***fibratio` is now known as fibration
<ArneBab>sneek: later tell catonano: autotools is pretty nice, but it is hard to find clear documentation because lots of half-truths are floating around the net and it misses clear guides "how to do X nicely with autotools". <amz3>ArneBab: how are you doing? Is there new job neat? <amz3>ArneBab: how are you doing? Is yout new job neat? <amz3>ArneBab: how are you doing? Is your new job neat? <ArneBab>amz3: yes, the new job is pretty cool -- it’s java, and an old codebase, but challenging and fun nontheless. <ArneBab>amz3: I spent the past week battering SSL into some not-yet-secured connections, and that felt great, because it is the right thing to do. And I’m working on a presentation of Emacs for time management, along with a prepared environment people can simply run. <ArneBab>amz3: and our team leader knows his stuff: I feel like the right technical decisions are taken. He somehow manage to combine experience with willingness to experiment for getting things really right. <ArneBab>amz3: and I could write that blog entry on work time <amz3>I am not confident the write about it yet <amz3>on a related, not I stopped working on neon database, for the time being the time to catch up with work related stuff <amz3>it seems very odd to support full RDF spec for getting things done <amz3>and some people told me they are framework to test performances of non RDF pure implementations <amz3>so I did not fill in the competition of HOBBIT contest <ArneBab>that happens — don’t fret about it, a new job fills part of the mind, and that’s ok. <amz3>I am diving into Ansible nowdays as part of work <amz3>I am curious about thing they call devops <daviid>ArneBab: 'Emacs for time management', you mean timekeeping? <amz3>right now, after reading the whole documentation, I have the feeling they created a new language that embeds a few procedures to to do remote calls on a host <ArneBab>daviid: partly that, but also planning, todos, tracking my weekly work time, and naturally taking notes in the clocked entries :-) <ArneBab>amz3: sounds like ansibles language have been created more elegantly (*cough* guile *cough* :-) ), but I’m pretty sure they had their reasons (things are rarely easy) <ArneBab>amz3: yepp, org-mode and org-agenda with clocktable and org-capture, combined with org-jira (and since today excorporate), all polished and integrated that things just work <daviid>ArneBab: asking because, as you know, I wrote gnu foliot ... <amz3>ArneBab: it sounds like they wanted some kind of non programmers to code or somethig to me maybe it's wrong thinking <daviid>ArneBab: I personally think that apps that do timekeeping (precisely like foliot) should not also offer todo's ... then I kept foliot ultra tiny: it just does that (timekeeping). I don't beleive in time tracking <ArneBab>daviid: I know, but since it wasn’t in Guix for a few months, I decided to go for org-mode, and it’s working pretty well now. <daviid>I think it still isn't in guix, or is it now? <amz3>but it might be a good idea to test gnu foliot, since i use gnome <daviid>me too, all the time, but not for time keeping it just does fir for the job, afaic <ArneBab>daviid: I actually don’t need anything complicated, it just has to be as low-overhead as possible <amz3>there is no package yet for guix :( <ArneBab>low overhead not in CPU but in "Arne has to remember to do X" <amz3>erf I think I started one... but don't know where it is <daviid>ArneBab: sure, exactly the spirit of foliot: a non s/w eng. user could use it without any lesson, in 5 min ... <amz3>that said, my use is very simple <ArneBab>daviid: that sounds good — it has but one drawback: it is not already in Emacs, and I am in Emacs in the morning when I check what I am working on <ArneBab>daviid: my workflow in the morning: click F12 to see org-agenda on the right and the emacs kanban table on the left. Choose a task and hit shift-F12. <daviid>non it's not, it's a tiny gtk2/sqlite2 app <ArneBab>when I switch to another task, I hit 8G–. <ArneBab>when I leave for lunch, I hit Alt-Shift-F12 anywhere to stop the clock <daviid>yep, but where do you write how much time you spent on what projects ...? <ArneBab>and when I mis-clock anything, I just edit the text file :-) <ArneBab>that’s what org-mode does, since the tasks are organized in projects <ArneBab>the clocktable aggregates everything automatically, shown below the agenda <ArneBab>(that’s the part about shift-F12 when switching the task: It tells org-mode to clock on that other task) <daviid>ah i see. i don't work like that, because if my brain stop being fully concentrate on the task, I don't charge my customer, so generally, out of 4h, I will only charge 2 or so ... <ArneBab>and Alt-F12 creates a new task via org-capture <daviid>i see, just don't like any clock based timekeeping approach <ArneBab>daviid: I work a standard 40h week in regular employment <ArneBab>OrangeShark: yes, but fake modesty forbids me to say who wrote it :-) <daviid>sure, but you probably only concentrate half of the time ... <ArneBab>I might, yes, but since this is true for everyone and we get paid a fixed monthly pay, that’s not a problem <ArneBab>I only clock out if I happen to space out on something for more than 5 minutes (like writing comments on a website) <ArneBab>daviid: essentially that’s just a matter of scaling the pay for the work time. <ArneBab>daviid: if you clock half as much time as me, you have to take twice as high rates to earn the same on a healthy work week <OrangeShark>I found it, was thinking that name seemed familiar ;P <ArneBab>I’ve been using that every day for the past 