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<rgrau_>hi there. I just installed guix distro and the installation went well (or so it seems), but it failed when installing GRUB. As I already had a grub from my other distro, I can still boot to the old one, and mount the 'guixOS' partition, but don't know how to regenerate or fix the grub.cfg
<rgrau_>any commmand that automagically adds the guix partition to the old grub.cfg?
<mark_weaver>can you send a bug report to, including the error messages from failing to install grub?
<jxself>You could try update-grub from within the 'other' system to see if it detected Guix.
<mark_weaver>civodul is the one to ask, but he's on europe time, so sleeping about now.
*rgrau_ is also in europe time. last try and sleeptime :)
<zacts>I can't seem to edit the wishlist for guix.
<zacts>I'm logged in, but it says I need to be a member of the 'Users' group
<zacts>my nick is zacts on the wiki btw
<zacts>I wanted to put a request for: mksh, musl, ruby2
<zacts>st terminal, and terminus-fonts
<zacts>the most important of those for me are, mksh / ruby2 / and terminus-fonts
<zacts>musl would be cool, but it's not necessary, along with the st terminal
<mark_weaver>zacts: we already have ruby 2 and terminus-fonts
<zacts>I must have skimmed over it on the package list
<zacts>sorry about that
<mark_weaver>no worries :)
<zacts>my pentadactyl search is probably messed up
<zacts>pentadactyl = vim bindings for firefox
<civodul>Hello Guix!
<jmd>Is it possible to see a "tail -f" from hydra as it's building?
<jmd>or does it get announced only when complete?
<civodul>jmd: yes, if you go to and click on a "Step", you get tail -f
<jmd>civodul: Thanks.
<jmd>Oh!! Texlive
<civodul>yup :-/
<jmd>It seems to be busy deleting its build directory
<civodul>no, transferring the result
<jmd>Do we have an objective-c compiler in guix?
<civodul>yes, "gcc-objc"
<jmd>Tried that.
<jmd>Oh wait. I have to say gcc-obj-4.8
<rgrau_>hi, I installed guix distro (0.8) and it failed to install grub. I booted from my other linux, and tried update-grub2 (I already had grub in my machine) but it fails to detect the guixOS partition. any hints? (I'll keep investigating)
<civodul>rgrau_: was it 'guix system init' that failed to install GRUB?
<rgrau_>yes, I think so
<civodul>what was the error message?
<civodul>did you specify the right device name for the hard disk in 'grub-configuration'?
<rgrau_>I will try it again later because I didn't write the error. (It wasn't anything very helpful though). for now I was just asking if there's any command that will regenerate the grub.cfg.
<rgrau_>Anyway, I'll retry and come with more helpfull backtrace :)
<civodul>'guix system build' or similar would generate grub.cfg
<civodul>but yeah, better do that from the installation image
<zdavis>Hi all, I managed to get guix installed and running on vmware workstation yesterday. It went... fairly smoothly.
<davexunit>zdavis: oh cool. I haven't heard of anyone else using guix on vmware yet.
<zdavis>I'd be curios if anyone was opposed to adding a feature to generate an iso based install image
<davexunit>(of course I recommend you use free virtualization software)
<Steap_>How well can Guix be installed in KVM, btw ?
<davexunit>zdavis: I don't think we'd be opposed. I think the reason we don't generate them currently is because it's more work.
<davexunit>so if a tool made that easy for us...
<_`_>Isn't there some qcow2 image floating around already?
<zdavis>right, guix can already generate a qcow2 image
<davexunit>Steap_: guix uses kvm when it generates vm images
<_`_>Said qcow2 image should work with qemu + kvm.
<davexunit>I must admit I'm not particularly knowledgable about virtualization
<davexunit>like how exactly do qemu and kvm fit together? I dunno.
<zdavis>neither am I ;)
<_`_>I'm going to guess that their defaulting to emulating e1000 and emulating IDE for the disk.
<zdavis>but as far as vmware went, it doesnt support booting from a usb drive image
<davexunit>ah so you had use some tool to do the conversion?
