# IRC channel logs

## 2016-12-03.log

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<civodul>is it me or Savannah is broken?
<civodul>i get:
<civodul>remote: error: insufficient permission for adding an object to repository database ./objects
<civodul>remote: fatal: failed to write object
<civodul>(upon git push)
<paroneayea>civodul: hm, yikes
<paroneayea>civodul: let me try pushing to some bs branch of the 8sync-website repo and see what happens
<paroneayea>oh wait, that's on notabug, derp
<paroneayea>remote: error: insufficient permission for adding an object to repository database ./objects
<paroneayea>civodul: same error here
<paroneayea>civodul: ping #fsfsys maybe?
<paroneayea>that's serious
<civodul>paroneayea: well i'm going to bed instead ;-)
<civodul>if you could ping them that'd be awesome
<civodul>:-)
<civodul>later!
<thomassgn>anyone tried OSD for storage, like ceph, lustre or xtreemfs?
<lfam>I'm discussing the Savannah / Git issue on #savannah with a Savannah maintainer, FYI
<rwp>lfam alerted me to the push problem with git on Savannah. Sorry. It is definitely due to the migration.
<rwp>I have reverted this bit of the move for the moment. Push should be working again, through the old server.
<rwp>After I debug the current breakage (which had been working earlier, honest!) I will try again. Tomorrow.
<rwp>ACTION goes afk for a bit
<lfam>We need to do guix refresh -l python-pycrypto python2-pycrypto and evaluate the impact of this bug on the referring packages: https://github.com/dlitz/pycrypto/issues/176
<rekado_>git comes with gitweb.cgi, which needs perl-cgi. Is anyone using this in GuixSD? I think I may have to wrap fcgiwrap to set the PERL5LIB variable to include perl-cgi.
<jeqjaq>hi,is this kind of spanish people channel?
<jeqjaq>google showing some details that it is
<htgoebel1>In a 'configure' phase, I want to add some flags depending on the version:
<htgoebel1>,@(if (version<? version "5.6") '() '("-new-option"))
<htgoebel1>This gives me errors: Unbound variable: version<?
<htgoebel1>What am I missing?
***htgoebel1 is now known as htgoebel
<rekado_>htgoebel: where is “version<?” defined? You may have to add the module first.
<civodul>Hello Guix!
<adfeno>civodul: I'm trying to work on that Samba issue.
<adfeno>Does making temporary directories break reproducibility?
<Cinnamon811rc>Hello! Nobody can help me with installation GuixSD?
<adfeno>I'm planning on using GNU mktemp (or some similar Guile-related command) to create a temporary directory so that the Waf Samba in the check phase sees it as existing.
<adfeno>... And since mktemp creates directories as current user, this might get arround the issue.
<civodul>Cinnamon811rc: sure, tell us more!
<Cinnamon811rc>thank you! I tryied to install GuixSD beta version on notebook hd pavilion md3. I had chosen xfce and gnome. It took 3 days and nights, and after finished with aan error that no dependency is for something. It was after creation of signatures or something in square forms.
<Cinnamon811rc>I tried again with only xfce. It took 2 days with the same result.
<adfeno>One question: Since I'm new to Guile, how do I tell Guile to create a temporary directory, and also save the path to a variable?
<Cinnamon811rc>maybe there is an option to skip some checking, because it works smoothly
<Cinnamon811rc>I mean in guix system init with some additional options
<civodul>could you paste the error?
<civodul>adfeno: you can simply use the 'mkdir' procedure, no need for mkdtemp within the build env
<Cinnamon811rc>I do not remember it. I understand that you are devellopers and you need exact error
<Cinnamon811rc>By the way I thought before that GNU is something like garbage, but now I see that you are VERY responsible and highest levek people
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: I'm a free/libre software activst from Brazil, and, although I don't know much about GuixSD, I ask: Did you import the substitute server's key to your copy of Guix? (if you do want to make use of substitutes, of course)
<Cinnamon811rc>you use modern math, functional approach monads I like it
<buenouanq>what may I ask made you originally think of GNU as garbage?
<Cinnamon811rc>No, I only use image and made copy on flash throuh Suse writer
<Cinnamon811rc>yes, I thought that because it is free nobody will make effors endevore and be responsible
<Cinnamon811rc>but now I see that you are more higher than others
<Cinnamon811rc>and I respect you very much
<jmd>Cinnamon811rc: There is a distinction between free (as in beer) and libre.
<buenouanq>as soon as I learned about GNU and that free software was a thing and all that meant, I started moving over
<buenouanq>so it's always interesting to me to find people that can learn about it and not think/do so
<buenouanq>and unfortunately, far too common
<Cinnamon811rc>yes I understand I am sorry that I thought in this way
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: Oh... I hope you meant "free" as in "freedom". :) Anyways, you do have a point, it does get harder if our "real-life" jobs are way out of our expectations as free/libre software activists (e.g.: if it's an unfriendly environment for free/libre software activists to do their activism).
<jmd>Cinnamon811rc: Obviously nobody is obliged to help you if you haven't made any specific agreement to do so.
