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<yenda->the last questions he answers that the problem with linux libre is that it encourages hidden firmware that are not loaded at runtime which makes anlysis even more difficult :
<yenda->is a 8Gb root partition enough for guixSD ? I would like to install it on my ultra book as well but it has an hybrid harddrive, what I do on arch is that I use the ssd part for root and the hd part for home. iiuc the user packages are stored in their home right ?
<yenda->so the space needed for root should be fairly low ?
<yenda->I might be wrong because it looks like 17Gb are used on my / partition on the other computer and I barely installed anything
<yenda>I'm trying to install guix on my laptop and I get immediatly to "GRUB loading.. error: unknown file system"
<yenda>The laptop was previously running ArchLinux
<xentrac>I still haven't succeeded at doing a guix pull. the current error is as follows:
<yenda>I think it might be because it doesn't use grub but uefi
<xentrac>unpacking '/gnu/store/cg5rswmy9g90jbha6f3hmp945qc58hs3-guix-latest.tar.gz'...
<xentrac>guix pull: error: tarball did not produce a single source directory
<xentrac>it certainly looks like a single source directory to me
<xentrac>so I haven't been able to get guix to build from source yet
<yenda>to build guix from source I just git clone and make
<yenda>ahah I was just dumb, I dd to /dev/sdc1 instead of /dev/sdc
<xentrac>so it boots now?
<yenda>but no wifi
<yenda>and no ethernet port
<mark_weaver>yenda: did you try "ifconfig -a" ?
<mark_weaver>the device names will be different than the usual eth0 or wlan0
<yenda>yes I only have the local loopback
<yenda>there is physically no ethernet port on the laptop
<xentrac>oh, I was going to say, linux-libre doesn't support your hardwired ethernet port?
<mark_weaver>oh, I see
<yenda>and dmesg indicates the wifi needs a firmware
<yenda>so I have an usb wifi key
<yenda>and it works but it has embbed proprietary software right ? why is it better than the embedded one ?
<yenda>oh well false hope anyway ifconfig up and the missing free firmware pops as well
<yenda>how do we get ar or some utilities to open a .deb in guix ?
<yenda>I mean "is it part of an other package" ?
***Mathnerd314_ is now known as Mathnerd314
<mark_weaver>yenda: 'ar x foo.deb' will unpack it, and from there it's just tar files. warning: 'ar x' will unpack multiple files into the current directory; best to do it within a fresh directory.
<ifur>all attempts with guixsd has resulted in kernel panic, or a login promot that wont let you type passwords yourself
<ifur>dont get the impression the examples are quite working -- attempting to build latest image now
<ifur>but is this what people do to get it running atm, build their installation media?
<iyzsong>rekado-: it looks that we need to update fontconfig to 2.11.94 to make lilypond and ghostscript happpy. for ref:
<yenda>mark_weaver: but ar is not on guix
<yenda>I don't need it after all though because I figured the firmware directory is there but in an unusual place.
<DusXMT>ar is not on guix? I'm pretty sure Guix has binutils
<yenda>ty that's probably the package I was looking for
<DusXMT>One wouldn't be able to make static libraries without it :)
<yenda>ifur: I got the kernel panic the first time then never again
<yenda>ifur: the login screen you have to connect as root, mkidr the home for your user and passd to create a password for it. Also if you are not familliar with tiling window managers remove ratpoison from the config
<yenda>DusXMT: in fact it is available in guix environment
<yenda>I don't understand why the system is not able to load a firmware
<yenda>is there some config options that could provoke this ?
<iyzsong>I guess linux-libre just refuse to load non-free firmware
<yenda>it is not linux-libre it is linux because I needed to know which firmware is called to figure out if an extension of the radeon patch was possible for my hardware
<iyzsong>ah, in my dmesg, the non-free firmware was refused and their names was '/*(DEBLOBBED)*/'
<yenda>iyzsong: yes and now it fails to load and I get fatal error during GPU init
<iyzsong>if you're using linux-libre (the kernel in guix), I think there are no chance to load it..
<yenda>it is Linux and the firmware is here
<iyzsong>ok. so you build your custom linux.
<yenda>iyzsong: yes but just to know what firmware is required, hopefully replace it, but I need to make it work vanilla otherwise there is no chance it will on libre either
<iyzsong>I think you can boot another linux distro (a livecd?) to see the dmesg, which should contain the firmware's names.
<yenda>I have the firmware name it is RS780_pfp.bin and it is in lib/firmware
<iyzsong>do you make a guix package for your firmware, and add it to the 'firmware' field of system config?
