every time I mess up the install and have to try again. So, I made a script to do it all for me. <buenouanq>I've never messed up the GuixSD install once... <buenouanq>It's the slickest easiest coolest thing ever. <buenouanq>CalGuixSD: obviously it's not working out too well for you <buenouanq>I suggest: installing it once normally, without luks or anything weird/fancy <buenouanq>then, you can build up from there, and instead of starting over each time from the flashdrive or whatever, just use $ guix system reconfigure config.scm <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: But I will have to start over from flash drive, when I do LUKS. LUKS requires repartitioning. <buenouanq>your problem is obviously that that file isn't big enough <CalGuixSD>The script doesn't do anything to it. It's just my way of saving files, because I can't save files right now. <rekado_>CalGuixSD: why do you need to repartition each time? <rekado_>CalGuixSD: your partitions are not lost even if you fail your install <CalGuixSD>rekado_: Last time I tried mounting my already-made partition, it complained. I used to have the error message, but I lost my latest version of that giant script that had the notes about what happened. <CalGuixSD>The error wasn't from mounting, but Guix said it didn't want to touch /gnu/store/. <buenouanq>you haven't discovered just how beautiful guixsd is yet <buenouanq>what you should be doing is installing the smallest config you can, then slowly building it up as you need <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: Says the one who didn't encrypt his whole disk, including /boot, on Libreboot <rekado_>buenouanq: but luks needs to be done at the very beginning <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: You can't "start small" when you're on Libreboot and you need full disk encryption. <buenouanq>oh, you can't switch to luk using reconfigure? <CalGuixSD>buenouanq: You would have to repartition. I already said this. <CalGuixSD>Also, partitioning (one of the most annoying parts if you encrypt) is NOT done by the config. <rekado_>CalGuixSD: sure. Let me boot up my laptop. <buenouanq>your problems are coming from trying to automate something you have never done <buenouanq>get it working and understand the process, then you can think about automating it <rekado_>hmm, how do I run fsck in the recovery REPL? <rekado_>I can just exit it with ,q and it will continue to boot <rekado_>but it seems I can’t run it when booting and unlocking the encrypted disk <rekado_>FWIW in the recovery REPL “ls” is kinda useless <rekado_>but it doesn’t show me any files inside of any directory <CalGuixSD>Wait... buenouanq, the things I automated in that script ARE things I have done. The whole reason I put them in a script was because I was tired of typing them over and over each time I booted into the system. <rekado_>my laptop’s mainboard seems to be broken (after having dropped the laptop one time too often). Sometimes the computer freezes completely and then there’s disk corruption :-/ <CalGuixSD>How do I get it in plain text rather than HTML? <rekado_>CalGuixSD: one obvious difference between my config and yours is the “dependencies” field <rekado_>since your root file system is on the luks device you need to link the two <rekado_>or else GuixSD will try to mount the root disk before the luks device is ready <CalGuixSD>rekado_: As long as it's FDE, I'll redo my partitions however you did them. <rekado_>you’ll need to change the UUID, obviously <rekado_>you could get it automatically by parsing the output of “blkid” at runtime <Apteryx>rekado_: haha. I'll use the cat excuse. <rekado_>and then use the value of “uuid” in your configuration <Apteryx>rekado_: you don't have an SSD? Much better for shocks. <rekado_>but the mainboard seems to be damaged <brendyn>*Gah*. Is it really necessary for `guix package --do-not-upgrade=guile -u' to work but not `guix package -u --do-not-upgrade=guile' ? <rekado_>when the system freezes all I can do is remove the battery <brendyn>Works with no argument too doesn't it? <rekado_>if you have “-u” followed by something, that something is taken as the argument to “-u” <brendyn>The "" regex I guess. That makes sense <CalGuixSD>I can't find a regex for "from 'Some String' to end of line". <brendyn>Doesn't grep only go to the end of lines? <CalGuixSD>Apparently, * is not a wildcard but a repetition thing. <rekado_>if you want real regexps you need to use “grep -e” <CalGuixSD>OH! Repeat the "any one character" symbol, ".". Brilliant! <Petter>Yes, * repeats the last thing 0 or more times. '.' means any character. '.