<jmd>Cinnamon811rc: But I many years ago, when I used to use (and pay for) proprietary software, I found also that neither the vendor nor the manufacturer would help when I had a problem.
<Cinnamon811rc>I think that if a person does everything with responsibility and the best it is the best
<adfeno>civodul: How do I save the resulting path created by mkdir procedure to a variable?
<jmd>Cinnamon811rc: I think so too. However when one talks about responsibility it begs the question "responsibility to whom?"
<Cinnamon811rc>yes you all are very intelligent and high level persons. You should continue live in the same way and you will deserve the best and it will happen
<Cinnamon811rc>to yourself and consequently to the world and any body who is not too far from the reality
<Cinnamon811rc>I installed now guix in Manjaro Cinnamon
<Cinnamon811rc>maybe it is better to create guix SD from it?
<Cinnamon811rc>but I just read instructions and do not know yet how
<Cinnamon811rc>waht about keys are they important?
<buenouanq>how to install GuixSD? is this what you're asking?
<Cinnamon811rc>keys for substitutes
<buenouanq>it's the slickest install of any distro I've ever tried
<Cinnamon811rc>I tried for 3 days and it is finished with error
<Cinnamon811rc>I agree I liked to see it, it goes wery well on lower level
<jmd>Which step took so long?
<Cinnamon811rc>i had chosen xfce and gnome, after creation of something like signature in squares it finished with an error that no dependency is
<Cinnamon811rc>for something
<Cinnamon811rc>it is alder laptop hp pavilion md3
<Cinnamon811rc>older
<buenouanq> https://www.gnu.org/software/guix/manual/html_node/System-Installation.html is this what you were following?
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: I'm not directly involved with the Guix project, so I can't represent their true goal, but my understanding of Guix and GuixSD installation is that: by default, you only get **package recipes** from Guix servers (e.g.: any server that provides such recipes that are on the server list). This means that, unless you tell your copy of Guix to rely on some server to provide the **package derivations/derivatives**, your computer will follow the recipe
<Cinnamon811rc>I wanted to learn srkribilo and system administration and how to do hacking on non free web sites it is a joke
<adfeno>I hope my message wasn't cut. Last word was "own.".
<jmd>Actually I've had problems with xfce and gnome recently.
<buenouanq>adfeno: last I see was your computer will follow the recipe'
<jmd>I wonder if there's some problem in hydra with them?
<Cinnamon811rc>I followed it but I did not signature for substitutes as somebody asked me
<adfeno>Continuing the text that was cut: ... your computer will follow the recipes instead, and so will try to build things on it's own.
<jmd>If you have a slower machine, it might be best to do your initial installation without xfce and gnome.
<jmd>You can always add them later.
<buenouanq>jmd: is there a supported/suggested way to install a graphic desktop without the graphic login? I want to just log in to a tty normally, and then startx when/if I need.
<Cinnamon811rc>but it was in memory only? because almost nothing was presreved
<Cinnamon811rc>and grub was not installed
<Cinnamon811rc>do you know options not to check everything because for 6 days it already checked everything that all work
<jmd>buenouanq: Presumably you could just add the relevant packages to your configuration. I've not tried it though.
<Cinnamon811rc>to do installation quickly
<Cinnamon811rc>I do not know which one
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: Perhaps you are experiencing the situation I described.
<buenouanq>were things partitioned correctly? this is the only part of the install guide I found lacking - It should have more explicit suggested partition schemes. I just ended up copying what my previous Debian had done with a boot, swap, and main.
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: Wait a second I'll look for the documentation on build substitutes.
<Cinnamon811rc>yes I know this very well how to partition assign labels swap etc
<jmd>Cinnamon811rc: I suggest that you try installing again (but without xfce and gnome) making a note of any warnings/errors. Then if you still get problems send a message to help-guix@gnu.org
<Cinnamon811rc>do you know how to tell guix to continue to work if there is missing something
<adfeno>↑ After doing that, don't forget to do guix pull.
<Cinnamon811rc>it is depricated pull or not?
<Cinnamon811rc>or it is in nix?
<Cinnamon811rc>quotes are for me? or they are needed?
