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***necronian_ is now known as necronian
***luke-jr_ is now known as Luke-Jr
<Donald_ET3>Does Guix appear to have a good future?
<davexunit>Donald_ET3: we're a bit biased here, but yes. ;)
<lfam_>Haha. Nice question. I think the future is very bright.
<Donald_ET3>I am not sure whether I like the Linux kernel or the C programming language, but Guix looks good.
<lfam_>I don't think Guix uses C at all. There is C++ for the daemon although the goal is to replace it with Scheme.
<Donald_ET3>Modula-2 would probably be a better language for writing a kernel.
<lfam_>Patches welcome ;)
<lfam>Looks like calibre bundles libpng. I found this out reading the changelog for version 2.44.1:
<lfam>Hmm, may not be true of the linux tarball
<lfam>Okay, the configure phase of the linux tarball does complain about a missing libpng when I remove it from the package inputs. So that's good
<piyo>question: kernel needs libpng for tux icons?
<DocPlatypus>have some questions about the 0.9.0 installer. I'm running into an issue where the installer can't find its partition. I am booting from an SD card, but the SD card reader on this system is hardwired USB so it should be the same as booting from a standard USB pen drive
<DocPlatypus>system is a Toshiba Satellite laptop, L455-S5975
<rekado>DocPlatypus: what does your system configuration file look like?
<DocPlatypus>I'm not even getting that far. this is the install medium.
<rekado>oh, I see.
<DocPlatypus>Guix will install onto a USB thumb drive, right? I just want to make a test install without sacrificing my existing Ubuntu seutp
<rekado>I don't understand: you boot from an SD card --- does it boot into the live system?
<DocPlatypus>I get most of a boot. then it goes into a loop where it's waiting for its partition to appear... eventually I get a Scheme debug prompt
<DocPlatypus>if I ",q" out of that of course it panics because it can't find its root fs
<DocPlatypus>only thing I can think of, and this really doesn't make much sense, but maybe the installer is dependent on the boot medium showing up as /dev/sda and all hell breaks loose if that's not the case?
<rekado>I don't know that. Hopefully somebody else can chime in with an idea.
<DocPlatypus>or it may not like the SD card reader on this laptop
<DocPlatypus>which is silly if true, but just in case I'm going to try again with an actual USB thumb drive
<rekado>I have never tested booting GuixSD from an SD card on my laptop.
<DocPlatypus>wonder if anyone else has...?
<DocPlatypus>ok. well the USB thumb drive actually boots with no issues. so whatever issue there is, is specific to SD cards and/or the reader on this model laptop
<rekado>DocPlatypus: interesting. Could you please send an email to
<DocPlatypus>rekado: ok, will do later this morning. do I need to send the exact error message? because that I did not copy down
<rekado>DocPlatypus: the more info the better, but I think in this case it would be sufficient to know that you are thrown into a debug REPL upon booting from an SD card due to not finding the partition.
<DocPlatypus>I am going to try one last time later today with the same microSD card in a USB reader
<DocPlatypus>to see if it's the medium, or the reader in the laptop
<rekado>the binary produced by my new arm-none-eabi compiler does not work, but the binary produced by the prebuilt compiler toolchain does.
<rekado>"does not work" = does not have the expected effect after uploading.
<rekado>it's hard to figure out how this other toolchain was actually built. I'm used to the transparency Guix provides...
<rekado>so, the other toolchain is based on a different GCC branch:
<cehteh>in the past there where problem with different gcc versions/revisions generating broken code for stm32
<cehteh>you may try another version or git bisect and see if you get some 'usable' result at least to work from there
<rekado>I'll try to just replace the source field in the cross-gcc with the very same SVN revision of the embedded-4_9-branch
<rekado>and then try to build a cross-compiler from there.
<cehteh>did they apply any patches under the hood?
<rekado>doesn't seem so. At least the release.txt that comes with the binary doesn't mention any patches.
<rekado>hmm, the svn-fetch method is very slow. Maybe it's just SVN that is slow.
<rekado>often get "svn: E000110: Error retrieving REPORT: Connection timed out"
<rekado>oh, my bad. Shouldn't have used SVN over HTTP.
<cehteh>just 'git svn' once for all :D
<enrico_>hello everybody and happy new year. Just one question: Is there a Live version of GuixSD? I would like to test it, but I don't want to install it before try it first :)
<rekado>enrico_: there is no default software for GuixSD. It really depends on your system configuration. This is why there is no usable "live" system. The installer itself is actually a live version of GuixSD, but it isn't a very useful system in itself.
<rekado>it just comes with enough software to conveniently instantiate a new system.
<enrico_>thank you. So I really need to install it on my hard disk to test it?
<rekado>you could also install it in a virtual machine.
<rekado>or you could use Guix (the package manager) on top of your current system.
<rekado>The fun part of using GuixSD is in how the system is configured (namely through a single configuration file that can be instantiated).
<enrico_>yes, I was thinking about it but a virtual machine has lower performance. I'm now using Ubuntu, so i could install guix (only the package manager)?
<rekado>you can play with the package manager on its own on top of any GNU/Linux system.
