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<kyamashita>Interesting. If I run the redeclipse_linux binary from within its /gnu/store directory, it finds the configuration files, but not the game data.
<anthk_>redeclipse is on guix now?
<kyamashita>anthk_: I'm working on it.
<kyamashita>Getting the executable to work with the data is the main hold up right now.
<quiliro>civodul: it is weird .... it was downloadding texlive when asked to install libreoffice i stopped it and decided to just install texlive ....nevertheless it did not download any more ...even if it had just downloaded 1.5 MB in the previous try
<quiliro>it went ahead and started compiling
<quiliro> is continuing download now
<quiliro>1.76 GB ....10%
<quiliro>I thought that openfwwf-firmware was now included in GuixSD
<quiliro>but i cannot find it with guix package -s openfwwf-firmware
<quiliro>not output to that commnad
<bavier>quiliro: the package hasn't been pushed to master
<bavier>I was kinda waiting for validation from you ;)
<quiliro>bavier: how can i validate it?
<bavier>quiliro: put the package definitions, along with the necessary (use-modules ...) into your system configuration file, then 'guix system reconfigure ...'
<bavier>and put a (firmware openfwwf-firmware) into your operating-system declaration
<bavier>the firmware package will be built during the system reconfigure then
<quiliro>bavier: you mean i should copy all addition made in to my configuration file?
<htgoebel>Does anybody know how to handle these "TEST FAILED: /gnu/store/xxx/lib/python3.4/site-packages does NOT support .pth files" errors?
<bavier>quiliro: yes
<mood>How do I find out in which module a package is defined?
<bavier>quiliro: you might need some additional modules, like (guix packages) (guix build-system gnu), etc.
<bavier>mood: you can do 'guix package --show=<foo>'
<quiliro>bavier: i get the part about (firmware openfwwf-firmware)...and about the package definitions now but i dont understand what to do with (use-modules ...)
<mood>bavier: Thanks.
<bavier>mood: in the "location" field of the output
<quiliro>bavier: those are not included in %base-packages ?
<bavier>quiliro: the (use-modules ...) is for importing the necessary guile symbols
<quiliro>i guess i need to read more...i dont get it
<davexunit_>ever use Python? it's like 'import'
<quiliro>yes...i get that ...but i dont even know where to put what
<quiliro>i will get back to you when re read everything
<quiliro>but it is difficult to get a wired connection for me
<quiliro>so i will have to learn the theory without practice
<quiliro>if my wifi would work, i would be able to connect at least once every 2 days
<quiliro>it is a question of the chicken and the egg, i guess
<bavier>quiliro: would it help to paste your system config?
<bavier>I could test the change I'm thinking of and paste it back
<bavier>it'd be nice to help get your wifi working
<quiliro>bavier: cool!
<mood>I am running `guix package -p foo -m manifest-file.scm, but it fails with "guix package: error: rename-file: Is a directory" What is it trying to rename?
<quiliro>bavier: i am installing netcat now to paste
<bavier>mood: do you have a directory "foo" in the current directory?
<mood>bavier: Oh, duh, yes. Thank you
<quiliro>i can now see use-modules
<quiliro>i was so absent minded
<quiliro>now i undestand a little more
<quiliro>is it possible to guix package -i texlive and while that is executing do guix system reconfigure? or will that break GuixSD?
<quiliro>i suppose it will not because of the hashes that guix uses
<civodul>indeed, this is safe
<quiliro>so the installation hash is different for each becase the order of installation is not the same
<quiliro>wow, this is incredible
<bavier>quiliro: the hashes are calculated from the inputs
<quiliro>no wonder the fuss about guix and such high level people contributing so much code
<quiliro>bavier: buit the order of the inputs does matter, right?
<quiliro>bavier: but the order of the inputs does matter, right?
<bavier>yes, the order matters for the hash, because it affects the underlying derivation
<quiliro>for the hash
<quiliro>really awesome
<quiliro>almost impossible to have an error
<quiliro>but what about hte symlinks....they could be linked to the wrong place
<bavier>quiliro: dependable and hackable
<quiliro>oh...but you can rollback
<quiliro>and neither is wrong....just different
<bavier>quiliro: what I had in mind for you config:
<bavier>my computer's building a vm with that config, but my internet is a bit slow, so it could be a bit before substitutes can download and I can boot the vm
<bavier>quiliro: notice the modules I had to add for the package definitions
<quiliro>bavier: should i test it myself?
<bavier>quiliro: sure, I'm assuming you'd have most of the store items already
<bavier>and you can't mess up your current system if it doesn't work
<kyamashita>AKA, this page and its contents should be ejected from the sphere of public discourse.
<quiliro>bavier: /home/quiliro/desktop.scm:82:8: error: source expression failed to match any pattern
<quiliro>the line about the license
<bavier>quiliro: huh, it worked for me. copy-paste error?