*' repeat any character till the end. <efraim_>brendyn: guix package -u . --do-not-upgrade=guile <CalGuixSD>blkid /dev/sda1 | sed 's/\\/dev\\/sda1: UUID=\\"//' | sed 's/\\" T.*$//' <rekado_>CalGuixSD: why not use the command I pasted? <brendyn>Seems unlikely that we'd ever have a package called "--do-not-upgrade=guile" though <rekado_>you can give sed multiple expressions with “-e” <rekado_>brendyn: I think it would be okay to ignore the argument if it starts with “-” <brendyn>Searching is frustrating too at first, like if you try guix package -s music player <CalGuixSD>rekado_: I didn't see that you posted a link. <Petter>We can golf this a little, sed -ne 's/^UUID=//p' <rekado_>Petter: I tried this but couldn’t quite remember the invocation <rekado_>CalGuixSD: outside of the operating-system clause <rekado_>CalGuixSD: note that I haven’t tested this, but it should work <rekado_>CalGuixSD: oh, and for “read-line” you need to (use-modules (ice-9 rdelim)) as well <CalGuixSD>rekado_: Do I put the use-modules stuff in the main use-modules, or can I keep the separate use-modules as-is? <Petter>(without sed, `blkid -s UUID -o value /dev/sda1`) <brendyn>on the (description line or above, pressing tab indents the line. below that, it is non-responsive. <rekado_>brendyn: could it be that Emacs is confused by the line in the description that starts with “(”? <rekado_>brendyn: please don’t use propagated-inputs here, unless this is also used as a Python library. <rekado_>no need to escape it. You could temporarily add a space in front of it to indent. <brendyn>Righto, I just copy-pasted from a related package arleady in guix: livestreamer <brendyn>I mean the lines below like (home and (license do not respond to indentation either <rekado_>I’d change the description to replace the parenthetical expression with “Streamlink is a fork of livestreamer.” <brendyn>If I remove those parens, then it works again <brendyn>It is not a syntax error to have parens though? so it is a bug in the indentation code? <Apteryx>Could someone fire up xterm and press "Ctrl + LeftMouseButton" ? <Apteryx>On my machine it crashes. For m-o it crashed too. We're both on ratpoison. I'd like someone with another WM/DE to give it a try. <CalGuixSD>rekado_: So, now that uuid has been defined, what do I do with (source (uuid "f962a3cd-b17f-46a6-8059-b2329847af27"))? <Apteryx>It's a font problem. It tty0 I can see error: no font found <rekado_>use the defined value instead of the string literal <brendyn>rekado_: Is it guix.el or scheme mode or? <rekado_>brendyn: Emacs has the same problem in other modes that are lisp-derived <snape>Apteryx: I can Ctrl + LeftMousebutton without crash <rekado_>CalGuixSD: no, uuid is not a procedure <Apteryx>snape: Interesting. Are you on GuixSD? <snape>right now, Debian + Guix, with Guix packaged exwm <Apteryx>snape: OK, that explains it. I think the problem is with Guix's Xorg not loading the fonts or something. <civodul>Apteryx: yeah that's a bug with xterm <Apteryx>I could also see the menu on Ubuntu earlier today. <snape>right, this is Debian's xterm <Apteryx>civodul: Well, it works on foreign distros (guix's xterm on Ubuntu for example) <civodul>Apteryx: i'd be grateful if you could dig up what happened to the patch above and what we need to do :-) <Apteryx>civodul: OK. I'll add this to my todo list and try to have a look tommorow. <Apteryx>Do we have a bug opened for the ctrl-click xterm crash? <Petter>ACTION doesn't have a swap partition either <CalGuixSD>So, "parted --script /dev/sda mklabel msdos mkpart primary ext4 0% 100%" would fit the bill? <rekado_>CalGuixSD: I just followed the example in the Guix manual <CalGuixSD>The cfdisk example is not automatable AFAIK. <rekado_>I created the initial partition manually <rekado_>I never had to create it more than once <rekado_>so there was no need for me to automate it <rekado_>CalGuixSD: if you use my config.scm you’ll have to comment out even more stuff <rekado_>like all the extra files I’m loading from /etc/config.d/ <rekado_>I really don’t recommend using my configuration as is <rekado_>for the initial installation I just followed the manual <rekado_>everything else grew during reconfiguration <snape>does it make sense to use '#!