<Cinnamon811rc>guix pull'
<buenouanq>$guix pull <Cinnamon811rc>thank you very much, please do not be disapointed with my questions <adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: Don't worry.... :) <Cinnamon811rc>have a good day, it is for everybody <Cinnamon811rc>thank you;) <adfeno>Everyone is always new to something. We musn't be afraid to ask. <Cinnamon811rc>bye-bye <Cinnamon811rc>I agree <adfeno>Bye! Peace and success! :D <jmd>Actually I'm concerned that Cinnamon811rc might have a real problem, because I too have recently found that reconfiguring with xfce and gnome enabled causes huge amounts of rebuilds. <Cinnamon811rc>for you too:) <adfeno>Hm.... <Cinnamon811rc>but cinnamon is the best <Cinnamon811rc>please add support to it in duixSD <adfeno>So, if it's a real problem, then jmd and Cinnamon811rc have a point. <Cinnamon811rc>yes it could be a real point <Cinnamon811rc>do you know how to easily add utf-8 to lout??? <buenouanq>this is my first time trying gnome and I'm actually suprizingly pleased <Cinnamon811rc>I need russian letters <jmd>I don't use lout <Cinnamon811rc>it is functional language nicer than latex <Cinnamon811rc>and diagrams for maths is nice <buenouanq>but \\TeX is \\emph{baller} <Cinnamon811rc>it has only iSO Latin 1 and Latin2 encodings <Cinnamon811rc>what does it mean? <Cinnamon811rc>\\emph{baller} <buenouanq>haha, sorry - I'll try not to use dumb slang again. <buenouanq>would mean like, it's super cool, it's the best <Cinnamon811rc>so you say some bad words I think:) <Cinnamon811rc>aha I agree <adfeno>I sometimes use Skribilo, which can output to LaTeX or Lout. <Cinnamon811rc>but if you see lout it is amazing <Cinnamon811rc>and syntax is amazing <adfeno>Skribilo accepts Guile progrraming. <buenouanq>sold <Cinnamon811rc>yes but skribilo does not change encoding in lout <adfeno>Hm... Interesting... Did you set the encoding on the Skribilo document? <Cinnamon811rc>I know only Wolfram Mathematica from programming <adfeno>buenouanq: "sold"? <buenouanq>it accepts guile, no need to explain further, I like it already <Cinnamon811rc>not yet but in the instructions it is written that lout will give only ISO Latin output <Cinnamon811rc>what is sold? sorry <buenouanq>I should just stop talking (;-___-) <Cinnamon811rc>you mean that I am spammer <buenouanq>no no, not at all <Cinnamon811rc>too much talk I see <Cinnamon811rc>ok thank you again bye bye <adfeno>Wow! <adfeno>Don't worry, he'll probably come back. <buenouanq>semi related maybe, I'm having weird things with ibus <buenouanq>everything's installed, but it doesn't switch inputs - EXCEPT, graphic emacs is now stuck ONLY in the other input. <adfeno>Hm... <buenouanq>it's very strange <buenouanq>does ibus not play well with gnome or something? <rekado_>buenouanq: I’m using the pinyin input method from IBus. Have you set GUIX_GTK3_IM_MODULE_FILE and GUIX_GTK2_IM_MODULE_FILE? <htgoebel>rekado_: “version<?” is defined in guix/scripts/package.scm, while "version>=?" is defined in guix/utils.scm. :-( <htgoebel>But using "version>=?" only half of the solution: I can' t get the version itself: Wrong type (expecting string): #<procedure version ()> <buenouanq>rekado_: no, what do I need to do? <rekado_>buenouanq: export GUIX_GTK2_IM_MODULE_FILE=$HOME/.guix-profile/lib/gtk-2.0/2.10.0/immodules-gtk2.cache
<rekado_>buenouanq: export GUIX_GTK3_IM_MODULE_FILE=$HOME/.guix-profile/lib/gtk-3.0/3.0.0/immodules-gtk3.cache <buenouanq>oh, ok - I had export GTK_IM_MODULE=ibus in my ~/.bashrc, but not these <rekado_>buenouanq: and the usual IBus variables QT_IM_MODULE=ibus, XMODIFIERS=@im=ibus, GTK_IM_MODULE=ibus; you may also need IBUS_COMPONENT_PATH=$HOME/.guix-profile/share/ibus/component
<buenouanq>~/.bashrc a good place for them again, or would you suggest somewhere else?
<buenouanq>\$HOME/.guix-profile/share/ibus/ doesn't exist for me.. what is this component thing?
<buenouanq>thank you very much btw, I hope this fixes it
<rekado_>buenouanq: could be that share/ibus/component is only installed by some input methods. I have it because of libpinyin.
<jmd>What is the "staging" branch for?
<Petter>jmd: It's for changes that require between ~300 and ~1200 rebuilds.
<jmd>Ahh
<jmd>How can I force a package to be rebuilt? (Other than guix gc -d )
<htgoebel>Some Scheme-Gurus around?
<htgoebel>In a 'configure' phase, I want to add some flags depending on the version:
<htgoebel>,@(if (version>=? version "5.6") '() '("-new-option"))
<htgoebel>But this fails with: Wrong type (expecting string): #<procedure version ()>
<htgoebel>How do I un-re-quasi-double-quote "version" correctly so I get the package's version string?
<Petter>jmd: I think you can use --check.
<jmd>Petter: I get guix build: error: build failed: some outputs of /gnu/store/wp49m0c5yv2qkvih39qvjy5qa46k4ac5-gnuplot-5.0.4-1.drv' are not valid, so checking is not possible
<Petter>I have no suggestions for this case :/
<rekado_>htgoebel: you can just let-bind the version.
<htgoebel>rekado: Pardon? I'm not a scheme hacker, I don't know what let-bind is.
<htgoebel>IC.
<rekado_>gitweb stylesheet customization requires writing to the installation directory of gitweb :-/ All config values are taken as relative to the gitweb root, so overwriting the stylesheet requires packaging.
<htgoebel>This is ugly IMHO. There should be a more elegant solution.
<htgoebel>Without the ",@(…)" part, I can access the version without problems.
<htgoebel>I need the current input's version anyway.