<quiliro>bavier: will redo
<quiliro>bavier: downloaded directly instead of copy pasting
<quiliro>but get another error now
<quiliro>quiliro@komputilo ~$ guix system reconfigure desktop.scm guix system: error: failed to load 'desktop.scm': ice-9/eval.scm:393:14: In procedure eval: ice-9/eval.scm:393:14: Unbound variable: diff
<quiliro>let me edit
<bavier>ACTION away
<quiliro>bavier: ERROR: In procedure append: ERROR: In procedure append: Wrong type argument in position 1 (expecting empty list): #<package openfwwf-firmware@5.2 /home/quiliro/desktop.scm:70 2f11d80>
<davexunit_>quiliro: append operates on lists
<davexunit_>you cannot append a non-list to a list
<quiliro>why could have this error occurred with this config file running guix system reconfigure desktop.scm
<quiliro>davexunit_: oh
<quiliro>davexunit_: what change do you suggest
<davexunit_>quiliro: the 'firmware' field accepts a list
<quiliro>davexunit_: so it should be (firmware (list openfwwf-firmware)) instead of (firmware openfwwf-firmware)
<quiliro>it works now :-)
<quiliro>will reboot
<quiliro> to test openfwwf-firmware\\
<quiliro>no error
<quiliro>thanks davexunit_
<quiliro>wil be back in 5
<kyamashita>Is GTK+ in GuixSD not able to find any module paths? Or just user-installed ones?
<quiliro>hello again
<kyamashita>Hi, quiliro. Are you posting from GuixSD now?
<quiliro>i rebooted several times with xfce and gnome
<quiliro>but it will not recognize the wifi card
<quiliro>kyamashita: i was using guixsd before also
<quiliro>i am very happy
<quiliro>but in order to advance more on guixsd, it is very useful to have the wifi working
<quiliro>kyamashita: yes....i am posting from guixsd
<kyamashita>quiliro: Yes, I remember that you were amazed by Guix's features. I don't know much about wifi configuration in GuixSD, though.
<quiliro>kyamashita: indeeed, i love guixsd's philosophy
<quiliro>i already <3 GuixSD
<quiliro>b43-phy0 ERROR: Firmware file "b43-open/ucode5.fw" in dmesg
<quiliro>where do i find that file?
<quiliro>i suppose it is installed by openfwwf-firmware
<lfam>quiliro: What is the result of `ls /gnu/store/*openfwwf-firmware*`?
<quiliro>i can see /gnu/store/yjycspnbxyafys84hn4f1phjy37fai20-openfwwf-firmware-5.2/ucode5.fw
<lfam>quiliro: You have the file 'ucode5.fw', but it's not in the 'b43-open' directory
<quiliro>lfam: should i ln -s ?
<lfam>So, maybe the openfwwf-firmware packages needs improvement? Or, whatever needs the firmware should be adjusted
<quiliro>or is there something else to do
<lfam>quiliro: No, that won't work
<lfam>You can't make any changes in /gnu/store except with the Guix tools
<quiliro>that is the result of the command you asked
<lfam>quiliro: Can you share your openfwwf-firmware package on termbin?
<quiliro>lf how?
<quiliro>lfam: how?
<quiliro>just did guix system reconfigure desktop.scm
<lfam>You put the openfwwf-firmware package in desktop.scm?
<quiliro>lfam: yes
<quiliro>with one correction
<quiliro>this is the updated version
<quiliro>lfam: ^
<lfam>What's the correction?
<lfam>quiliro: I mistakenly thought that ucode5.fw was part of openfwwf-firmware, but it seems to be part of b43-tools instead
<lfam>quiliro: In the openfwwf-firmware package definition, do you see where b43-tools is in 'native-inputs'? Try changing that to 'inputs'
<lfam>Just to see if it works...
<quiliro>lfam: (native-inputs `(("b43-tools" ,b43-tools))) to (inputs `(("b43-tools" ,b43-tools))) ?
<lfam>Yes, try that.
<quiliro>lfam: done with no errors....restart now?
<quiliro>will reboot
<lfam>Yes, I would try rebooting
<quiliro>no luck with changing native-inputs to inputs
<lfam>Same error in dmesg?
<quiliro>lfam: yes
<quiliro>$ ls /gnu/store/*/ucode5.fw /gnu/store/l7k3psmq08ad40swi1kf9as4bjizlz7i-openfwwf-firmware-5.2/ucode5.fw /gnu/store/yjycspnbxyafys84hn4f1phjy37fai20-openfwwf-firmware-5.2/ucode5.fw
<quiliro>lfam: ucode5.fw is still not in b43-open
<quiliro>so linux-libre will not find it
<lfam>quiliro: Do you think it would help to inspect the Debian package?
<quiliro>lfam: i will inspect it...but i have no idea
<lfam>quiliro: Unfortunately I don't have any good ideas, either
<quiliro>lfam: your ideas have been great
<lfam>They didn't work ;)
<quiliro>it is your will to help that is very important
<quiliro>it would be bad not to have ideas!
<lfam>That is true!
<quiliro>but bad ideas are very good!
<lfam>You have a great attitude :)
<quiliro>because one idea is enough for success
<lfam>Do you know the model number of the network interface that isn't working?
<quiliro>lfam: the worst is not to try
<quiliro>but it is rev 01 not rev 02
<quiliro>closed the chat
<lfam>sneek: later tell quiliro: It would be helpful to see what makes it work on one of those other free distros: gNewSense, Parabola, or Trisquel.
<sneek>Got it.