/run/current-system/profile/bin/env perl' as shebang for things that cannot have references to the store? <snape>answering my own question: that won't work on non GuixSD OSes <rekado_>CalGuixSD: you can learn from it and copy from it, but taking it as is won’t make sense. <rekado_>CalGuixSD: this isn’t supposed to be hard. <rekado_>CalGuixSD: I really recommend starting with a minimal configuration <rekado_>CalGuixSD: there is an example in the manual <rekado_>CalGuixSD: and combined with my config as an example it should be manageable <rekado_>CalGuixSD: if you have a specific problem please try to be precise in asking the question. <rekado_>it’s much easier for us to help then <buenouanq>mekeor: haven't gotten to it yet - will try again in the morning <buenouanq>using that same config scheme, I was finally able to fix my screentearing though <buenouanq>so if anyone mentions having problems with that send them to me and maybe I can help :3 <rekado_>CalGuixSD: your file-systems declaration is wrong <rekado_>CalGuixSD: as I wrote earlier you need to make it dependent on mapped-devices <CalGuixSD>guix system init /mnt/etc/leela-lite.scm /mnt: sed: couldn't flush stdout: Broken pipe <rekado_>try what Petter posted above, instead of the pipe <rekado_>i.e. (open-input-pipe "blkid -s UUID -o value /dev/sda1") <rekado_>also make sure this command actually works on the command line <Petter>I don't get this though, isn't it the /dev/sda1 part that could change, while UUID is always the same? <rekado_>the UUID is stable as long as you don’t reformat / repartition <CalGuixSD>rekado_: "make it dependent on mapped-devices"? <rekado_>the device node is also stable if you only have one partition <rekado_>CalGuixSD: you have a commented section in your configuration <rekado_>CalGuixSD: there you use (dependencies mapped-devices), which is required when having a file system that depends on the device mapping. <CalGuixSD>Added (dependencies mapped-devices) to uncommented file-system. <rekado_>do note that when booting you’ll still have to first unlock the disk in libreboot’s GRUB <rekado_>I do this manually in the GRUB console with “cryptomount -a” and then “configfile (crypto0)/boot/grub/grub.cfg” <CalGuixSD>rekado_: Do I have to pass options to linux like I do with Trisquel and Parabola? I saw no vmlinuz file, only grub.cfg, in /boot <rekado_>I only need to do what I wrote above. <rekado_>I don’t pass anything to the kernel line manually <rekado_>I only tell libreboot’s GRUB to pass control to GuixSD’s GRUB via the unlocked /boot/grub/grub.cfg <rekado_>any settings that you want to pass to the kernel line should go to “kernel-arguments” in the operating-system expression <rekado_>but things like the location of the kernel image etc are handled automatically <rekado_>CalGuixSD: for the initial configuration I suggest not to add ratpoison, i3-wm, and openbox yet <rekado_>you can add them later once the initial configuration has been applied <CalGuixSD>guix system: error: failed to load '/mnt/etc/leela-lite.scm': <CalGuixSD>ice-9/eval.scm:393:14: Unbound variable: read-line <rekado_>otherwise you’ll have to wait for the download / building of these packages and their dependencies <rekado_>CalGuixSD: you need to add (use-modules (ice-9 rdelim)) <rekado_>(I mentioned this earlier; forgot to paste it along with the uuid snippet) <CalGuixSD>/mnt/etc/leela-lite.scm:79:2: error: invalid field specifier <CalGuixSD>Oh! The problem with (console-keymap-service "dvorak") ISN'T just the -uk! <CalGuixSD>(services (cons (console-keymap-service "dvorak") %desktop-services)) <rekado_>does anyone else have a problem with “guix environment guix”? <rekado_>the error is: ERROR: In procedure #<syntax-transformer anym>: <rekado_>ERROR: Wrong type to apply: #<syntax-transformer anym> <civodul>the comment "guix environment guix" works for me <civodul>the error here relates to the recent monad stuff <civodul>there's a stale .go file somewhere that applies 'anym', but 'anym' is now a macro <rekado_>find . -name '*.go' doesn’t turn up anything <rekado_>[gtk-icon-themes #<<manifest> entries: (# # # # ...)