<rekado>yes, you could use Guix on top of Ubuntu.
<rekado>I'm using it at work on CentOS and Ubuntu.
<rekado>as Guix doesn't use any library from the host system it works on pretty much any GNU/Linux system.
<enrico_>ok thank you very much. The key feature is only GuixSD is the package manager? The distro itself is nothing more than a normal distro with Guix?
<enrico_>CORRECTION: The key feature in GuixSD is only the package manager?
<rekado>the system (GuixSD) is quite different from other GNU/Linux systems.
<rekado>GuixSD doesn't follow the FHS (i.e. there is no global /usr or /bin)
<rekado>configuration isn't done by editing global /etc files but by *declaring* the system configuration in a Scheme expression.
<rekado>this enables users to keep their system configuration under version control and effortlessly go back to a previous version by just booting a previous system from GRUB.
<rekado>the package manager enables much of that.
<enrico_>ok, thank you for your help. I'll try to use Guix on Ubuntu and test GuixSD on a virtual machine. I think this is far better than try to install the whole system considering your answers
<rekado>with Guix on top a "foreign distro" you don't get these features, of course.
<enrico_>yes, of course
<rekado>note that Guix as a package manager on other distros requires a little more plumbing (e.g. setting of environment variables) than on GuixSD.
<rekado>GuixSD obviously integrates Guix a lot better, but you can still benefit from the nice package management features on a foreign distro.
<rekado>I do recommend skimming the manual and/or watching one of the talks on the Guix website.
<rekado>many questions are anticipated therein; otherwise Guix might seem a little confusing at first.
<enrico_>I've downloaded the last talk right now :) I'll also check the manual/documentation before try it. Now i have to go but I don't disconnect so if you have something else to write I'll read as soon as i come back. For now: thank you very much!
<rekado>enrico_: nice! Do ask for help here. There are usually many friendly people around who can help.
<rekado>we also have a mailing list for help:
<enrico_>@rekado I love to help these good projects like Guix. I only hope they can be well supported because I've seen that too many free distros or free projects seem dead. Many of the full-free distros recommended from the FSF are not developed anymore
<cehteh>some are just mature and get infrequent updates :D
<enrico_>you are right, but I think there are too many distros and every distro has few developer, if they join together they can work better and with lower workload, I suppose. But this is only my opinion and I'm not a developer, just a FOSS fan :-)
<nucleria>Hi. I'm trying to install GuixSD on my iMac. I've used both a USB flash drive and an SDHC card, both 8 gigabytes. The computer's hard disk is empty except for the boot manager, ReFind. When I boot into either device with the boot manager, I get a no operating system found, insert disk and press any key to continue, but I don't have a DVD or CD and can't get past this. Any help?
<jin__>try alt key where imac starting to select any device
<nucleria>I think I may have but will try again
<nucleria>The only option is EFI boot which leads to ReFind. Then, with both devices plugged in, I can boot from three options, all called whole disk volume, all giving the same problem
<jin__>can you post a screenshot?
<nucleria>All the options say the same thing and all have the same "no bootable device" error.
<nucleria>I used DD to copy to the SDHC and USB by the way.
<nucleria>The computer has two partitions: an EFI system one for ReFind and an ext4 one I made for GuixSD.
<mark_weaver>nucleria: our USB installer is probably meant to be loaded by a BIOS. I don't think it includes EFI boot code.
<nucleria>Well... That leaves me with a decommissioned Mac. Thanks for telling me that.
<mark_weaver>if you have a working copy of GRUB on the machine, then it should be possible to load the grub.cfg file from the USB stick though.
<nucleria>I don't have one already in the machine...
<mark_weaver>you might be able to find a GRUB boot disk somewhere that works on your machine
<mark_weaver>but you might be the first one to try running GuixSD on a Mac, so there may be some issues to work through.
<nucleria>I'll be on the lookout. My only working computer is a Raspberry Pi, currently. I'll try to put GRUB on a flash drive.
<mark_weaver>another option is to install another GNU/Linux system on the machine, and then use our binary installer to install Guix and use it to run "guix system init"
<nucleria>That might be easier.
<mark_weaver>that uses GRUB's own install code, which hopefully will detect the EFI and do the right thing, but I'm not sure that's been tested.
<nucleria>Which distribution would you recommend that I could quickly download and put on a USB. If it doesn't work I'll just use it.
<mark_weaver>I would recommend Debian GNU/Linux
<nucleria>Okay. Thanks.
<mark_weaver>good luck!
<nucleria>Uncharted territory.
<mark_weaver> may be helpful
<mark_weaver>another issue is that some of the hardware in your iMac might require non-free firmware, which is not included in GuixSD.
<nucleria>Then do you think I should just stay on Debian?
<mark_weaver>I would recommend acquiring hardware that doesn't require non-free software to function
<nucleria>I would try. This Mac is my only real option currently. I do have a Dell Studio 1558. Might be better?
<mark_weaver>the built-in wireless is the most likely issue, and you can find freedom-respecting external wireless adapters (and other hardware) at
<mark_weaver> is a good resource for finding out what hardware can function without requiring non-free software
<nucleria>I actually a wireless adapter for the Pi.