<quiliro>it works in trisquel but not in parabola
<sneek>quiliro, you have 1 message.
<sneek>quiliro, lfam says: It would be helpful to see what makes it work on one of those other free distros: gNewSense, Parabola, or Trisquel.
<quiliro>lfam: ^
<quiliro>thanks sneek bot
<quiliro>sneek: bot thank you
<lfam>sneek: botsnack
<quiliro>sneek: is shy!
<quiliro>it is amazin ....i have the body figure i had 25 years ago
<quiliro>noticed that when i saw marxistvegan
<quiliro>i gave up meat and diary in august
<jmd>I gave it up 6 times!
<quiliro>jmd: wow
<quiliro>i have never before given them up.... i could persist thanks that it is the only way i could quit smoking
<jmd>Why not take it one step further - give up eating altogether?
<quiliro>jmd: haha\\
<quiliro>sometimes i do!
<quiliro>about 6 times.....
<quiliro>it is a very cleansing practice
<quiliro>but never stop drinking water
<jmd>I only drink water if it has been diluted with whiskey.
<quiliro>i gave up liquor too...never liked it much
<quiliro>it is an aquired taste
<jmd>quiliro: Gee. You don't have much fun in life, do you?
<quiliro>jmd: i do...there is always love and sex and travel
<quiliro>liquor does not make me enjoy more
<quiliro>rather less
<quiliro>it is an uninhibitor
<quiliro>so i rather uninhibit myself intentionally!
<quiliro>without the hangover ;-)
<quiliro>the body can generate very strong drugs
<quiliro>so why use the artificial type!
<quiliro>but i have fun with friends that drink too
<quiliro>i just dont
<jmd>Ethanol is not at all artificial. It is the by-product of a natural biological process.
<quiliro>once they get used to is all good
<quiliro>jmd: i am talking about the artificial effects
<lfam>One interesting thing about ethanol is how simple the ethanol molecule is. Most drugs are very complex in comparison
<Arcanos>Hello everyone
<quiliro>but anyways, i consider it almost as natural as petroleum....
<lfam>Hello Arcanos!
<quiliro>lfam: oh...did not know that
<quiliro>hello Arcanos
<lfam>quiliro: I'm not saying that makes it good or bad. I simply find it interesting
<quiliro>lfam: i know
<jmd>Nitrous Oxide is a simple molecule too.
<lfam>Indeed, even simpler
<lfam>Amazing to me that my consciousness seems more or less unknowable to me, but can be obviously altered by N20
<jmd>How can I force a local rebuild of a package?
<lfam>jmd: Pass --check to `guix build`
<lfam>Also see --challenge and --rounds=n
<Arcanos>Is guix source based, package based or both?
<jmd>(if I correctly understand what you mean by those terms).
<lfam>A crude metaphor for Guix is that it's a collection of recipes to build software from source. If there are pre-built binaries available from a "substitutes" server you authorize, then you will get binaries. Otherwise, it builds from source. It switches between these methods transparently.
<quiliro>Arcanos: you should watch the presntation by mark and david
<quiliro>let me see if i can give you the link
<Arcanos>Link me, i will check it out tomorrow when im not at work
<lfam>The other special thing about Guix (and Nix) is that packages are named with hashes of all their dependencies, build tools, package recipes, etc, and the build software is put into a content-addressable store.
<lfam>s/build software/built software
<quiliro>check the talks March 2016, LibrePlanet, Solving the Deployment Crisis with GNU Guix (Christopher Allan Webber and David Thompson): slides, video (WebM; 44 minutes)
<Arcanos>How does it compare to something like gentoo
<quiliro>Arcanos: the idea is to have nearly perfect binary reproducible builds
<kyamashita>Okay. I've been trying to package Red Eclipse for Guix for the past week, but I'm having quite a bit of trouble with it. Here's the package definition so far:
<quiliro>and dependencies correctly satisfied
<kyamashita>This one only gives a configuration folder.
<lfam>Arcanos: I recommend you read the original Nix paper by Eelco Dolstra. It will give you a good idea of what Guix / Nix are about at their core and how they differ from other systems. It's linked to from this page:
<quiliro>and per user software
<lfam>Arcanos: I think it's this one: Nix: A Safe and Policy-Free System for Software Deployment
<jmd>How do I add a comment to a bug in debbugs?
<ijp>arcanos: category error. guix proper isn't meant to be a full distribution
<ijp>jmd: just email a reply
<quiliro>Arcanos: and the web site
<quiliro>Arcanos: guixsd is a distro
<quiliro>guix is a package manager
<quiliro>two different things ijp points out
<ijp>jmd: or the regular mailing list with bug#N in the subject
<jmd>(but that's just splitting hairs)
<Arcanos>Hmm, is guix easy to get working on trisquel7?
<lfam>Arcanos: Should be. I run it on Debian testing and it's really easy to set up
<quiliro>for the package manager
<lfam>(I know Trisquel is not Debian, but they are related)
<kyamashita>Arcanos: If you follow the manual, everything will work out of the box. I've done it before.
<quiliro>is it possible to make an image of guixsd to install in a vm on another gnu ?
<quiliro>in order to keep the downloaded packages
<quiliro>or there is a better way to install offline?