>] <rekado_>In unknown file: [# # #<procedure entry-lookup-package (entry)> #] <rekado_>civodul: I deleted ~/.cache/guile and it’s fine now. ¯\\_(ツ)_/¯ <civodul>rekado_: np, it's easy to get caught by these issues :-/ <rekado_>so… before the next release I need to fix glibc/hurd <rekado_>and before that can be done I need to recover my corrupt git repo <efraim_>is %out/lib different than "lib" when it comes to LIBRARY_PATH for gcc? <rekado_>to be honest, I dread the release process. It’s still a little too complicated for my simple tastes. <janneke>rekado_: settle for no less than: `make release' ... <email these lists> <civodul>rekado_: i agree, Someone™ has to simplify it <rekado_>I would really like to take this on, but with my current work load it would just delay the release :-/ <janneke>rekado_: if you ask me: delay it until it's fully automated :-) <civodul>i'll see if i can come up with improvements <janneke>`let's sharpen the axe tomorrow, too busy today' :-D <janneke>sorry if that's too blunt, meant only to inspire <rekado_>it’s really like that; I often try to fix something, then fail to finish on the same day, go to bed, and on the next day there’s something else to be fixed :) <Petter>That's a clever expression. *takes note* <civodul>rekado_: i have 114 stashes currently :-) <rekado_>that’s how you end up with countless branches and directories under $HOME/dev :) <janneke>ACTION has been there [and still goes there] too often <civodul>efraim: could you check the link command line of 'cgo'? <civodul>brendyn: someday i should do that and start anew :-) <civodul>though i do revive some of these stashes from time to time <brendyn>Don't branches exist for this purpose? <civodul>but somehow, my mental model has been to use stashes <brendyn>I guess I won't question any further <rekado_>I only use branches because they are easier to rebase than stashes <janneke>ACTION guesses that civodul has run out of branches ;-) <civodul>usually it's along the lines of "let's just stash it for a minute and then i'll finish" <efraim>libdir is defined in gcc.scm:86, with no-separate-lib-output flag from custom-gcc I would think libdir should be "out" <civodul>efraim: i mean the command line in the build log that creates 'cgo' <civodul>i do a bit of that but it doesn't work so well for voluntary work <civodul>and also for unscheduled maintenance tasks <rekado_>I use org-mode a lot to keep track of what I’m working on <rekado_>I don’t really schedule anything, though <rekado_>I just keep a log and mark the NEXT thing that needs to be done, so that it’s easier for me to pick it up again <brendyn>I just started trying to use it yesterday <rekado_>(that “NEXT” idea is from “Getting things done”, but I’m not at all good at GTD.) <brendyn>Today I actually did something I intended to. <rekado_>I use “C-c o a” in lieu of a real calendar, though <mekeor>what do you think about adding a hardware-related section to the "GuixSD"-section in Guix' manual where we could e.g. explain that since GuixSD is a fully-free distribution, you should be aware that your wifi-card may not work etc? <efraim>civodul: before I spend 6 hours compiling, if out and lib are separate outputs can out refer to lib? <civodul>efraim: the only thing that is not allowed is mutual references <civodul>that is, if out refers to lib, lib cannot refer to out <efraim>From the linking in RUNDIR message that the binaries had, it looks like $out/lib wasn't in the RUNDIR, which means libdir for not-separate-output might be wrong <efraim>Libdir being the let* libdir of gcc <brendyn>Is anybody planning to update the calibre package? <civodul>efraim: normally, in the 'install' phase, should have libtool telling you that it's relinking executables with -Wl,-rpath=$libdir, so that they have the right RUNPATH <civodul>efraim: presumably that is not happening here <civodul>efraim: so you should check in the build log how the offending executable is linked ('build' phase), and then relinked ('install' phase) <civodul>that could be a bug in GCC's build system <efraim>in the paste mTww... from the build phase there's no rpath <rekado_>brendyn: I’m not. Would you like to give it a try? <efraim>i'm i'm looking at gcc.scm:239 correctly, `-rpath=libdir/lib -lgcc_s' is only for not static libgcc <brendyn>rekado_: When I get past the ones I'm trying to do atm <catonano>civodul: I need some time, I will reply to your email soon <efraim>civodul: in that same mTww... paste from building cgo it has -static-libgcc, which would remove libdir/lib from the rpath <az`>hi great community mind <az`> why after guix pull .config/guix/latest/guix contains files from 1 Jan 1970 ? It is "Unix joke"? <az`>I know what it is a non-respectable question, but is there any public "build farm" with non-free kernels? And if not, what if I start one? <rekado_>az`: if you start one please do not advertise it here <rekado_>guix makes it very easy to build custom kernels, but we don’t want to discuss or advocate the use of non-free software here on this channel. <rekado_>I find the cuirass database confusing. <rekado_>I repeatedly delete it because otherwise cuirass won’t build the things I asked it to build. <az`>Now I try to use only Free kernel and software, but found myrself with cables everywhere in my house )) <m-o>rekado_: cuirass stores in database the sha1 of the last git commit evaluated, until a new sha1 is detected no build will be triggered. I also remove the database to force a rebuild. <rekado_>m-o: I stopped the cuirass services, changed the specification, reconfigured, started cuirass … and it would evaluate the *previous* set of packages <civodul>m-o: the spec is stored in the database <civodul>so you need to change the spec in the database <rekado_>also: looking at the database I don’t see much need for a relational database at all. <rekado_>I’m not clear on the reasons for the design decisions (and the documentation doesn’t provide any info on that). <m-o>No the documentation is minimalistic for sure :) <rekado_>I suppose I should just bite the bullet and read through the sources while making notes <rekado_>I have an aversion against using databases and I’d like to understand why exactly the schema looks the way it does. <rekado_>is this primarily for future features or is it for potential future querying features… <brendyn>There are such guix packages already made if you go looking. <rekado_>ACTION starts documenting the cuirass database scheme <civodul>rekado_: the thing is, a real build farm tool like Hydra stores tons of data (lots of builds, jobsets, commits, etc.) <civodul>and you want to be able to make possibly complex queries on this <civodul>like "what are the builds of job 'emacs'?" <civodul>"what are the builds corresponding to guix.git commit xyz?" <civodul>so we really need a "real" SQL database, not just a bunch of files <brendyn>Should --fallback be enabled by default? Seems sensible to me/ <rekado_>brendyn: you don’t necessarily want to compile something when there’s a temporary network problem <brendyn>Is that what you want most of the time? <brendyn>Also, do you know how to set fallback when installing packages via Emacs? most packages I try to install fail due to 404 <brendyn>and #:fallback? is not a keyword of process-package-action it seems <az`>in emacs-guix you can set any flags you want <az`>pressing "p -f" for example <az`><M-x>guix<RET>p -f =i some-package <RET> r <brendyn>I have 50 or so packages marked for install <brendyn>pressing x installs but without fallback <efraim>Trying to build Julia, getting 'wrong hash' for objconv.zip <az`>WTF! After update emacs-guix: p: pack p: package - it is same letter! <az`>now I cant use emacs-guix for packages installation anymore :( <snape>I think that bug has been fixed upstream <az`>try to update it again <snape>maybe the new version hasn't been relesed <az`>now, with --fallback it compile something... when it done I tell you, that halps or not <snape>I stopped using guix-popup because it doesn't support tramp and it does not support sudo <snape>90% of the guix commands I type require either sudo (for reconfigure) or an ssh connection <snape>further more, building in *shell* is risky because Emacs doesn't handle long lines well <snape>so I did my own thing that spawns guix commands in Xterm instead <Tsutsukakushi>hi, a while ago i saw a nice website for a distro that was just starting up and now i can't find it <az`>now I want to know that too ) <az`>or to create something similar if we can't find that <az`>offtopic: but anybody know how to redirect this "Core tempperature above