<htgoebel>So the let-bind would not help
<rekado_>can you show the whole thing?
<rekado_>note that packages use code staging, so different expressions are evaluated in different contexts.
<rekado_>you can also use (package-version …) to get the version of a package object.
<reirob>Hello. How do I update a Guix SD system? I have done sudo guix pull. What then?
<htgoebel>I already tried package-version and failed.
<rekado_>htgoebel: what version are you comparing there?
<rekado_>when you write the package definition you already know the current package’s version
<htgoebel>rekardo; the options near the end should only be added if buildinf pyqt 5.6 or later
<rekado_>so there’s no need to compare
<htgoebel>rekado: pyqt 5.5 inherits this build
<htgoebel>If I do not test here, I'll need to duplicate a lot of code
<htgoebel>guix build python-pyqt@5.6
<rekado_>you didn’t paste the whole thing so I don’t see where there would be duplication
<htgoebel>MOMPL
<rekado_>if you fear duplication it’s fine to write a procedure that generates the needed build phase.
<rekado_>I’d probably define a procedure that takes one argument and returns a procedure.
<rekado_>(define (pyqt-configure stubs?) (lambda* … (if stubs? …)))
<htgoebel>But I'd still need to manipulate the phases, I assume?
<rekado_>(define (pyqt-configure stubs?) (let ((flags (if stubs? …))) (lambda* … flags …)))
<rekado_>in python-pyqt-5.5 you would use (arguments (substitute-keyword-arguments (package-arguments python-pyqt) …))
<htgoebel>A lot of code for a simple difference IMHO.
<htgoebel>Nothing I can work on today. Thansk anyhow
<rekado_>what you want wouldn’t work because the unquoted code is evaluated early
<rekado_>this means that pyqt-5.5 would inherit the build phase with a fixed result
<rekado_>this is why you have to use a procedure here.
<rekado_>re gitweb stylesheet: it also works to just host the CSS file elsewhere (e.g. on the same server), loading it via HTTP.
<jmd>Is it just me, or is hydra very slow at the moment?
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: About Skribillo: jmd said "sold" because he likes the fact that Skribilo documents accept Guile programs inside.
<adfeno>So that you can create dynamic documents.
<jmd>-- Err -- I don't remember saying that.
<adfeno>I gues I quoted the wrong person.
<Cinnamon811rc>I apologize for bothering you today. May I do the installation of GuixSD a bit differently like in Arch Linux? First, mount the root partition on /mnt, copy everything from disk to /mnt, chroot to /mnt, and after proceed like in the instructions, but do everything relatively /, not /mnt. I t will prevent loss of the installed system, which is not complete by mistake.
<jmd>buenouanq said it.
<adfeno>jmd Cinnamon811rc: Yep, buenouanq was the one who said "sold".
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: Perhaps so. Personally, I don't know if it's possible to do the installation that way.
<rekado_>Cinnamon811rc: what “installed system” are you referring to?
<adfeno>I'm currently using Guix (not GuixSD) on top of my copy of Trisquel.
<Cinnamon811rc>when it is stopped by mistake I loss everything what it did during 3 days
<Cinnamon811rc>I would want to keep this job
<Cinnamon811rc>and after compile again with new options
<rekado_>Cinnamon811rc: I recommend building a small system during the initial installation.
<rekado_>usually you don’t have to build a lot of things during installation.
<Cinnamon811rc>I want to install guix SD because I want to learn system administration in purely functional way
<Cinnamon811rc>but does it have chroot utility?
<Cinnamon811rc>I think I tried but it was wrong
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: Perhaps we should follow their advice: Don't get the desktop environment right from the first install.
<Cinnamon811rc>yes yes but even in this case it can take 1 day and after I will loose all
<Cinnamon811rc>if there is a mistake
<adfeno>Install a minimal version first, then, after this, once you have it booting from your own computer's drive, reconfigure it using guix system reconfigure and related adaptations.
<htgoebel>gtg, have a nice wekkend
<Cinnamon811rc>have a nice weekend
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: Did you enable the build/package substitutes as I referenced earlier?
<Cinnamon811rc>not yet I will do it but even in this case there can be mistake
<rekado_>Cinnamon811rc: did you use the latest release?
<Cinnamon811rc>from the official web site
<rekado_>you can always abort the build.
<rekado_>when it starts compiling a lot.
<Cinnamon811rc>do you know how to add there more program before installation?
<jin>hi, Cinnamon811rc: One tip is that you try to install GuixSD on a VM first
<Cinnamon811rc>I know
<adfeno>You can also set CPU cores to use, I usually use -c 1 because my computer is old.
<Cinnamon811rc>-c 1 without quotes?
<Cinnamon811rc>guix system init -c 1
<Cinnamon811rc>like that?
<Cinnamon811rc>+ config
<Cinnamon811rc>file
<Cinnamon811rc>did you mean reconfiguartion?
<Cinnamon811rc>or what?
<Cinnamon811rc>where should I write -c 1
<adfeno>Minor question for #guix: Does guix system supports the -c option to limit CPU usage?