<davexunit>had to*
<Steap_>davexunit: yeah, so I can just generate a qcow2 image and feed it to kvm
<_`_>davexunit: qemu alone is just an emulator capable of emulating various architectures, kvm is the kernel module that allows for hardware assisted virtualization, together they are a type 2 hypervisor
<Steap_>(and qemu is slow as hell :p)
<_`_>That's the oversimplified version, but I think that should make sense.
<davexunit>_`_: I understand better, but still slightly confused.
<davexunit>so qemu will work without kvm and be slow as hell.
<_`_>it will only emulate the architecture
<davexunit>but when kvm is present, it can offload some work to it?
<_`_>and have no hardware assisted capabilities.
<davexunit>so is it not emulating at that point, or...
<_`_>yes with kvm, your host cpu provides full virtualization, it's providing the capabilities of the cpu instructions and processor features.
<_`_>so it's not done with just software, as is the case with plain emulation
<_`_>davexunit: there's still emulation present ofc (disk controller, nic, other devices) but there are other techniques that replace emulation there too.
<davexunit>_`_: thanks for the info. that helps.
<jmd> is empty. Does that mean something has broken?
<civodul>jmd: apparently there's a networking issue:
<jmd>Maybe someone hasn't paid the bill.
<jmd>I'm toying with the idea of NFS mounting /gnu and /var/guix so that I can use the same store and database on different machines. Any possible problems doing that?
<civodul>you have to make sure to mount both
<jmd>The profile for each machine would be different.
<civodul>i don't know if sqlite works well over NFS
<civodul>if it does, i think it should work
<jmd>I wouldn't have a daemon on the remote machine, but I need that only for building, I think.
<civodul>there may be a problem if several daemons are using the same store, though
<civodul>like daemon #2 does not know about per-session GC roots of daemon #1
<civodul>so it could GC something still in use by the other daemon
<civodul>well you need the daemon running on both machines in order to be able to access the store to build things, etc.
<jmd>But assuming everthing is built, I don't need it to do package --install
<civodul>you do
<civodul>to build the profile
<jmd>I had envisaged that the /gnu/store would be mounted readonly on the remotes.
<civodul>that's not possible
<jmd>Hmm. Maybe I had better shelve this idea then.
<jmd>Idea for the next hackathon.
<jmd>profiles should have a different path.
<jmd>the daemon should use flock.
<civodul>ideally, instead of sharing the store, i'd have one machine use substitutes from the other
<civodul>for that we need a 'guix publish' command, say, to publish substitutes
<civodul>in a company or cluster setting, that would work well
<civodul>jmd: is back to life
<jmd>Jolly good.
*paroneayea waves
*jxself does the software freedom dance
<paroneayea>jxself: what does that dance entail? :)
<DusXMT>It probably involves singing `Join us now and share the software' ;)
<jxself>It's our people's native dance. :)
<jxself>An example:
<gp5st><3 jxself
<jxself>How is life in the land of the .pl people?
*jmd gets his arm machine unbricked.
<nebuli>anybody has a clue how to: (operating-system (services (service (inherit slim) (auto-start #f))))
<nebuli>slim-service returns some thunkomonado monster giving me type error...
<jmd>jxself: Are you talking about Perlmongers or Poles ?
<jxself>The .pl TLD.
<jxself>So, Polish persons.
<nebuli>basically i want to have slim service defined in operating system config but want to have it not auto start on boot
<nebuli>jmd: jxself is talking about me
*nebuli wishes for a cloak ;-p
<jxself>Yes, I saw the hostname when nebuli connected. Trying provide a friendly greeting.
<jmd>nebuli: So are you a perlmonger or a pole?
<jxself>Maybe both?
<nebuli>the later
<jxself>If you go to #freenode and ask for an unaffiliated one you can get one.
<jxself>But then it means people don't get to ask questions. :)
<nebuli>perl is a white noise; sed/awk/grep is good enough
<jmd>guile, on the other hand is pink noise.
<nebuli>jmd: right on
<davexunit>what does that mean?
<nebuli>jxself: aha, thx, will do, perhapa, seems i'll be staying on guixos
<nebuli>now, anybody the wiser about my topical question? tried monad-return, but it still type errors
*nebuli afks: dinner!