<yenda>iyzsong: no since it is temporary I did something quite ugly, at first I defined a linux-custom package which was a copy pasta of linux-libre minus the patches and added a kernel line to my config
<yenda>but it couldn't find the package for wathever reason
<yenda>so I replaced linux-libre url and sha and remove the patch line, I know, it's terrible :(
<yenda>ACTION trying to figure out how to define a firmware package and add it to config
<yenda>iyzsong: the exemple (ath9k) firmware is built from source, here I have an ugly blob so I'm not sure it's usefull to put it in the firmware section ?
<iyzsong>yenda: make sure you use the latest firmware (eg: from ArchLinux), I think the 'error -2' is due to version mismatch.
<iyzsong>otherwise, I have no idea :-(
<yenda>iyzsong: you mean Arch as more recent firmware than ?
<iyzsong>ah, not what I mean, so I guess it's not the reason..
<iyzsong>yenda: perpaps it need to copied to the initrd, if '/' has not be mounted when loading.
<yenda>and how can I achieve that ?
<iyzsong>I think add a guix package (install it to $out/lib/firmware/..), and set the 'firmware' field should do it.
<yenda>that will be a very uncommon package I'm trying to find exemples
<yenda>iyzsong: but way if I install it to lib/firmware what difference does it make ?
<yenda>the file is already there when I look in /run/current-system/kernel/lib/firmware
<iyzsong>add the package to 'firmware' field should make initrd get 'lib/firmware/radeon/RS780_pfp.bin'. radeon load its firmware before root mounted (no /run/current-system), it's not avaiable.
<iyzsong>during boot, before 'chroot' to real root, the root filesystem is initrd.
<yenda>iyzsong: neat, it sounds like a possible solution
<amz3>yenda: you really want to use guix, that very encouraging :)
<yenda>amz3: I would rather like a lisp machine but its kind of dead ;)
<amz3>you think about a machine with a lisp processor?
<yenda>with hardware support for lisp yes, like Symbolics's
<amz3>seems like a good idea :)
<yenda>I'm quite sure we wouldn't have all these driver problems
<yenda>that is what got me into emacs actually, I saw it as a virtual lisp machine that I could run everywhere
<amz3>you contribute to emacs?
<yenda>no I've started it like 10 months ago I'm still taming it :D
<yenda>no 8 actually
<yenda>iyzsong: I can't figure out how to declare a package that would just output its source into a dir
<yenda>I assume I should use trivial build ?
<iyzsong>yenda: yes, see 'minetest-data' for an example.
<yenda>is there a simple way to convert the hex from to binary ? or it would be simplier to just use a local binary of the firmware I have
<yenda>how do I make gesier-edit-symbol-at-point work ? I wanted to go to the definition of (find-files) to understand how it works but it can't find the location
<alezost>yenda: you need to have modules loaded to go to the definitions from these modules. So for "find-files" you need to ",use (guix build utils)" in Geiser REPL
<yenda>neat ! ty. what if I don't know in which package the symbol is ? Can I just load the file so it uses all the modules ?
<alezost>yenda: you can "C-c C-k" to load the current buffer
<yenda>oh god I missed the repl :D
<yenda>I get unknown package when I try to build my package
<alezost>it may be that you have an error in your package
<yenda>and how can I know ? it compiled with c-c c-k and make didn't complain
<yenda>also I can call it in geiser
<yenda>I had the same troubles yesterday when I defined linux-custom package
<alezost>how do you try to build it?
<yenda>guix build custom-firmware
<yenda>it's in (gnu packages linux) for now so it should be in the path
<alezost>yenda: would you like to share it?
<yenda>alezost: I sent you a pm because it's non free
<alezost>I see
<yenda>alezost: what method do you use to point to your local version of guix ? I use ln like I documented here for myself :
<yenda>my problem was linked to that I had to rm / recreate the link to make it work
<yenda>when I reconfigure the system I have to do it again under sudo, then redelete recreate afterwards
<yenda>I have no idea what I'm doing :D
<alezost>yenda: I use the same "symlink method".
<alezost>I have never had to recreate it
<alezost>also I use it only for ~/.config/guix/latest; my /root dir is (almost) empty
<yenda>alezost: you don't update the system from the source ?
<alezost>I update the system from the source
<alezost>using "sudo -E guix system reconfigure …"
<yenda>nice I didn't knew about -E
<alezost>yeah, I often use "sudo -E" and don't care about root config
<ifur>yenda: i got the furthers with bare-bones.scm desktop.scm examples just constantly kernel panics (so no free rides).
<yenda>do you have the kernel panic when you run the live image or after install ?
<yenda>ifur: ^
<ifur>after install, the first reboot and second
<ifur>never gotten desktop to get to login
<ifur>bare-bones i got to login after doing guix pull first
<ifur>but the login does not allow me to enter a password, it spams three prompts and says ive exceeded 3 attempts :/
<yenda>did you get something out of the kernel panic messages that could help someone figure out your problem ?