<quiliro>i would like to download all guixsd to test offline
<quiliro>or even just guix with all the packages
<kyamashita>quiliro: I'm not sure. That's an interesting question, though.
<Arcanos>Does guix pull its source packages from git?
<jmd>At least, not as a rule.
<jmd>Git is a software management tool, not a package archive.
<lfam>Some of our packages take their source code from upstream git repositories, but we prefer to use release tarballs when they exist
<lfam>And not just upstream git repos, but other source code management tools as well
<Arcanos>Hmm, so im assuming that there is a guix repo, does it also pull in any needed build deps?
<jmd>It automatically takes care of depdendencies, yes.
<lfam>The Guix code base includes the Guix package manager software, the package recipes, and also code for the OS, GuixSD. Upstream code is fetched as necessary
<Arcanos>Huh, seems similar to gentoos emerge in a way
<jmd>There are certain similarities.
<jmd>But it does a lot more than gentoo
<Arcanos>Probably in a more efficient manner too.
<jmd>Well it depends on what you mean by efficient.
<Arcanos>After installing guix, would it be possible to convert an existing trisquel system into a guixSD system?
<lfam>It depends on what you want to preserve. It would be trivial to preserve /home
<Arcanos>That would be all i would want to preserve
<jmd>But that is quite orthogonal to the issue of installing guix.
<Arcanos>Does guix have build flags like emerge?
<jmd>No. That would defeat one of the primary purposes of the system.
<Arcanos>Ok. So I'm assuming the syntax is something like apt?
<jmd>something like it.
<lfam>If you can successfully use apt, then you can use guix for package management:
<kyamashita>I'd say it's more similar to pacman's syntax.
<jmd>But unlike "apt-get install", "guix package --install" does not have to be run as root!
<lfam>Yes, packages are per-user, except for some cases on GuixSD
<jmd>lfam: Which are the exceptional cases?
<Arcanos>But that doesn't really make sense on a single user system
<lfam>jmd: Global packages defined in the operating system configuration
<jmd>Unix is mult-user.
<lfam>Yes, there are no single-user GNU / Linux distros AFAIK
<jmd>But if you did have a Single user system, then the same would apply. There would be one package profile per user - which would mean it would be global for all users.
<lfam>And if you mean "a single human user", I still think it makes sense. I don't want root to be subject to bugs in, for example, my web browser
<Arcanos>Now it makes sense
<kyamashita>ACTION questions ijp's quit message...
<lfam>ACTION also wondered...
<yolan>I do not get what is GUIX.. is it based on another distro?
<alezost>yolan: no, "Guix" is a package manager, "GuixSD" is distro based on the Guix package manager
<yolan>alezost, a new distro, an upcoming one? :)
<alezost>upcoming? It is a working distro, you can install it if you want
<yolan>i'll buy an X200 or T400 form minifree, and i am actually searching for the best free distro to install in :)
<yolan>alezost, ok yes sorry i am not a native speaker, i wanted to say "Who will become popular" ^^
<yolan>alezost, and it'suser friendly (like debian / ubuntu) or more for expert (like arch) ?
<alezost>right now it is more for experts I think.
<alezost>The main problem is the number of packages (about 3000)
<yolan>In what way is that a problem?
<alezost>yolan: you may not find the package you need :-)
<yolan>Ohhh i see yes, not enough packages.
<yolan>You'll grow, do not worry about that
<yolan>Debian philosophy ! ;)
<rekado>hey guix!
<rekado>I'm playing with the Objective C compiler right now. Doesn't seem to be usable. Is there a way I could add the ObjC compiler's libexec directory to the search path of the "gcc" executable?
<rekado>our gcc-objc package doesn't come with it's own "gcc" executable (or any executable in $out/bin), because that would collide with the regular "gcc" binaries.
<civodul>Hello Guix!
<civodul>mark_weaver: i've just started an evaluation of gnome-updates
<gour>does guix provide,in general, everything as nixos?
<quiliro>hi people!
<quiliro>hi civodul
<quiliro>tryed bavier 's fix for bcm4311 rev1 wireless card firmware
<quiliro>but it wouldn't work
<quiliro>it still would not install ucode5.fw in b43-open directory
<quiliro>it is in another directory, nevertheless
<quiliro> /gnu/store/l7k3psmq08ad40swi1kf9as4bjizlz7i-openfwwf-firmware-5.2/ucode5.fw and /gnu/store/yjycspnbxyafys84hn4f1phjy37fai20-openfwwf-firmware-5.2/ucode5.fw
<rekado>hi quiliro, what is this fix? Is this a patch to openfwwf-firmware?
<quiliro>rekado: yes bavier commited and asked me to test it in my config.scm
<civodul>gour: Guix and GuixSD are much younger than NixOS, so Guix currently has fewer packages and fewer OS services
<gour>civodul: gnome works, right?
<civodul>yes, though with glitches here and there
<civodul>Guix also has different goals, it provides only free software, and everything is hackable in Scheme
<gour>civodul: i know that my netvook would require new wifi dongle, but wonder if my desktop (currently running Debian sid) would be guixsd-ready hardware-wise?