<davexunit>hey guix folks! does anyone know of an alternative to this?
<davexunit>a long term goal of mine is to extend 'guix environment' to spawn vms or containers.
<paroneayea>davexunit: interesting
<paroneayea>I'm assuming alternative is because guix doesn't have systemd
<paroneayea>though, that's "guix os"
<paroneayea>maybe still useful to provide the systemd version as a prototype for those running guix as a package manager
<paroneayea>rather than a distro
<paroneayea>yes I know guix os is gnu ;p
<davexunit>yes, I want to do this without systemd
<davexunit>'guix system' can already create vms, but I want to also create containers.
<paroneayea>davexunit: you use guix as a package manager right?
<paroneayea>what if you did it with systemd but designed it as an interface
<davexunit>for the short term, I'll work on making 'guix environment' create VMs a la Vagrant.
<paroneayea>so you could swap out to something else
<paroneayea>oooh guix environment a la vagrant :O
<davexunit>paroneayea: I want this to work on the guix distro as well.
<davexunit>systemd could be a proof-of-concept, but it wouldn't get me to my destination.
<davexunit>maybe dmd needs an nspawn equivalent.
<paroneayea>davexunit: maybe the proof of concept is useful to knwo what you need for dmd or whatever, is what I mean :)
<paroneayea>davexunit: btw, I think that direction is much more interesting than docker
<paroneayea>most people seem to use docker as like "pseudo-configured application object code"
<paroneayea>I'm more interested in reproducibility right now
<davexunit>me too
<paroneayea>and not tying things to gigantic, hundreds-of-megabytes images that you drift out of sync with :)
<gp5st>so I have gnu-usb-install-0.8.x86_64-linux what's the best way to load this into virtualbox?
<davexunit>gp5st: hmmm I think this has been solved here before but I don't know, actually.
<davexunit>paroneayea: yeah, systemd would be useful as an intermediate step.
<davexunit>the issues with supporting such a thing in dmd is 1) would it work on the hurd? and 2) does it really belong in the init system?
<gp5st> Imma give that a try :)
<davexunit>I don't know if there could possibly be a hurd implementation of it, but maybe it's okay to make it a kernel-specific feature.
<paroneayea>davexunit: I think if the HURD comes to implement such features
<paroneayea>you could start to implement support for it there also
<davexunit>but for now, I'll stick with getting the VM part working.
<davexunit>guix can create a VM that shares the host's store
<davexunit>I want to additionally share the directory with the source tree.
<jmd>Bug: Please change guix-daemon to check the build-user group at startup.
<davexunit>jmd: send to please
<civodul>nebuli: re slim-service without auto-start: you would define a my-slim-service monadic procedure, that calls my-slim-service in an mlet, and then returns that with an added 'auto-start?' field
<civodul>maybe better to discuss by email
<gp5st>is dmd consider stable? i.e. production worthy?
<civodul>gp5st: "yes" in the sense that it does its job; "no" in the sense that we'd like a few more features for use a PID 1
<nebuli>civodul: will try, i see i was looking at the problem unmonadically, lol.
<civodul>so it's like: (define (myslim) (mlet ((s (slim-service ...))) (service (inherit s) (auto-start? #f))))
<civodul>if it's something people fine useful, we should add an #:auto-start? parameter to 'slim-service'
<nebuli>civodul: more like some universal method to customize any service in (operating-system ...) clause
<civodul>yeah, that would be best
<civodul>that needs more thought
<nebuli>monadic macros... it's probably PhD material worthy, heh.
<civodul>sounds fancy, no? ;-)
<nebuli>civodul: btw, ever heard of kernel language...
<nebuli>seeing you invent gexp thing, and guix being explicitely about environments manipulation, it might be a good fit.
<civodul>yes, i heard of that, but i'm not quite convinced
<civodul>fexprs are an old debate
<civodul>i'm pretty sold to hygienic macros, syntax objects, and all that
<civodul>sexps aren't enough to represent syntax
<civodul>the same reasoning led to gexps
<nebuli>well, i'm no expert, but i'm sold; perhaps you should read into it, the "triviality" argument is in my opinion too easily lobbed about.