<Cinnamon811rc>when I installed it fist compiled C compiler gcc everything it is terrible
<Cinnamon811rc>maybe you have a generic iso image for x86_64-linux? I would install it first and after reconfigure
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: About build/package substitutes again: If you followed the documentation I pointed before and for some reason the command returns an error saying that the file doesn't exist, then try, on another terminal window, to look for places where the file might be.
<Cinnamon811rc>how to get another terminal window?
<Cinnamon811rc>maybe you will give me your own image for the beginning?
<adfeno>(I'll help by trying to guess where that file might be, just a minute)
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: As far as I can remember, you can use Ctrl + Alt+ F1 through F7
<Cinnamon811rc>aha ok thank you
<jmd>Cinnamon811rc: Such an iso is here: ftp://alpha.gnu.org/gnu/guix/guixsd-usb-install-0.11.0.x86_64-linux.xz
<Cinnamon811rc>everybody has standard computers maybe you can give some generic images on the site guixSD?
<Cinnamon811rc>ok nice
<adfeno>Question for #guix: Does the GuixSD comes with GNU screen? Or with Emacs with shell-mode on?
<jmd>adfeno: So far as I'm aware, it does not.
<adfeno>Oh... OK, it was just a minor question. We can at least use Ctrl + Alt + F1...F7 :)
<adfeno>Although I don't know how would one do text copy/paste.
<Cinnamon811rc>may I ask you last question? that image which you gave me will definitely be installed? without compiling?
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: If you enable substitutes , yes.
<jmd>It shouldn't require compiling anything.
<Cinnamon811rc>perfect and without substitutes?
<Cinnamon811rc>ok I will try, if I succed I will tell you, sorry for bothering, have a nice weekend:)
<adfeno>Cinnamon811rc: Don't worry. Feel free to ... And he left.
<albertoefg>fine and you
<adfeno>Fine too... Now since the weekend finally arived, even better.
<adfeno>albertoefg: I'm currently helping Guix project find out how to make Samba not expect configuration files inside the Guix store.
<jmd>As we can't use car and cdr - that means one has to write a lot of code like (match ((x . _ ) x))
<jmd>This is repetitive, error prone and hard to read.
<jmd>I suggest that we define some standard procedure like:
<jmd>(define (cas x) (match ((x . _) x)))
<jmd>WDYT?
<rekado_>jmd: we are using “car” in some package definitions.
<ng0>hrm... ok. it seems I ran into some linux-libre 4.8.11 or what we are on now bug
<ng0>switched to an older generation, system booted again
<ng0>pulled, reconfigured, rebooted, harddrive is in trouble again
<ng0>that's not even the system drive if i see it correctly
<ng0>I wish I could be more specific about the failure
<jmd>rekado_: But ludo doesn't like it.
<ng0>maybe one harddruve is really breaking down and the next kernel version is more sensible about it..
<civodul>jmd: please let's not play on words, it's not productive
<civodul>'match' is not a replacement for car/cdr, it's a replacement for the general pattern of destructuring lists
<adfeno>Strangely enough, I had a rescent kernel panic. Although my computer is old, and it wasn't installed from Guix (but it's Linux-libre also, and came from a repository of a collegue from Trisquel community).
<civodul>so the idea is not to replace every car/cdr directly by 'match'
<jmd>civodul: Oh. From your reviews I got that idea. I'm sorry if I was mistaken.
<civodul>instead the code has to be structured around 'match', as explained here: https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guix-devel/2016-11/msg01222.html
<civodul>i'm sorry if i was not clear enough in spite of my attempts to clarify things
<civodul>there are few car/cdr in the code and lots of 'match', so hopefully that gives an idea of what i'm trying to express
<civodul>:-)
<jmd>I certainly think that match is better than stuff like (car (caaddr( cadr (car (car x)))))
<jmd>I can also see a case for preferring match over (car x) when x is a heterogenous pair.
<jmd>But I don't think that means that it is *always* better.
<jmd>In the case of (format #f "[~a]:~a" (car val) (cdr val))
<jmd>I can't see a way of using match which would offer any advantages.
<civodul>match *always* checks that the list is exactly the way you want, a pair here
<civodul>(match val
<civodul> ((one . two)
<civodul> (format #f "..." one two)))
<civodul>that's less error-prone and IMO clearer
<ng0>so smartctl tells me i'm 'pretty much running on dying wheels' x.x
<jmd>Ok. I'll do something like that.
<rekado_>ng0: are you sure? The smartctl output is pretty confusing and misleading in my opinion.
<ng0>i only know the drives are very old
<ng0>like 5 or 6 years
<ng0>but why does one generation load, and newer ones don't? it can't be the drive
<ng0>+drives
<adfeno>The last kernel panic I saw on my computer was yesterday, I was doing some work for the boss (filling in some entries of new buildings for their sales website), and was about to open a terminal to create symbolic links for some .pdf files which would apply to multiple cases...
<adfeno>... and when I tried using shell's auto completion, it happenned.
<ng0>this is no kernel panic though. i#ver sent an email about it to the list this morning around 7 UTC.
<adfeno>ng0: Are you saying that for my case?
