IRC channel logs

<zimoun>thanks rekado_ for the R packages.

<civodul>rekado_: hi! something's wrong with https://pigx.elephly.net/

<civodul>though https://bioinformatics.mdc-berlin.de/pigx/ is the new one

<zimoun>rekado_: r-shiny is broken; as explained in bug#50483; the patch is in <http://issues.guix.gnu.org/issue/50702>. Do you have a slot to give a look?

<civodul>a CONDA person on birdsite was angry and mentioned https://conda-forge.org/

<civodul>apparently it should have "recipes" to build packages from source but i can't find them

<civodul>ah so it's called "feedstock"

<civodul>i found this one: https://github.com/conda-forge/bison-feedstock

<zimoun>civodul: ahah! conda-forge is what we call a channel

<zimoun>bioconda <https://bioconda.github.io/> is another

<zimoun>I challenge the angry person to pick a random package from conda-forge and then rebuild all from source. For instance, a random package at version from last year.

<zimoun>civodul: long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, I spent countless hours to package a complex C++ scientific software for Conda <https://github.com/zimoun/bempp-conda>. Just build from source on my laptop (Debian) and on the cluster (Ubuntu LTS 14 at the time), and get something “similar”, it was sweat, pain and workarounds.

<zimoun>civodul: I pick a random package from conda-forge and I get this: <https://github.com/conda-forge/qsum-feedstock/blob/master/recipe/meta.yaml#L12>

<zimoun>{{ PYTHON }} -m pip install . --no-deps -vv

<zimoun>The one of binutils looks like: <https://github.com/conda-forge/binutils-feedstock/blob/master/recipe/build.sh>

<zimoun>and I guess the file yum_requirements.txt is the list of dependencies

<civodul>zimoun: yeah, it does look very hacky and brittle

<civodul>though i can concede that it's better than binaries uploaded by the authors, as in the Torch case

<civodul>so i'm thinking of adding a note mentioning conda-forge to placate the person

<civodul> https://nitter.net/GuixHpc/status/1439928418829803528

<dstolfa>the only reason these things ever work is because of the solid base that redhat provides. it's amazing how fragile everything that people bolt on top of it is...

<zimoun>Is PyTorch on conda-forge?

<zimoun>civodul: here it is, I guess <https://github.com/conda-forge/pytorch-cpu-feedstock/blob/master/recipe/build_pytorch.sh>

<zimoun>I bet it is not straightforward at all to rebuild pytorch from source using this.

<civodul>yeah, i doubt it's reproducible

<zimoun>Well, saying that «opaque binaries [...] lacking reproducible build methodology and tooling» is full true! It is by design of Conda

<zimoun>However, indeed «no signs […] of moving in that direction» is half-true because conda-forge tries to dead-end-y improve… arf!

<zimoun>I do not speak about reproducibility. Simply rebuild at other point in time on another machine. Maybe if first you get a Docker image based on Debian, then inside you run the recipe from conda-forge ;-)

<civodul>heh, yeah

<civodul> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28604470

<civodul>zimoun: how 'bout https://web.fdn.fr/~lcourtes/pastebin/pytorch-update.patch.html ?

<civodul>is that fair representation?

<zimoun>yeah… even if it cannot be «a possible answer» because Conda is doomed when speaking about rebuild. Anyway, let be sweet to Conda folks. :-)

<zimoun>LGTM

<civodul>heh, cool, thanks :-)

<civodul>i see Julia packages waiting for you, zimoun: https://issues.guix.gnu.org/50490 :-)

<zimoun>yeah, thanks :-) I am fighting this «Julia is broken» <http://issues.guix.gnu.org/48238#3>

<zimoun>civodul: <https://www.ouvrirlascience.fr/prix-science-ouverte-du-logiciel-libre-de-la-recherche/> je me demande comment Guix pourrait-il concourir ? :-)

<civodul>je sais pas !

<civodul>my boss mentioned it to me

<civodul>i wouldn't be surprised if CONDA won that prize ;-)

<civodul>you wanna fill in the application?

<zimoun>Maybe I will do it if Bordeaux folks do not. For sure, it would attract visibility and wider audience, at least. :-)

<zimoun>«La soumission des candidatures sera ouverte début octobre et détaillera le processus de candidature.» Let see when it is open ;-)

<civodul>sounds good!

<civodul>i guess we'd be competing with superstars like scikit-learn and Coq though...

<zimoun>yeah but as Jean-Claude Dusse says: who know? ;-) It might work if the stars are well aligned.

<civodul>heh

<drakonis>ah todd gamblin

<drakonis>wasnt he on #guix a while back?

<rekado_>pigx.elephly.net was just an internal demo. It’s now https://cloud.rolv.io.

<rekado_>drakonis: todd was here during Fosdem

<drakonis>oh i see

<rekado_>weird comment from todd

<drakonis>indeed

<rekado_>zimoun: thanks for the note about r-shiny, I’ll take a look at it tomorrow

IRC channel logs

2021-09-21.log