<civodul>ok, i should take a closer look
<nebuli>civodul: there is also (which i think, hints at the same thing shutt is), but it's ml culture stuck in the type systems point of view, where types are really a form of symb…
<nebuli>…olic macro decoration... anywayz
<civodul>it's written in ocaml
<nebuli>no, i'd rather stay in the dynamic culture of scheme
<nebuli>sink, the kernel interpreter written by shutt works in guile... perhaps i could port it into the guile's language infrastructure, but that's a big project
<roptat>oh, sorry, wrong chan ;)
<jmd>/home/john/bsb/bin/ld: cannot find /gnu/store/eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee-glibc-cross-armel-linux-gnueabihf-2.20/lib/
<jmd>Thats a wierd path
<jxself>EEeee!!!! :)
<jmd>WTF is guild ?
<civodul>jmd: the "eeee" means it's something that has been "annihilated"; see remove-store-references
<civodul>remove-store-references is normally used on things that are statically linked
<jmd>One of the bootstrap tarballs has a reference to it.
<civodul>is /home/john/bsb/bin/ld a binary from the binutils bootstrap tarball?
<civodul>and do you get the error when trying to exec it?
<jmd>I fixed that by symlinking
<jmd>But now I'm missing a binary called "guild"
<civodul>so the file name above is its ELF interpreter, which means it's not actually static linked, right?
<civodul>what does 'file' say?
<jmd>I don't have file on this system.
<civodul>or on another one, that would work
<civodul>"guild" is from Guile (used to be known as "guile-tools")
<jmd>readelf certainly suggests that it is statically linked.
<civodul>so does "/home/john/bsb/bin/ld --version" actually work?
<jmd> /home/john/bsb/bin/ld --version
<jmd>GNU ld (GNU Binutils) 2.24
<jmd>Copyright 2013 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
<jmd>This program is free software; you may redistribute it under the terms of
<jmd>the GNU General Public License version 3 or (at your option) a later version.
<jmd>This program has absolutely no warranty.
<civodul>wonderful :-)
<civodul>damn, you need to push that somewhere no?
<jmd>Push what?
<civodul>the ARM cross-compile target
<jmd>Yeah. I can do that.
<civodul>either push wip-arm or post the patches
<civodul>good job, anyways
*civodul -> zZz
<civodul>good night/day!
<jmd>What does guix use graphviz for ?
<bavier`>jmd: it's used trivially to generate some of the documentation images
<jmd>bavier`: Wow. Thats a rather gratuitous reason to depend upon it.
<bavier`>jmd: arguably, yes
<jmd>Hydra seems to be down again.
***root is now known as foo_bar__
<foo_bar__>just installed guix. And I have some questions... first, I found a couple of packages that f
<foo_bar__>fail to build/install
<foo_bar__>guix package -i emacs ended up building cmake 2.8.12
<bavier`>foo_bar__: do you have substitutes enabled?
<foo_bar__>which couldn't be build due to libarchive..... temporary failure in name resolution.
<foo_bar__>no idea
<foo_bar__>how do I check? (sry for my total ignorance)
<foo_bar__>also, as a suggestion, putting an irc client in the basic installation would be a big big win :)
<bavier`>foo_bar__: substitutes from hydra need to be enabled explicitly with `guix archive --authorize <`
<ijp>"temporary failure in name resolution" sounds like a network problem
<sneek>Welcome back ijp, you have 1 message.
<sneek>ijp, aidalgol says: fbs beat us to writing a pure Guile bot, and it appears to do what we wanted cbot to do:
<ijp>more specifically a DNS one
<foo_bar__>ijp: yup, but then, when installing anything, we depend on the sites hosting every one of the sources? I thought they were centralized in some guix site
<ijp>this is what bavier` is talking about
<bavier`>foo_bar__: if substitutes are available, some sources may be downloaded from hydra
<foo_bar__>aha :)
<foo_bar__>bavier`: that command is trying to redirect the content of a file (which I don't have)....