<ng0>no, i'm just saying my error is somewhere between initramfs and system
<rekado_>ACTION notices a couple of commits with confusing/non-compliant commit messages.
<jmd>civodul: Something else. There are several existing instances of the word "keytab" in the manual which are unquoted. Do you want me to fix those too?
<fr33domlover>I just installed GuixSD on a laptop that has a wifi chip that doesn't work with free software. As a result, it seems, the networking service (and ssh-daemon) fails to start
<jmd>fr33domlover: That would be expected.
<fr33domlover>set-network-interface-flags on wlp9s0b1: No such file or directory
<fr33domlover>I don't want to use that chip
<fr33domlover>I have a USB wifi stick
<fr33domlover>And most of the time I use an ethernet cable anyway
<jmd>Perhaps there is a way to disable that interface.
<fr33domlover>yeah, but how? :-P
<jmd>This is a static networking service?
<fr33domlover>ACTION looks for network service config in Guix docs
<ng0>fr33domlover: rfkill switch / or software? an option in proprietary bios?
<fr33domlover>ng0, good idea, will check in bios
<jmd>If all else fails, I think you can pass an option to the kernel to disable that device.
<jmd>But I'd have check the linux docs to find out how to do that.
<fr33domlover>perhaps it's enough to disable the kernel module
<fr33domlover>so that it doesn't even try to touch the device
<jmd>Yes. Somthing like that.
<jmd>I'll still be recognised as a device.
<fr33domlover>hmm bios lets me turn off integrated nic
<fr33domlover>but then i also lose ethernet, don't i
<fr33domlover>ACTION looks for physical switch
<dvc>does someone know why this would only return zeroes? (call-with-input-file "btrfs.txt" (lambda (port) (get-bytevector-n port 500000)))
<dvc>hexdump -C btrfs.txt | less yields the expected result
<dvc>ah, it mostly returns zeros, not exclusively
<jmd>fr33domlover: rfkill.default_state=0
<jmd>Pass that to the kernel
<fr33domlover>jmd, thanks
<jmd>(Disclaimer: I haven't tried it)
<fr33domlover>jmd, I rebooted. In GRUB I pressed 'e' to edit the config. At the end of the line that starts with 'linux' I appended that thing. Pressed F10, system boots, kernel still warns about "missing firmware" and services still fail to start. i wonder if that's really the reason though
<fr33domlover>in the console i see "failed to staer service" and only then ethernet link becomes ready
<fr33domlover>ah it seems to be related to the ethernet
<fr33domlover>enp5s0: unable to load firmware path, deblobbed
<fr33domlover>weird, it has always worked out of the box
<fr33domlover>s/path/patch
<dvc>Found the bug. I don't know how I managed to convert 0x10000 to 1024 =P
<rekado>fr33domlover: did you use linux-libre before?
<dvc>fr33domlover: I ran into that problem too
<dvc>we are not allowed to discuss solutions here :)
<fr33domlover>rekado, iirc not directly: the last kernels i used are debian's and trisquel's
<fr33domlover>both are 100% free but they aren't GNU Linux-Libre technically
<rekado>I thought trisquel also used linux libre.
<fr33domlover>i do get ethernet up though
<fr33domlover>ACTION tries again to verify
<fr33domlover>it works
<fr33domlover>i can use ifconfig to get network up
<fr33domlover>now let's try to start networking service... nope, error
<fr33domlover>set-networking-interface-flags on wlp9s0b1: operation not possible due to RF-kill
<fr33domlover>guix, y u so stubborn?
<fr33domlover>i don't want to use that chip!
<fr33domlover>dvc, why not? a solution is exactly what i want :-)
<dvc>if it is a firmware problem then lspci -k should show that the kernel module for wifi wasn't loaded
<fr33domlover>(one that involves only free software of course)
<dvc>wlp9... is a wifi card right?
<fr33domlover>yeah but i don't want to use it, i have working ethernet
<dvc>do you have %desktop-services in your operating-system
<dvc>thing
<dvc>there is a wicd-service in there by default which I assume is causing the wifi error and provides 'networking
<fr33domlover>yes. lspci -k does list the wifi chip
<dvc>replace it with (dhcp-client-service) is my suggestion
<dvc>but does it list a kernel module?
<fr33domlover>dvc, ah wait
<fr33domlover>i don't use desktop-services
<fr33domlover>no x11 at all
<fr33domlover>sorry :P
<joshuaBPMan_>Hello, I'm dual booting parabola and guixSD. I installed parabola first. Then guixSD. (guixSD overwrote parabola's install of grub). I then configured my config.scm to correctly boot guixSD and parabola.
<dvc>ok I'm out of guesses then =P
<joshuaBPMan_>right now I'm logged in as root.
<fr33domlover>dvc, perhaps i should physically get rid of the chip...
<joshuaBPMan_>I can log into guixSD as a normal user, but I cannot start gnome as a normal user.
<dvc>when exactly is it failing?
<joshuaBPMan_>rekado. yes. Do you know of a way to check a log file? So I can see why gnome is not loading properly when I log in as a normal user?
<dvc>fr33domlover: does ip link list the wifi card? that's weird if there isn't a kernel driver loaded it shouldn't be there...