<civodul>apart maybe from wifi, it should be fine
<gour>for graphic i use open-source ati driver...
<gour>what aobut bluetooth adapters (not used much, but still...)?
<civodul>hmm dunno
<gour>i also see: firmware: direct-loading firmware rtl_nic/rtl8168d-2.fw in my dmesg (gigabit ethernet)?
<civodul>the "Hardware Considerations" section in the manual has some info, but could be updated based on your experience
<civodul>dunno, but this firmware is unavailable on GuixSD AFAIK
<gour>it looks it's showstopper for me atm - firmware is part of package
<quiliro>rekado: this is what i get
<quiliro>i do have the file requested by the kernel
<quiliro>even though it is i another directory ;P
<quiliro>it will not download the firmware
<quiliro>rekado: it is adding openfwwf to Guix
<civodul>tip of the day:
<civodul>guix package -i patches && patches fetch
<civodul>feedback welcome!
<civodul>i still don't really know how to use 'patches', but we should try
<quiliro>found this
<quiliro>and this
<quiliro>and this
<quiliro>i guess fwcutter is needed
<quiliro>davexunit_: any idea about the missing link?
<quiliro>i am trying to get my b4311 version 1 card work
<quiliro>and dmesg reports: b43-phy0 ERROR: Firmware file "b43-open/ucode5.fw" not found b43-phy0 ERROR: /*(DEBLOBBED)*/
<quiliro>nevertheless, ucode5.fw exists
<quiliro>in another directory
<quiliro>in openfwwf-firmware
<mood>I am running kernel 4.4, but guix environment --container says "user namespaces unavailable". What could be causing this?
<civodul>mood: what does it say precisely?
<civodul>ISTR the error messages were more specific
<mood>"guix environment: error: cannot create container: user namespaces unavailable" and "guix environment: error: is your kernel version < 3.10?"
<civodul>that's because "/proc/self/ns/user" is missing
<quiliro>mood: what is the command you used?
<civodul>some distros disable it
<mood>quiliro: I ran `guix environment --container --load=package.scm`
<mood>civodul: Hmm, I'm on Arch, I'll check
<ngz>Hello. I'm contemplating defining a package with multiple outputs. AFAIU, you need to explicitly move files meant for additional output to a specific directory. I.e., it is not sufficient to add, e.g. (ouputs '("out" "something")).
<ngz>If I'm right, most haskell packages are wrong since they define '("out" "doc") as output without moving a single file.
<mood>civodul: It appears to not be enabled because of security concerns, sadly. I'll have to see if I can work around that somehow (perhaps even install a new kernel)
<quiliro>a firmware file for the wifi does not load
<quiliro>the firmware is included in Guixssd
<quiliro>but linux-libre looks for it in the wrong directory
<quiliro>b43-open/ucode5.fw is the solicited file
<quiliro>but the file is in the openfwwf-firmware directory
<quiliro>i need some guide to investigate
<ng0>a package update of a font is flooding me with variations of: /gnu/store/b1yqjimbdh5bf9jnizd4h7yf110744j2-bash-4.3.42/bin/bash: line 0: test: too many arguments
<ng0>i think that was texlive, not sure
<quiliro>will someone give me some pointers on how to hack this part of guixsd?
<quiliro>oh .... and is there a way to view info guix with a better look?
<quiliro>not in the terminal
<quiliro>because the font are not nice
<anthk_>quiliro, when installed?
<anthk_>just use emacs
<anthk_>press alt-x
<anthk_>type "info"
<anthk_>and press enter
<anthk_>you can set up the font on emacs easily, and then save the settings
<quiliro>anthk_: it is not in the menu
<quiliro>i will instal it
<anthk_>as unprivileged user:
<anthk_>guix package -i emacs
<quiliro>it is so nice to install several things simultaneously!
<quiliro>i am installing libreoffice on anothe terminal window
<quiliro>what is not nice is to need an internet connection
<quiliro>it would be nice to offline install everything
<quiliro>anthk_: how big is emacs anyway?
<quiliro>it is downloading now
<anthk_>quiliro, well, emacs is "large"
<anthk_>about 100mb I think
<anthk_>but it has a lot of stuff
<anthk_>it's a text editor, calculator and a lot of things
<quiliro>anthk_: it finished downloading's 40MB
<quiliro>it's grafting now
<quiliro>that is the longest part
<quiliro>nevertheless, it does not make me impatient
<anthk_>install font-dejavu and font-inconsolata
<quiliro>what makes me impatient is that i do not have a telecommunications connection at home
<anthk_>you will like a better monospace font than the default one
<quiliro>anthk_: thanks
<quiliro>3rd installation window
<quiliro>anthk_: why does icecat and emac have to be started from the console ...why is it not automatically added to xfce menu and gnome menu
<quiliro>emacs does not start
<quiliro>but it will give no error message or show the prompt
<quiliro>emacs emacs-24.5 emacsclient
<quiliro>which one should i run?
<anthk_>quiliro, in my case they have been added automatically
<anthk_>maybe they will add themselves upon restarting
<htgoebel>I try packaging some python C-extension. Tests fail with "Python.h: No such file or directory". Any idea how to solve this?
<anonkun>would guix work on a nvidia gtx 750 ti?
