<ewemoa>i'd eventually like to be able to determine which package(s) lead to the existence of files w/ particular names ending up in the store (e.g. which package(s) contain files with names containing the string "texi2pdf") -- has anyone worked on this sort of thing? perhaps a running hydra might be in a good position to collect relevant info?
<rekado>The GuixSD website behaves a little odd when zooming around.
<rekado>The text zooms, but the decoration does not.
<rekado>e.g. the hover highlights in the menu bar seem to have a fixed distance to the text, but the dark gray bar does not scale along with the text, so the highlights end up in the lighter grid-patterned area.
<rekado>The text in the grid-patterened area will also overflow when zoomed in.
<rekado>It would be nice if the background heights also zoomed together with the text.
<rekado>alirio: hydra can do this (like anyone else) because it has built the package.
<rekado>I think it would not be good to add a feature that depends on a build farm.
<alirio>rekado: lets make people upload the binaries so we don't need build farm at all </irony> binaries and file lists are both byproducts of the build and I can't see any reason to handle specially the latter
<davexunit>a .gem file is equivalent to something like a release tarball you'd get for a piece of GNU software.
<mark_weaver>does using the gem mean that we are using some non-source code that was built elsewhere?
<davexunit>mark_weaver: that's the open question. it seems that often the answer is "no"
<davexunit>also, the 'gitify' phase could go away, which is sort of like not having to use GNU autotools to bootstrap the configure script and Makefile.
<mark_weaver>for security reasons, I'd actually prefer to move toward a model where we avoid using any non-source code at all, including things like configure scripts built on developer's machines elsewhere.
<mark_weaver>but I suspect that civodul disagrees, so I'll have to talk to him about it and see what he thinks.
<davexunit>mark_weaver: some gems contain native extensions, but I know that those are *not* included in the gem. they are built on the user's machine.
<davexunit>but perhaps someone could create a gem with some pre-generated non-source Ruby code.
<davexunit>and I'm looking for gems that leave out important files that the gem unreproducible
<davexunit>I just found one example of a missing file: the ruby-i18n gem doesn't include the Rakefile (equivalent to Makefile)
<mark_weaver>taking my preference a step further would mean going directly to the source repos and not using release tarballs at all, but again, this is at odds with civodul's preference, so I'll have to discuss with him :)
<davexunit>yeah, I've been thinking about why it's considered OK for the configure script, Makefile, docs, etc. to be pre-built.
<mark_weaver>it could be okay to use prebuilt stuff like that *IF* we have a system in place for independently verifying that those pre-built things are valid.
<mark_weaver>right now, it seems to me that everyone is just taking it on faith.
<mark_weaver>but anyway, these comments go quite a bit beyond the question you asked.
<mark_weaver>just food for thought; I leave it to your best judgment :)
<davexunit>I'm trying to use good judgement, but it's a tricky question.
<davexunit>I'm feeling pressure to just use the .gem files, but they *feel* like the equivalent of binaries to me.
<mark_weaver>davexunit: I don't see why the 'gitify' phase is a problem, because it's in one place, right? it doesn't add to the work needed for each ruby package added, does it?
<davexunit>also, the gem would have to be extracted and re-packed because of source shebang patching and stuff.
<davexunit>mark_weaver: it's not a problem, but it's a step that we wouldn't need to take using the pre-built gems.
<mark_weaver>yeah, but that work is done by hydra, and it's not a lot of work. so why do they care?
<davexunit>hmmm, about the patching, the gnu build system runs a patching phase on the instaled files?
<davexunit>mark_weaver: no one mentioned that in particular, that was just a thought of mine.
<davexunit>but ruby's been tough to get into shape. it, like most "modern" programming languages, have thought they've improved upon packaging and distribution, but have really made it more difficult.
<davexunit>if you aren't using their blessed system, you're sort of screwed. :)
<davexunit>because their system masks all sorts of scary problems, like circular dependencies.
<davexunit>on another topic, I'd like to avoid the use of 'system' in favor of 'system*' in guix environment.
<davexunit>but not sure how to write the CLI to make that work
<davexunit>I added something to my bashrc that uses $SHLVL to count how many shells deep I am, and I notice that each 'guix environment' invokation increments it by 2
<alirio>davexunit, mark_weaver: './configure;make;make install' become the standard to install from source (in a time the configure, Makefile, ... are not generated) , not just on gnu but elsewhere. tarballs are made with that in mind. removing the configure, Makefile, ... would be like buying a black car to remove the paint and paint it red because most people don't buy unpainted cars
<davexunit>alirio: yes but the tarballs also come with the configure.ac/Makefile.am that those scripts were generated from.
*alirio wonders about isl code in cloog: "Makefile:796: recipe for target 'libcloog_isl_la-constraints.lo' failed", "./include/cloog/isl/constraintset.h:18:2: error: unknown type name ‘isl_constraint’"
<davexunit>it doesn't, but it *could* contain non-source Ruby code generated by some program, or it could be missing things that aren't essential for runtime like the Rakefile, test suite, readme, etc.
<alirio>civodul: actually I'm updating to amd64, so I will not work on that ATM, but I can consistently reproduce it in my machine. I wonder if it wouldn't be easier to get the git version instead of a patch
<civodul>davexunit: the situation sounds messy ;-) but i'm afraid i don't sufficiently understand the details
<civodul>alirio: you can reproduce the gettext issue, or the cloog issue?