<joshuaBPMan_>rekado: also my parabola and guixSD are sharing the same home partition, but different root partitions. Actually I might have just found the reason. My currently ls -lh /home/joshua currently shows my user as "joshua" but my group is 2000.
<ng0>have you created a normal user and set a password for it, joshuaBPMan_ ?
<joshuaBPMan_>I'll try to change run chgrp -R joshua /home/joshua
<joshuaBPMan_>ng0: Yes. I can login to guixSD as a normal user. ie: I switch to a free tty and login just fine. BUT I can't login and start gnome.
<ng0>hu
<ng0>ok
<fr33domlover>dvc, yes, and so does ifconfig -a
<adfeno>ACTION is reminded of the time when he found out that user:group information is stored as numbers, not pretty names.
<joshuaBPMan_>actually nevermind. I should modify my config.scm to add a new group with id 2000.
<jmd>Actually I'm concerned that we have minumum_uid=1000 hard coded in so many places...
<joshuaBPMan_>jmd: really? Isn't that to distinguish system groups from user groups? ie: system groups have a lower number and user groups have a higher one.
<jmd>It's to distinguish "Real" users from Pseudousers
<ng0>rekado: is this gnu: psyclpc: Downgrade to 27f21a3bf0d140f0d2680c695e8df229b46a814b. okay for an commit? otherwise I'm open for suggestions how to reword it
<ng0>the commit hash is the upstream commit
<rekado>better use the new guix version number
<ng0>hm.. ok
<ng0>noted for next time. I'll comment on the patch only what it is though the message before it explains it
<ng0>thanks
<ng0>no, i already commited it like that
<ng0>due to the lack of an upstream issue tracker
<ng0>I forgot that the commit I originally used did introduce the problem of pcre not being fully functional again at our (upstream) side
<ng0>so in practice that means if I finish packaging psyced, people might complain about xmpp functionality being broken
<dvc>fr33domlover: so does dmesg say?
<fr33domlover>dvc, i'm done for day. will continue this another day. thanks for the help :)
<fr33domlover>*today
<dvc>well, don't know if it was particularly helpful... have a nice evening
<ng0>if hte linux releases continue like this, we'll be at linux-libre-500 in some years
<rekado>ng0: a revert is not the same as erasing a commit. A revert just creates a new commit with the changes applied backwards.
***orly_owl_ is now known as orly_owl
<rekado>I don’t understand why a package’s version should depend on a package that hasn’t been added yet.
<rekado>I wouldn’t downgrade the package at all until there’s an actual problem.
<ng0>thne I haven't described the problem enough in detail
<ng0>I don't want the software in master which is known to have a problem, but I added the commit before I was remember that this problem exists (lack of issue tracker for this application, i have addressed it and hope it gets added soon to our issue tracker), so it builds, yeah, but it has problems. the only known problem exists in combination with psyced, which depends on psyclpc at runtime. if you were to use
<ng0>this version you'd have no xmpp functionality. it is possible that there are no other problems at all. I've pointed out that we (upstream) need to write tests for both applications which can prevent relying just on "you know the code".
<ng0>so if you think it's okay to keep the package as it is, i'm okay with it
<ng0>from upstream perspective I found the software broken and want to revert until it (the way pcre is used) is fixed.
<ng0>sorry, terms
<rekado>if you’re involved with upstream, could you push for proper releases to be made?
<rekado>by “proper” I don’t mean bug-free, but something that’s not just “whatever is in master right now”
<ng0>lynX prefers to release bug free states
<ng0>i keep poking for release tarballs though, so occasionally they happen. ah yeah i just remembered:
<ng0>the fix for this problem will be in psyced, not psyclpc
<ng0>so theoretically psyclpc is good
<ng0>or not?
<ng0>i think the moment this is fixed in psyced, a new release can be made, as the license of psyced changed some days ago
<ng0>from GPL-2 (1996 - 2010) + Expat (2010 - 2016) to AGPL3
<ng0>ok. I thought about it.. there's no harm in keeping that psyclpc version. and I'll ask for a new release to be made as soon as psyced is fixed. i think the preference was to release both together
<ng0>i'll put a summary of what I've written as an reply to the thread so it doesn't get applied
<Apteryx>Hi Guix! Is it possible to get lsh to use the openssh config files under ~/.ssh/config? This was very handy.
<rekado>Apteryx: it only mentions that OpenSSH keys can be imported.
<efraim>we have a clock error on one of the armhf build machines
<efraim>tar: Email-MessageID-1.406/t: time stamp 2015-08-10 16:08:54 is 1439162121.681128038 s in the future
<paroneayea>wingo: I think I figured out the base cause as to why I couldn't get fibers packaged properly, but not the exact cause
<paroneayea>it can't find the epoll library, which I knew, but I think guix is doing something with one of the path adjusting steps
<paroneayea>because if I --keep-failed and become guixbuilder01 and do ./configure again and then make
<paroneayea>it builds fine
<paroneayea>still kind of a guess though.
<lfam>Tricky!
<lfam>When you build "by hand", are you restricting the builder's filesystem access? Could it be finding what it needs in /usr?