thresold" messages to separate console? <az`>yes, already, thanks buenouanq! But project in very first steps... as guix self so.. <snape>guix is not in "very first steps" <az`>sad, but after upgrage emacs-guix: " p pack p package " <az`>anybody: can I start xorg with startx" <az`>(i.e. without slime) ? <az`>why? I think it's much simpler configuration! I don't like any graphics login managers... <az`>ok, so, how to configure exwm then? I try to manual edit .xsession to "exec emacs", but with no luck <buenouanq>that is the supported way to start a window manager so something else is prolly being overlooked <az`>ok, thanks, I'll try that way <snape>az`: the reason why startx isn't supported has to do with security issues due to the fact that it requires a binary (xorg or startx, I don't remember) to be setuid <snape>the less setuid binaries an OS has, the better <snape>and Guix pays a lot of attention to these binaries <az`>well,well, it looks reasonable <buenouanq>I just wish maybe there was something before. <buenouanq>I like when my machine starts me off at a tty, cause sometimes I don't want x at all. <buenouanq>the necessary ordering doesn't work for that though <buenouanq>my thinkpenguin wireless dongle is not being detected or something on guixsd <buenouanq>I've been told that I shouldn't have to install anything and it should just work <az`>for us it still remains <C-M-F2> , ok <snape>buenouanq: I think you can do, as root: 'herd stop slim-service' to stop it. And you can restart it with one of the tty. <snape>also, your wifi issue might be that linux-libre doesn't support the (probably proprietary) driver of your dongle <buenouanq>this is one of the ones with e FSF RYF certificate <avoine>in the repl when I use the ,run-in-store command it creates a .drv file but how do I get it to "compile" the drv into the final file? <buenouanq>oh man, it's not showing up on my desktop either <az`>snape: "exec exwm" - sure? <az`>exwm runs inside emacs, this is piece of elisp code! ***kelsoo1 is now known as kelsoo
<az`>Tsutsukakushi: "<snape> az`: the reason why startx isn't supported has to do <az`> with security issues due to the fact that it requires <az`> a binary (xorg or startx, I don't remember) to be <az`>01:46 <snape> the less setuid binaries an OS has, the better <az`>01:47 <snape> and Guix pays a lot of attention to these binaries" <Tsutsukakushi>do guixsd packages ship apparmor profiles or something like that? <avoine>Tsutsukakushi: services can runs in a container <Tsutsukakushi>even when run in a container there isn't really any reason to not limit their capabilities <avoine>Tsutsukakushi: that's the closest fact I knew about the subject :P <snape>Tsutsukakushi: no, guix doesn't do anything special related to apparmor <az`>why emacs sudo tramp dont'work "Saving file /etc/config.scm... <az`>Error: (file-error "Setting ACL" "Operation not permitted" "/etc/config.scm") <az`>basic-save-buffer-2: Doing chmod: Operation not permitted, /etc/config.scm <Tsutsukakushi>avoine: do you know what capabilities these containers run with? <az`>I do standard: <C-x C-f>/sudo::/etc/config.scm <az`>tired to run sudo zile intead <az`>guix is a pain sometimes :) <az`>sometime I like this sort of pain, but now is late night :) <snape>az`: you don't need this file to be in /etc/ <Tsutsukakushi>snape: at least on my parabola machine neither X nor startx is setuid <quiliro>thank you very much for this great project <snape>Tsutsukakushi: I didn't say it would :) <Tsutsukakushi>snape: well, that was specifically what i was asking about, thus the blog post was quite useless <quiliro>i am trying to put guixsd on a mac air a1304 and have found that it can be done and was guided on how to do it <snape>Tsutsukakushi: apolologies for this then <quiliro>but i wish i could use libreboot because i have found there are serious vulnerabilities in macbook air efi according to wikileaks <Tsutsukakushi>and just because they can be run in containers isn't really a good reason to not also have security when not doing that <quiliro>is there a recovery in case libreboot does not work? <quiliro>i have asked at #libreboot but there are no answers <Tsutsukakushi>grillon_: are you sure your macbook is one of the supported ones <Tsutsukakushi>you might consider coreboot, at least you'd have a bit nicer