IRC channel logs
2025-07-04.log
back to list of logs
<evilsetg>When guile prints a backtrace, often the procedure arguments are just blank underscores. Can somebody explain to me, why that is. In my mental model guile keeps around each active frame of the stack, so I would expect it to be able to access all arguments. <ekaitz>evilsetg: because they are optimized away <ekaitz>evilsetg: try -Ohelp to see some optimization options, you might be interested on turning that off <ekaitz>evilsetg: let me know if it helps <fantazo>how do guile programmers survive in a world full of java and C#? <identity>fantazo: by not writing java and C# generally <fantazo>identity: yeah, but that's a luxury only the very few can have. it's like 80% of the job market here. <fantazo>then python, the maybe node, then PHP and that was it. <fantazo>coding scheme is only what some people in research can do. <identity>sure, but a bunch of people get paid to write Guile, and some do it in their free time <fantazo>I would appreciate if that could be me, while not needing to pick up university again to get at least my bachelor to "earn" my privilege to code scheme. <fantazo>ArneBab: being again the self-inflicted peniless artist, who fights for the "right stuff" while dying from starvation? I see. <fantazo>that's only a dedication level available for the few. <wingo>current status: copying collector works but only when parallel trace is off; weird situation. still poking <ArneBab>fantazo: no, at work I use Java, JS, Python, and for 5 weeks now also Ruby. <ArneBab>fantazo: Until Guile is widespread enough and I have ways to support all requirements, I can only use it as a hobby. <dodoyada>I'm trying to start a business myself using guile as the primary language so I guess be the change you want to see <ArneBab>dodoyada: that’s great! Do you have experiences to share? <dodoyada>just a bit: I'm primarily a clojure developer but I love guix, scheme, and ultimately guile. I have found the guile ecosystem to be great but vs clojure I would say it's 'hard mode'. That's good though, my personal motto is 'I do hard things for fun'. I've been able to almost complete my project with very minimal dependencies but I had to come up with custom tooling around deployment, web-server-friendly repl-ing, logging, ser <dodoyada>middleware, and the list goes on. I will eventually make it all public and try to contribute useful changes where they belong. I'm hoping my experience can make it more practical for more people to use guile in a commercial setting <ArneBab>(or missing references to essential resources?) <dodoyada>I never saw that or it might've been a big impact on my start! I do like how I have it set up now. I used guix for package management and invoke guild directly (well, through a guix shell) for compilation. Using the (guile web) interface I made a handler the recreates my entire 'router' for every request so that routing changes will be picked up. However, I still had the issue where reloading the router won't recompile my modu <dodoyada>so I made a reload function that recompiles everything so that I don't have to go eval the main router hub every time I change a page. Now it's pretty solid and I'm happy with the workflow. For client side I use htmx but I do want to try hoot. I'll make a post about it in detail eventually <dodoyada>in a previous project I used cljs for a pwa. If I end up doing that for this project (I would rather just have a website) I'll try hoot before using js <dodoyada>actually I think that guide would benefit a lot from including a basic router and page example because it could address reloading and project organization which must be a pain for the uninitiated <omentic>what's the convention for representing literal symbols i.e. $ in data? <omentic>racket has '|...|, wondering if guile has something equivalent or if i should just use strings <identity>omentic: guile has '|...| too in r7rs-mode but there is also #{...}# or you could use (symbol #\. #\. #\.); the question of whether you should use them is a different one, though