<lfam>paroneayea ^
<paroneayea>lfam: it could be, though it looked like what it was failing with earlier was
<paroneayea>ice-9/boot-9.scm:753:26: In procedure dispatch-exception:
<paroneayea>which I think is provided in the package itself, in theory
<lfam>You can use guix environment --container` to test my hypothesis, if you find it compelling :)
<lfam>In my admittedly limited experience, it seems that "file not found" errors can be reached by many different flavors of "can't find it" problems
<paroneayea>yeah
<paroneayea>hrm
<lfam>Not enough error messages to choose from :)
<paroneayea>maybe I shouldn't work on this right now. I feel like most of my week has been spent on rabbit holes I never quite got to the end of which isn't very satifying.
<paroneayea>time to hack on something fun.
<lfam>I know exactly the feeling you are describing
<lfam>One needs to actually achieve something once in a while!
<lfam>But, I'd say that your investigations into creating an ISO et cetera are really valuable
<paroneayea>thanks lfam :)
<paroneayea>I did accomplish real and concrete things for my client work I'm doing right now, so at least *they* seem satisfied ;)
<paroneayea>and I guess since income is a necessary thing, that's not nothing ;)
<lfam>Yes, that's good!
<civodul>jmd: re keytab, you can leave the other instances alone, it just sounded like a new word to me :-)
<jmd>ok
<civodul>paroneayea: i concur, that's very useful!
<civodul>when we know how to create ISOs, i'm happy to add that to 'guix system' or some such
<civodul>Apteryx: the lsh client doesn't handle ~/.ssh/config
<paroneayea>civodul: :)
<paroneayea>well I feel a bit better about the week then :)
<civodul>:-)
<civodul>that happens to me occasionally
<civodul>recently i spent a lot of time trying to fix the icecat/gtk interaction issues, with missing schemas
<civodul>that seemed trivial, but no, i wouldn't manage
<paroneayea>ACTION nods
<paroneayea>ACTION hacking on what might become replacement backup system for dirvish, since that turned out to have problematic dependencies (no license)
<ng0>are icecat updates easy? I don't want to try it as we seem to cary lots of extra patches and fixes
<lfam>Speaking of backups, I'm still intrigued by chop-backup :)
<paroneayea>maybe I should take inspiration from davexunit on the name and call it something with "playful sinisterness"
<paroneayea>"heist"? ;)
<paroneayea>guess that sounds more like penetration testing software ;)
<paroneayea>it does have a "bank" and "vaults" though!
<lfam>I really like the "shareable" property of chop-backup.
<paroneayea>ACTION thinks "this looks like tahoe-lafs" and sees libchop page at bottom mentions tahoe-lafs :)
<paroneayea> http://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/libchop-devel/2011-09/msg00000.html oh by civodul, nice :)
<lfam>:)
<lfam>I had trouble getting it to build, and I figured that civodul seems busy with another project, so... ;)
<fr33domlover>hey paroneayea, installed GuixSD today. read your post where you mentioned lack of LVM and encryption
<ng0>well we have encryption now
<ng0>but no lvm
<fr33domlover>ng0, on debian based distros i usually have /home, /var and swap as LVM volumes inside LUKS encrypted space
<paroneayea>hey fr33domlover, nice
<paroneayea>yeah I'm using an encrypted /home, but now there's an encrypted root option
<paroneayea>but no encrypted lvm, which would be nice for, as you said, swap
<lfam>And to enlarge the root partition when you realize it must be a little bigger than on Debian :)
<fr33domlover>lfam, usually not encrypted so far
<fr33domlover>paroneayea, are there docs on that?
<fr33domlover>i did web search and all i found was your post
<paroneayea>fr33domlover: hm, I remember it was some work to figure it out. I don't know if the current docs are better.
<paroneayea>I also haven't tried the encrypted root bit
<paroneayea>fr33domlover: but I can pastebin you my config
<paroneayea>you'll need to run the cryptsetup command to encrypt your partition manually
<paroneayea>I mean, to set up the initial partition
<paroneayea>fr33domlover: http://paste.lisp.org/display/333195
<fr33domlover>paroneayea, i mean encrypted root, or /var :-) it's a home server so encrypted home isn't very useful to me, most data will be in /var/lib
<fr33domlover>paroneayea, thanks :-)
<paroneayea>fr33domlover: gotcha
<paroneayea>fr33domlover: I'm not doing encrypted root yet
<paroneayea>that just came out!
<paroneayea>someone else will have to answer that
<paroneayea>good luck :)
<fr33domlover>does GuixSD let me have separate partitions for /var and /home and perhaps /boot etc.
<fr33domlover>i installed with just 2 partitions: root and swap
<ng0>fr33domlover: works for me, on librebooted and proprietary/vendor bios devices
<ng0>the encrypted root i mean
<civodul>rekado: did you have to set fastcgi_temp_path & co. in your nginx conf on GuixSD?
<civodul>or anyone who's use GuixSD's nginx service
<efraim>civodul: http://hydra.gnu.org:3000/build/1660335/log/tail-reload clock error on one of the armhf build machines
<civodul>efraim: mark_weaver ↑ :-)