bios <quiliro>i think coreboot does not support it either <snape>Tsutsukakushi: Actually, Archlinux uses systemd-logind, which allows Xorg to be run as unpriviledged user <snape>but Guix doesn't use Systemd <az`>shepherd can't do this? <snape>and it's something Xorg explicitly supports <snape>well xorg-server isn't built with systemd-logind <az`>Q: I need to "(services (cons* (dhcp-client-service) <az`> (lsh-service #:port-number 2222) <snape>but yes I was wrong we use logind <az`>i.e. %desktop-services include %base-sservices? <snape>well, we *can* use logind (I certainly don't) <Tsutsukakushi>snape: doesn't mean similiar functionality couldn't be implemented in other systems <snape>Tsutsukakushi: yes, but there certainly more urgent things to do, as we already have slim <amz3>is there a guix container tutorial somewhere? <az`>how to "describe" guile scheme variable like %desktop service in EMACS? <az`>try to start geiser, with no luck, maybe I do something wrong <snape>davexunit: elogind (that we use) has some difference with the systemd one. That might be one of the reasons it would not work with xorg... <snape>like: it does not manage virtual terminals <az`>",d %desktop-services <az`>#f" - and it is all :( <alezost>az`: evaluate ",use(gnu services desktop)" in geiser repl <alezost>az`: ah, so just press "M-x geiser-edit-symbol-at-point" on %desktop-services <ng0>rekado_: I'll send the email about the issue from yesterday as soon as I have time to do so, I'm preoccupied with applications at the moment. <ng0>I appreciate the help <alezost>az`: it is bound to "M-." by default <az`>,describe %desktop-services <az`>While executing meta-command: <az`>ERROR: No variable named %desktop-services in #<directory (guile-user) a9dbd0> <az`>scheme@(guile-user)> ,use (gnu services desktop) <az`>scheme@(guile-user)> ,describe %desktop-services <az`>M-. sayin what geiser not runnin, I'll <M-x>run-geiser then - no luck :( <az`>maybe related: "Autoloading failed to define function guix-devel-activate-mode-maybe" ? <az`>(after <M-x>scheme-mode on my config.scm) <az`>WHY `geiser-edit-symbol-at-point: No Geiser REPL for this buffer` ?! <alezost>az`: guix-devel-activate-mode-maybe error is not related (I read you updated Emacs-Guix recently, did you restart Emacs after that?) <alezost>because you need to run geiser at first <az`>( tryin <M-x>run-geiser<RET> many times before ) <alezost>az`: could you try: "M-x run-guile" and evaluate ",use(gnu services desktop)" in there? <alezost>so just write "%desktop-services" in the repl and press "M-." immediately ← works for me <az`>yes - that workin! Thanks you good man!!! <az`>and now I can answer my first question - yes, %desktop-services include %base-services :) <rekado_>Tsutsukakushi: re apparmor: It’s not available yet, and thus we have no profiles for that yet. <rekado_>Tsutsukakushi: I’ve packaged SELinux, though, and given enough time I might give it a try to write some simple policies. <rekado_>m-o: I don’t understand the #:load-path field of Cuirass specifications <rekado_>m-o: the only place where this is used is to pass a path as the first argument to the “evaluate” tool <rekado_>m-o: but that tool doesn’t use this argument at all. <rekado_>m-o: I see that you added the %guix-package-path parameter, but that seems to be separate. <rekado_>I wonder why we need the load-path field at all. Is it only to enter a subdirectory of a repository, which contains Guix packages / Guile code that is not in the root of the repository? <rekado_>ACTION still tries to document Cuirass things, but needs to understand it first <Petter>Ooh, guix-daemon in Guile. Exciting! <ng0>starting phase `build' <ng0>Makefile:1: *** missing separator. Stop. <ng0>I would fix that if I were spectrwm developer <ng0>oh I am supposed to cd to "linux" … all these expectations. ***kelsoo1 is now known as kelsoo