<ifur>yenda: its too quick, and covers my screen... :/
<yenda>ifur: yes like I said the first login you type root and no password iirc
<ifur>yenda that didnt work, never got to hit enter on password, only username prompt
<ifur>then immediatly says i have tried 3 times (i just watch it work)
<yenda>alezost: I probably hit a nerve with my update because I have a black screen now :D
<ifur>its a thinkpad x201 if there are known thinpad issues :/
<yenda>try linux-libre channel for troubles regarding the kernel
<yenda>you can also search your hardware on trisquel forums and doc
<yenda>ACTION made it ! native resolution achieved
<alezost>ifur: wait a second; you said bare-bones worked, right?
<alezost>yenda: great!!
<ifur>yenda: unlikely a kernel issue, no reason to assume that...
<yenda>alezost: it's like with/without glasses
<ifur>alezost: i got to a broken login prompt with bare-bones and using guix pull prior to system init
<ifur>going to try bare-bones since i just built a new usb image
<alezost>ifur: broken login prompt? by default your user don't have a password. Did you try to login as root?
<alezost>ifur: I think you need to login as root and set a password for your user
<ifur>alezost: so the system (irrelevant of user name) is that as soon as username is entered, it is as if someone is spamming enter on the keyboard before you can do anything
<ifur>never seen that before
<ifur>but i'll try that again....
<alezost>ifur: please try, and report if you will not be able to login as root (without a password)
<ifur>alezost: just waiting for it to complete
<ifur>hmm, would be usefull to understand a bit more about he installation process, and what init actually does on first boot
<ifur>i didn't create /mnt/etc first, and /mnt/etc did not get created and im stuck at "setting up setuid programs....", this is without doing guix pull first however
<yenda>ifur: i followed this when I installed
<ifur>i'll do that verbatim then :/
<ifur>hmmm, i was using a bios_grub partition, could this cause problems?
<ifur>yenda: yeah, that method leaves me with broken grub it doesnt get to the stage where it populates /boot it seems
<ifur>so gonna try without bios_grub partition then, it could confuse guix i guess...
<yenda>mhm I have gummyboot on my laptop I should try and see if running guixsd works
<yenda>but I have yet to prepare an image that will support the wifi
<ifur>bios_grub partition is for non-EFI systems
<ifur>but ddont think its needed for grub2 anymore
<phant0mas>hey mark_weaver did you have a look at those patches?
<phant0mas>my next patches are based on them, so I would prefer if someone had a look at them
<phant0mas>so we can change anything if needed and push them at wip-hurd
<ifur>yeah, that resulted in just a "GRUB", so i need the bios_grub partition
<ifur>yup, so no /boot after install this time around either, so nothing to do with that at least...
<ifur>do you have to run guix system init multiple times for it to work properly?
<ifur>i dont get errors, but it doesnt look like its completes
<ifur>and since ive never seen it "work" i dont know what the process /should/ look like :/
<ifur>if one guix system init fails, do i have to start from scratch?
<ifur>new usb image buit from nixos, guix pull before init and using bare-bones seemed to do the trick for me
<amz3>ifur: does it work?
<yenda>anyone would mind sharing his experience using personnal packages while keeping guix updated ? is git rebase the way to go ?
<amz3>yenda: I don't know git rebase, but there is another way
<amz3>let met check
<amz3>I use: export GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH="$HOME/src/guile/guix/recipes/"
<amz3>It's an extra dir where guix will look for packages, have a look the manual for details.
<yenda>as simple as that :D
<yenda>so you put that in your bashrc ?
<amz3>good question. mine is in bashrc
<amz3>I don't know the d ifference between bashrc and bash_profile
<yenda>I assume you don't have to declare your .scm in gnu-system with that method ?
<amz3>no. gnu-system declaration is "only" for pre-compilation and installation of those of the files on a target system
<amz3>no you don't need
<amz3>you also don't need to nest packages inside gnu/package/foo.scm
<amz3>you can put them directily in foo.scm
<yenda>why did you choose guile/guix/recipes/ ?
<amz3>I organise my code in by ~/src/language/project/subproject/
<amz3>for instance
<amz3>guix has 3 or 4 subrepositories
<amz3>there is the artwork git repository
<amz3>well the recipes subproject which should be named packages
<amz3>and several git repository of guix itself, as I am not a git ninja and mess around
<amz3>there is also python-tox for guix
<amz3>actually I think guix directory is the project that has the most subproject directory
<amz3>anyway you get the point ;)
<yenda>when I'm lazy I do git reset origin/master --hard
<yenda>yes ty
<amz3>the problem I have most of the time is that I start hacking and commit eagerly (since it's so easy to commit in emacs) and then recall that i did not create a branch
<yenda>git stash
<yenda>you use magit ?
