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<civodul> https://github.com/conda/conda/blob/e6936a3de17e2dd0147f54c6ffac2434835ba533/conda/core/initialize.py#L689-L694

<civodul>oh, and hi!

<civodul>looks like i won't go much further with my conda testing

<zimoun>hi!

<civodul>o/

<zimoun>civodul: what is is the issue with Conda modifying .bashrc? For most non-tech people, I know, it is helpful because it just works.

<civodul>zimoun: i know, but for most tech people i know, it's a red line that shouldn't be crossed

<civodul>the guideline is: don't modify user files without their consent

<civodul>anyway, that's a detail compared to running "sudo python ..."

<zimoun>last time I run Conda, it asks before doing it.

<civodul>for me in "guix shell -C" it created ~/.bashrc without asking

<civodul>it eventually failed while trying to run "sudo python", for which it didn't ask either

<zimoun>did you have a .bashrc created before?

<civodul>no, maybe that's why it didn't ask?

<civodul>i did: guix shell -CNP --no-cwd conda coreutils sed grep findutils

<zimoun>yes, and so I do not see the problem. It does not modify user files without consent since user does not have files. ;-)

<civodul>i understand how it can make things "just work", but to me that's an anti-pattern

<zimoun>I can agree, but that’s opinionated on what it means “just work” :-)

<zimoun>BTW, interesting toots in your feed. :-)

<zimoun>civodul, do you use Mattermost from Emacs?

<civodul>zimoun: yes, via Bitlbee!

<civodul>works pretty well

<civodul>i haven't added the new Café Guix thing though

<zimoun>ok, cool. I will give a try. Because otherwise, I will never be on Café Guix. :-)

<rekado_>conda manipulating bashrc is just nasy

<rekado_>*nasty

<rekado_>and reinvoking itself with sudo… I just can’t…

<rekado_>the whole thing is really frustrating.

<rekado_>building it was really challenging because it assumes it can just write wherever it pleases.

<rekado_>oh, yeah, I see your toots already describe that.

<zimoun>yeah, this sudo is really… sigh! Does it mean that now it is not possible to install Conda without root access; which was THE feature back at the time.

<rekado_>BTW: we run “conda init” as part of the build, but I guess the installed files are not found at run time…?

<rekado_>no, it’s still possible to use without root.

<civodul>(oh you see my toots!?)

<civodul>rekado_: yeah it instructed me to run "conda init", so i did

<rekado_>weird. This shouldn’t be necessary because we do this in a build phase.

<civodul>but then, why root? just to install /etc/profile.d/conda.sh and modify files here and there?

<rekado_>maybe this is no longer good enough

<rekado_>it just tries to be helpful on single-user machines. But to me this behavior is simply unacceptable.

<zimoun>civodul, do you use your own Bitlbee server or a public one?

<rekado_>(I see your toots like this: duckduckgo “civodul” toots, and then click around somewhere…)

<civodul>:-)

<civodul>zimoun: my own

<zimoun>via the Guix package, I guess.

<civodul>so conda tries to be helpful, but the end result is that i can't even try it

<civodul>(without letting it run as root)

<civodul>zimoun: yep, specifically: (service bitlbee-service-type (bitlbee-configuration (bitlbee bitlbee-purple) (plugins (list purple-mattermost))))

<zimoun>Ah, that’s a good motivation to switch from Guix-on-Debian to Guix System. :-) Because running a VM for that is maybe too much. :-)

<civodul>heh

<rekado_>civodul: is the 'init build phase no longer writing these files to the prefix directory?

<rekado_>or is conda just unaware of the installed files?

<civodul>rekado_: no idea; i used the "guix shell" command above, then tried running "conda install" etc.

<civodul>i'm the typical bad user who doesn't try very hard

<civodul>i'd be mad a someone doing that with Guix ;-)

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2021-10-29.log