<ng0>reepca: cool :) congratulations! <Tsutsukakushi>rekado_: it was more about LSM in general, not specifically apparmor <nee``>Hello, I'm packaging pngcrush and it says that the name is not trademarked, but the author claims 'common-law trademark protection'. It doesn't say anything else about trademarks or consequences. Is this alright to package? The license is a reworded, zlib equivalent. <amz3>davexunit: is the container in guix, similar to lxc or docker? can you run a sheperd for instance as first process? <rekado_>amz3: it’s a combination of user namespaces and a couple more features provided by modern versions of Linux. <amz3>I am trying to figure how they compare all the three approaches Docker, LxC and guix container <amz3>My understanding is that docker is an *application* container, where LxC is more like a light weight virtual machine <amz3>they say, running multiple process in a single docker container is an anti-pattern <rekado_>but Docker requires disk images, either one or multiple layers <rekado_>in Guix we don’t need that because we can mount the store (or a subset thereof) in the container <amz3>how do you do that? I did not understand how reading the manual <amz3>how do you mount the store (or the subset)? <amz3>that's super exciting I am going the understand something today! <mekeor>how can you `scp' something from a system running GuixSD ("A") to another system running GNU+Linux ("B") (from within a shell on B)? i keep getting "zsh:1: command not found scp" <ng0>openssh needs to be in the global packages <ng0>on the GuixSD system <ng0>I just encountered this today as I forgot about it :D <ng0>something paroneayea wrote reminded me about it <ng0>you had this problem and you had OpenSSH in your profile, like I did o nthe server, and the search in the logs just pointed me to this solution: reconfiguring the system with openssh in the global packages fixed it :) <ng0>I like the backtraces I get right now. looks like art <ng0>so many similar lines <DoublePlusGood23>two questions here. 1.) If a package is failing to build what do I do? 2.) if there's an app not currently on guix, how do I go about packaging it? <reepca>That's me, my google summer of code project was accepted today (or at least, today is when I got the email) <civodul>reepca: feel the excitement and don't be intimidated, it's warm and friendly here :-) <rekado_>DoublePlusGood23: when it fails you can keep the output with “guix build -K” and poke around to find a clue <rekado_>DoublePlusGood23: if something’s not packaged yet you can copy a simple package expression and modify it until it works. <rekado_>DoublePlusGood23: eventually, you’ll learn how to do it without having to copy an existing expression. <rekado_>note that step two usually involves going through many iterations of step 1. <DoublePlusGood23>rekado_: Sounds good. "guix import" will let me use the expression right? <rekado_>DoublePlusGood23: no, “guix import” creates a package expression from some upstream repository <rekado_>DoublePlusGood23: if you’re planning to package something that’s on pypi, CRAN, CPAN, hackage, … you might want to use “guix import” to get you a long way ahead. <rekado_>if you work with a git checkout and make your changes there you can build the new package with “./pre-inst-env guix build my-package” <rekado_>“pre-inst-env” is a script that makes sure Guix uses your local directory <rekado_>there are more instructions in the manual <rekado_>DoublePlusGood23: if you have any more questions that are more difficult to express in IRC you can also write to help-guix@gnu.org <mekeor>(how) can i put the guix manual of my currently installed guix into my INFOPATH on GuixSD? none of the folders listed in my INFOPATH seems to contain the guix-manual… <civodul>mekeor: on GuixSD /run/current-system/profile/share/info is in INFOPATH and contains guix.info <civodul>if everything goes well, that is :-) <mekeor>civodul: oh, right, that folder is in my INFOPATH but it seems to contain the manual of version 0.12 <mekeor>i think this is because the version number is not updated in the manual automatically when guix is pulled <civodul>you can figure out the actual version number with: guix package -p /run/current-system/profile -I guix <mekeor>well, or just `guix --version`, i guess :D <mekeor>ah, intersting. 0.12.0-9.25a4 is the same as 20170504.00, i guess <mekeor>maybe those two version numbers including the version number of the manual could be made matching? <civodul>actually no, it depends on whether you ran guix pull <ng0>MIT is usually either expat or the other thing Ican't remeber <ng0>it's just that many people think there is *the* MIT license <ng0>depends on the actual licese <nee``>x11 is the other variant. Check which one it is. 