<davexunit_>anonkun: it should work, with graphics acceleration, if nouveau is supported for that gpu.
<davexunit_>I use nouveau on a machine with an nvidia gtk 275
<anonkun>my other distro only starts with nomodeset
<anonkun>that means it should work with guixsd as well?
<quiliro>anonkun: yes
<anonkun>i'm a bit worried
<quiliro>it is a problem with the driver not with the distro
<anonkun>since my computer requires a nonfree blob for the motherboard
<quiliro>which blob
<anonkun>I'll try and check it out
<anonkun>on debian free it asks for something "rt..."
<quiliro>that is the best anonkun
<anonkun>lemme tell you, hang on
<anonkun>just for information purposes, I will tell you.
<quiliro>anonkun: it is not for the mainboard
<anonkun>is that for the internet connection then?
<quiliro>rt is realtek
<anonkun>yeah, I do have a realtek thing
<quiliro>wireless probably
<anonkun>It's a dekstop
<anonkun>hang on
<quiliro>will tell you which
<anonkun>so i'm assuming there is no free driver for it yet, because of realteks policy?
<quiliro>if you copy the result of lspci -vmmnn
<anonkun>SDevice: Motherboard [e000]
<anonkun>Device: RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller [8168]
<quiliro>to the last part of
<quiliro>then it will tell you about your hardware
<quiliro>and what are the problems
<quiliro>i have discovered that the best thing is to replace the hardware
<quiliro> learn how to reverse engineer
<anonkun>You are right, I should have been more considerate of the hardware I chose.
<quiliro>but that may take years
<anonkun>Debian doesn't work without it, unless I use the nonfree iso
<quiliro>the best is to test and then choose
<anonkun>so I aassume this wouldn't either
<anonkun>but obviously, I will test it
<anonkun>how the hell does a 174mb archive become 1gb
<kyamashita>The magic of compression!
<kyamashita>Are you talking about the GuixSD install image?
<anonkun>yeah :D
<anonkun>and it didn't even take forever, just the regular amount of time
<anonkun>using dd to make a bootable usb
<anonkun>btw, what does "bs=5M" do?
<kyamashita>bs sets how many bytes you read/write at a time.
<quiliro>kyamashita: why use more or less bs?
<kyamashita>Some sizes of bs are quicker than others. The default is 512 bytes IIRC.
<anonkun>I found or for some other distro, it recommended 5m
<kyamashita>quiliro: I also believe that in some cases a read/write may fail, and bs would be the size of the failed block.
<anonkun>oh wait
<anonkun>is that why its taking so long now
<anonkun>because I did not do bs=5m?
<kyamashita>It was probably going to take a while anyway. It is a 1GB image after all.
<anonkun>yeah, I dont mind it, its only a one time thing :)
<anonkun>are there any themes in the default repos?
<anonkun>oo its done
<kyamashita>Like GTK+ themes?
<anonkun>ill be back in 5-10
<anonkun>yeah gtk+
<anonkun>arc theme or numix theme
<anonkun>I love those
<kyamashita>Not yet. I'm seeing about how those work.
<anonkun>or alternatively, is kde a planned DE?
<anonkun>in any case, I will reboot and report to you guys :)
<anonkun>Okay guys, it loads up to the tty
<anonkun>and says something about noveau drm loading
<anonkun>so I do umm, guix -i xfce4desktop?
<anonkun>or sometin
<kyamashita>In the second tty, you should find basic installation instructions.
<kyamashita>Use Alt-F2, in case you aren't familiar with tty switching.
<anonkun>I suck with CLI :P
<anonkun>I just want to check some basic GUI
<kyamashita>Hm. Not sure about how to do that.
<anonkun>without actually installing it
<anonkun>I will wait though
<anonkun>it's a really interesting project :)
<kyamashita>I agree that a GuixSD liveCD would be cool to have.
<kyamashita>anonkun: What distro are you using now?
<kyamashita>You may be able to easily install the Guix package manager alongside your current distro.
<anonkun>I'm using manjaro right now, because it has all the things that I like out of the box
<htgoebel>is it possible to specify some environment-variables to be used in all build steps?
<kyamashita>Ah! Based on Arch Linux.
<kyamashita>On the Guix download page, you can download the binary and follow these instructions:
<kyamashita>You'll be able to run Guix safely with Manjaro. I've used it without a problem on Parabola GNU/Linux, which is also based on Arch.
<htgoebel>anonkun: I't save to do this. Guix will not interfere with you existing system. I'm doing the same
<anonkun>what advantages would it serve?
<kyamashita>The reproducible binaries of Guix plus an already functioning GNU/Linux environment.
<anonkun>no I mean what's the use of a reproducible guix binary? does it install stuff in a seperate container?
<kyamashita>Yes. It would install separately from your normal system binaries, and you won't need superuser permissions to fiddle around with your packages. You can also verify that the binary you have is what you're supposed to get from the source code.
<kyamashita>Those slides explain some of the rationale behind Guix.
<kyamashita>ACTION is away momentarily
<kyamashita>ACTION is back
<quiliro>kyamashita: who's slides are those?
<quiliro>gnunet dev?