<yenda>what you can learn quickly is to just always be on a branch and rebase often
<amz3>no I don't use magit
<amz3>I now git stash, I should use it more often
<amz3>git stash is awesome :)
<davexunit>magit is my best friend
<yenda>me too, I know a guy for him less so, he often commit huge folders by accident and it just kills magit :D
<amz3>I know a guy who write software by accident, emacs is its best friend ;)
<yenda>amz3: how do you compile you files in your personnal packges ?
<yenda>I'm used to just do make in /guix
<amz3>I don't, it's not required to compile scheme files to execute them
<amz3>it's done automatically by guile
<amz3>on the fly
<yenda>I get "failed to load '(clojure)' no code for module (clojure)
<amz3>what command?
<amz3>guix package -A clojure ?
<yenda>just guix environment guix
<amz3>I don't know that command sorry
<yenda>it's to spawn an environment for developping in guix
<yenda>so you don't have to install make and buildtools in your profile
<yenda>but anyway guix build clojure for instance get me unknown package
<amz3>wht does echo $GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH says?
<yenda>the proper path
<amz3>what does guix package -A clojure says ?
<yenda>guix package: warning: failed to lode (clojure): ERROR: no code for module (clojure)
<amz3>if you do "guile clojure.scm" it works?
<alezost>yenda: clojure? there is no clojure package in guix
<yenda>yes it's in my personnal packages
<yenda>and it doesn't work yet :D
<alezost>yenda: don't put not-ready packages into GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH
<yenda>where should I put them ?
<alezost>yenda: it's up to you. As you can see, if one of your package is broken you have an error like "failed to load '(clojure)'" when you try to run any guix command that reads packages
<yenda>so it's because the package is broken ?
<alezost>yenda: apparently you want to use (clojure) module somewhere in your code, which is not found
<amz3>I think the clojure module is broken
<amz3>but he can put packages in GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH as long as they can be processed by guix client. If the package is incomplete or doesn't build it's not a problem
<alezost>yeah, that's what I meant
<yenda>it compiles fine with guile
<amz3>see alezost message
<yenda>I don't invoke it anywhere
<yenda>It is surprising that you can't develop in the directory it defeats half of its purpose
<davexunit>your module is surely broken
<davexunit>where is the file, relative to the directory that was added to GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH
<yenda>directly in it
<davexunit>can you paste the source
<davexunit>I can think of many reasons why it's not working
<yenda>but I think it's something else because even if I put a correct package definition from source it doesn't work and say the same things
<davexunit>(define-module (gnu packages clojure) ...)
<davexunit>that's wrong
<davexunit>your code would have to be in gnu/packages/clojure.scm for this to work
<davexunit>you want (define-module (clojure) ...)
<davexunit>module names aren't arbitrary, they map to files on the guile load path.
<yenda>ty that was the problem
<yenda>davexunit: do you agree with alezost that you shouldn't put non-ready packages in GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH ?
<davexunit>what does non-ready mean here?
<yenda>something that is broken and will display an error when you try to build it I guess
<davexunit>I think it's fine. just know how to do basic debugging.
<yenda>I saw that there are some minor mode for emacs like paredit that are managed by guix
<yenda>is the intent to be able to load all our emacs extensions without magit ?
<davexunit>the ultimate goal is for users to not need any other package manager
<davexunit>because guix can do everything and do it better.
<yenda>we'll probably need to come up with a hierarchy someday then
<yenda>also more servers because if the number of packages and users grow hydra will die, it's already painfully slow
<davexunit>what do you mean by a hierarchy?
<davexunit>and, of course, our build farm needs more power. we've been begging for donations.
<yenda>a /emacs /python /ruby
<davexunit>we are probably not going to do that
<yenda>the current lack of naming convention is somewhat disturbing
<davexunit>we establish them as we go.
<yenda>there is emacs packages with and without emacs in it
<davexunit>all discussed on the mailing list, yes.
<xentrac>hi. anyone know what's up with this thing last night where I couldn't build fuix?
<xentrac>00:32 < xentrac>
<xentrac>00:32 < xentrac> unpacking '/gnu/store/cg5rswmy9g90jbha6f3hmp945qc58hs3-guix-latest.tar.gz'...
<xentrac>00:32 < xentrac> guix pull: error: tarball did not produce a single source directory
<yenda>I read it yes
<xentrac>00:33 < xentrac> it certainly looks like a single source directory to me
<davexunit>naming and grouping things aren't exactly trivial.
<xentrac>yenda: yes, you said you git clone and make
<yenda>you did guix build ?
<xentrac>it seems like guix (0.8.1) was complaining that guix (cg5rs..., which I suppose must be 0.8.3) "doesn't produce a single source directory"
<xentrac>I did guix pull
<xentrac>not guix build
<xentrac>it did successfully spend like an hour plus building things before it got to that point