6 years <daviid>ArneBab: yes, but I like to know eactly what I did, as in being concentrate ... and as a freelance I have to charge per hour (and te'ns of the hour...) and i would still use foliot if i was emplyed by ... <ArneBab>the only time I need really *exact exact* is my weekly time <ArneBab>for everything else ±15 minutes don’t hurt <ArneBab>the important part in that is that I don’t actually clock in or out: It simply tracks which program is in focus <daviid>like i can tell you to develop and maintain gnu foliot, till today, it took me so far 612.7 hours :), and for guile-cv 428.9 hours :):) <ArneBab>so I can click it from now and then and see the dominant time sink <ArneBab>I can only tell you that I still have around one hour of the 8 hours per month we get for stuff no customer pays for <ArneBab>(part of that is creating the presentation on Emacs) <ArneBab>but the past two weeks were hard because I got into 8h undertime due to having to be home to take care of craftsmen, and getting back on track was exhausting. <ArneBab>actually took me three weeks to get back into slight overtime <ArneBab>daviid: if I were to track my Freenet-maintenance-time, that would hurt a lot <ArneBab>what I’d really need is something which can track where I spend my time without me declaring anything (guessing it automatically by activity), but the closest I am to that is Emacs org-mode <daviid>:) but still worth keeping imo, I timekeep (not track) absolutely everything I do <amz3>I've been arguing about timekeeping at the workplace but did not use for myself for a long time <amz3>I will start doing pomodoro <amz3>I could do that in foliot ? daviid ? <ArneBab>daviid: do you also graph from foliot, i.e. finding out where your timesinks are? <ArneBab>daviid: AFAIK working only 15min on a task and then switching <amz3>ArneBab: to keep track of what I did during a day <amz3>ArneBab: do you do that? <amz3>ArneBab: I always forget how I did think <ArneBab>I keep track of what I did in org-mode, and throw in lots of notes <ArneBab>I’m pretty sure they exist, but not working out of the box <amz3>the difficult thing, is that you need to keep track of wording or use tags <amz3>like keywords over time thing? <amz3>for instance, it's a small step I guess, but I always use the same pockt for the same things <amz3>like my mobile phone is always on the left side <daviid>ArneBab: no, but you can filter (on the main tine window) on any criteria (except the duration) and you may use 'tags' <amz3>it's a binary quantified life on or off =) <daviid>that way I can tell my prof. exatcly how much time I spent with a phd student, for example <daviid>in 8y, I spent 311.2 with karen (one of our phd student, she's doing postdoc know) <daviid>anyway, have to work now ... still here but will concentrate a bit :) <ArneBab>wow, you track back for 8 years … I more or less ignore any timing data which was more than 3 weeks ago (because I’ll have put an aggregate number into some other system, either my overall time budget or the issue tracker) <daviid>I keep I don't track :), and it i just in the database, everything I work on (I don't keep anything wrt private life) is in the db, tagged, so i can filter and use it t invoice, or justify some argument ... all this is very light in fact, it may sounds 'heavy', but i jst make entries in fliot, it takes a few min per day, and that's it ... <Labu>Hello all, does someone know why 8sync is not listed on the guile project's librairies page ? what is the project status ? <daviid>Labu: prob because the author did not send a patch for guile's pages <daviid>it reminds me i should do that for foliot and guile-cv <Labu>Ok daviid is it author which must patch the guile's page ? <daviid>Labu: yes, guile's web pages are 'our' pages and we are all responsible to improve them ... <Labu>what are foliot and guile-cv ? <Labu>ok guile-cv is for image processing I found it <daviid>Labu: duckduckkgo 'gnu foliot' and 'gnu guile-cv' <daviid>i have a problem to copy/paste from epiphany to emacs, anyone has that ptoblem to? I'm on debian buster <daviid>if i copy a url and paste it here, the hD starts to spin, it totally locks my laptop for a few minutes, as if it was sending the entire HD content to the nsa or so :), <Labu>weird daviid I have emacs but not epiphany <daviid>ACTION reading wingo's email on guile-3 progress... <Labu>I have this expression I don't understand: (let lp ((i 0)) ... <Labu>I know (let (var ini) ...) <Labu>but I don't understand what lp mean in my example <daviid>Labu: in the manual, look for 'named loop' <ArneBab>Labu: that’s the most elegant structure for recursion that I know of to date <Labu>I didn't know this ArneBab <Labu>yes it allows to declare a recursive function and launch it with one atatement as I understand <jralls>wingo: I found the reason on disassembly. The generated code is actually calling scm_to_locale_string. Any idea how that might be happening? <jralls>wingo: Sorry, Latin1, not UTF16. <spk121>jrails: did you call (setlocale LC_ALL "") at the top of the program? <jralls>But as I said, the dissassembly shows the reason, it's calling the wrong function. Setlocale can't affect that. <mwette>jralls: Did you try to use (compile ...) to bytecode etc to see where the conversion is occurring? <jralls>mwette: I don't understand the question. This is all C... <mwette> jralls: sorry, didn't look at the code; I assumed scheme when you said "generated code" <jralls>Curiously simply changing the call from scm_to_utf8_string(scm_string) to scm_to_utf8_stringn(scm_string, NULL) prevents the compile error. <amz3>I am not working on xote but neon (fwiw)