<kyamashita>quiliro: Christopher Allan Webber; GNU MediaGoblin developer.
<quiliro>oh...the guy from the talk ...the more enthusiastic guy
<quiliro>the other guy is more serious.....i like both personalities
<quiliro>they look like very nice people
<kyamashita>They are! I've talked with both of them on this channel.
<quiliro>how to chat via emacs...i am a virgin
<ng0>just use weechat or some other programm.. to really have a secure ERC or other emacs irc chat requires time.
<kyamashita>I use rcirc. It's built into more recent versions of Emacs. I just open Emacs and type Alt+x and irc. For configuration I used the Emacs wiki.
<ng0>i have special needs and have to stick to software i know. erc didn't work for me (yet)
<kyamashita>No problem. I just using Emacs out of curiousity. I also used weechat before Emacs for IRC.
<ng0>missing functions I need to write: reconnect on netsplits and regain name, work with .onions
<quiliro>ng0: emacs does not work with onions?
<kyamashita>quiliro: I've never tried it.
<ng0>it does when you set it right.
<quiliro>it is possible to chat with onions?
<quiliro>i am chatting on now
<quiliro>i dont see how to make the fonts larger in emac
<quiliro>everything is so small
<quiliro>but i would like it to be easy to change to bigger or smaller
<kyamashita>You can use the "Set Default Font..." under the Options menu. Assuming you are using the GTK+ version.
<quiliro>i am using xfce
<kyamashita>But are you using Emacs in a terminal, or through a GUI?
<quiliro>kyamashita: gui
<quiliro>how about that one?
<kyamashita>What about it?
<kyamashita>If you use a server, you can use that program within Emacs to interface with your account on that server.
<quiliro>connecting to
<quiliro>in emacs
<kyamashita>quiliro: Ah. That's for, not IRC.
<quiliro>i have
<kyamashita>It should work then, assuming you set it up correctly.
<quiliro>and quiliro at freenode
<kyamashita>You would need a mode for IRC and a mode for to work with them both from within Emacs.
<quiliro>M-x guix-newest-available-packages
<quiliro>i don't understand how to use that
<anthk_>quiliro, press alt-x inside emacs
<anthk_>type that command, and press enter
<kyamashita>quiliro: For me it opens up a new buffer listing all of the guix packages. I can scroll about and use the Enter key on the program name to switch to a dialog detailing the program.
<kyamashita>And yes, press Alt and x together, type guix-newest-available-packages, and press Enter to open that buffer.
<quiliro> is alt
<quiliro>i though it was ctl
<quiliro>now i remember c y ctl
<quiliro>it is so easy and even has autocompletion!
<kyamashita>Yes! I was surprised too.
<quiliro>i am installing blender
<quiliro>via emacs
<quiliro>easier than synaptic
<ngz>I'm trying to create a package but guix build is failing silently at the end of the process (i.e., after `install' phase). I tried guix build -K --verbosity=5 <package> but then I get an error before the process even starts.
<ngz>The error is : guix build: error: build failed: | | | bind mounting `/dev/full' to ...
<ngz>Am I doing something silly?
<hwpplayer1>Like what ?
<ngz>Like misusing --verbosity so that I do not get anything meaningful.
<ngz>I don't understand why "guix build -K foo" OTOH and "guix build -K --verbosity=5 foo" OTOH do not stop at the same point.
<hwpplayer1>I don't know about Guix
<hwpplayer1>Other friends will help you
<ngz>This is getting stranger. I discovered the --log-file option for guix build. I am currently inspecting the log: every single phase succeeded in the log. Yet the whole build process is a failure.
<civodul>ngz: could you paste the tail of the output of "guix build ..."?
<ngz>civodul: Sure. How many lines do you need? The last lines just tell that the derivation could not be built. There is no outstanding error above.
<ngz>civodul: see
<civodul> still blocks Tor users, could you use for instance?
<ngz>civodul: OK. See
<bobsuncle>Hi all! I'm trying to configure xorg without using the desktop module (i.e. from "scratch"), but after install xorg-server (and some related package) and running startx or xinit, I get ".../bin/X: No such file", "/dev/tty0 (No such file..." or other cryptic errors. Is there a guide somewhere about doing this, or does someone here have any experienc
<bobsuncle>e with it?
<bobsuncle>I'm running under qemu/kvm, FWIW.
<alezost>bobsuncle: startx/xnit doesn't work
<alezost>ACTION thinks it's better to remove xinit package since it only confuses people
<bobsuncle>Aha, good to know. I just don't want to use a login manager, since I'm used to xinit coming from Arch. What are my options then?
<alezost>bobsuncle: you can install xorg-server manually though
<alezost>I mean "run", not "install"
<alezost>I don't use a login manager, I start X server as it is
<alezost>bobsuncle: but my way is not easy: I use a special Xdaemon wrapper and I start X server using Shepherd. If you are interested I wrote more about it here:
<bobsuncle>Hhhmm I tried doing that (`sudo X :1 vt1 -nolisten tcp`), but I keep getting a "no screens found" error.
<mood>I have run `guix environment --container --load=package.scm` package.scm results in a list of packages, but the resulting shell doesn't appear to actually have all of those packages :S
<bobsuncle>I took a look through your guix-config repo. Impressive and inspiring stuff. :)
<bobsuncle>Do I need to use Xdaemon/Shepherd, though? Why can't I just run it standalone?
<alezost>bobsuncle: thanks, you can! give me a minute to explain
<bobsuncle>Sure, thanks for your help!
<bobsuncle>alezost: (Reading through your shepherd-config repo.)
<alezost>bobsuncle: you also need to specify where X server should find modules. So: 1) install such things as xorg-server, xf86-input-evdev, xf86-video-fbdev, xf86-video-modesetting, xf86-video-nv, xf86-video-nouveau (or whatever needed for you videocard); 2) run X server like this: "sudo X :1 vt1 -nolisten tcp -modulepath $HOME/.guix-profile/lib/xorg/modules"
<bobsuncle>alezost: I did, actually. I saw that full command (with -modulepath) on [here]( But I keep getting "no screens found". :-/
<alezost>is there anything at "/var/log/Xorg.0.log"?
<bobsuncle>I'm running on qemu/kvm with `-vga std`. I already installed xf86-video-fbdev and xf86-video-modesetting.
<alezost>I mean /var/log/Xorg.1.log. Also try "X :1 vt8 ..."
<bobsuncle>Hhmm I'm not sure how recent this error is, but in `/var/log/Xorg.0.log` I see "(EE) open /dev/dri/card0": No such file or directory", followed by "(EE) Segmentation fault at address 0x0".
<mood>Ignore my message up there. I completely misread a sentence in the manual
<alezost>bobsuncle: since you start on :1, look at /var/log/Xorg.1.log
<bobsuncle>I only see "no screens found" to be relevant. Let me try to pastebin the entire log file (it's a bit tricky from qemu), just a sec.
<alezost>bobsuncle: btw is it an ATI card?
<bobsuncle>alezost: here it is: (sorry, couldn't use because of qemu).
<bobsuncle>alezost: No, it's whatever `-vga std` does in qemu. `lspci` identifies it as "00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Device 1234:1111 (rev 02)".
***gwon is now known as CraigEr
<alezost>bobsuncle: ok, it failed to load modules, so it wasn't started. Do you have anything in "/home/ivan/.guix-profile/lib/xorg/modules" directory?
<bobsuncle>alezost: No, actually ~/.guix-profile/lib doesn't exist. (I installed xf86-video-* globally in the packages definition of the main config.scm.)
<alezost>bobsuncle: well, that's the reason: you specified your user profile directory :-)
<alezost>I think it's easier to do "guix package -i xorg-server ..." then to change your config
<bobsuncle>Yeah, I see the discrepancy. :) So should I install xf86-video* with my user, or can I point -modulepath to the global lib dir?
<alezost>either way. I would install into a user profile at first to check if it works
<alezost>also install 'xf86-video-vesa' package there
<bobsuncle>Hhmm excuse my ignorance, but where is the global lib directory?
<bobsuncle>Aha, thanks. Let me try that.
<alezost>btw did you do "guix pull" both for root and user?
<bobsuncle>I did it for root, but not my user.
<alezost>bobsuncle: if you didn't install vesa driver globally it will probably not work
<bobsuncle>I'll do that as well, thanks.
<bobsuncle>alezost: Bingo! I got a black screen, but it's progress! :)
<alezost>bobsuncle: this is exactly what should happen!
<alezost>black screen is a running X server
<bobsuncle>Right. Now to get bspwm working. :)
<bobsuncle>Thanks *so* much for your help!
<alezost>now you can start something there like this: "DISPLAY=:1 xterm"
<alezost>no problem, ask if you have questions :-)
<bobsuncle>alezost: One small thing: do I need to run X as root? I was used to running it as my own user (with xinit).
<alezost>bobsuncle: actually with xinit/startx you also ran it as root because X (or more precise an X wrapper) has setuid bit
<bobsuncle>alezost: Aha, didn't know that. Thanks.
<bobsuncle>This is too much fun. With Guix(SD) I feel like I'm rediscovering Linux all over again. Love it. :)
<alezost>I mean on Arch there is some "Xorg.wrap" (I don't recall exactly) which has setuid bit and. You can look at /usr/bin/X. If I remember correctly it is a shell script that runs that wrapper
<alezost>I also has this feeling :)
<bobsuncle>And BTW, your guix-config repo is a huge inspiration. I'm not fluent enough in Scheme/Guile, but it's very interesting reading through your code.
<alezost>bobsuncle: thanks! If you find something unclear there, you are welcome to ask
<bobsuncle>alezost: Will do. Thanks again for your help!
<ngz>civodul`: Back. I experienced a power outage earlier.
<Arcanos>Hello people
<Arcanos>I run guix build hello
<Arcanos>warning: failed to install locale: Invalid argument
<Arcanos>guix build: error: failed to connect to `/var/guix/daemon-socket/socket': Connection refused
<ng0>new libgcrypt stable, should i version bump libgrcrypt or just inherit?
<ng0>ACTION adds a new inherit version in case things depend on 1.6.5
<ng0>i think that was nonsense what i did.. the main function itself should be updated, it's a new stable release.
<ng0>anyway, i'll be off soon, just reply below the patch on the list.