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<davexunit>so, looks like the new emacs maintainer is sympathetic towards guile-emacs
<davexunit>potentially good news
<nalaginrut>morning guilers~
<davexunit>hey nalaginrut
<Chaos`Eternal>helo, mortals
<Chaos`Eternal>helo guilers
<artyom-poptsov>Hello everybody
<Chaos`Eternal>i would like to say , guilers wont die
<nalaginrut>well, wel do need a book like <<realm of racket>> for Guile, it's a very good book for beginners
<nalaginrut>or <<land of lisp>>
<nalaginrut>unfortunately, I can't draw comics for that
<nalaginrut>ACTION never learn drawing...
<nalaginrut>"Some examples of valid
<nalaginrut>Racket symbols are 'foo, 'ice9, 'my-killer-app27, and even '--<<==>>--." -- <<realm of racket>>
<nalaginrut>huh?! ice9?
<wleslie>see, it's taking over the world
***rafik is now known as turbopape
<dsmith-work>Morning Greetings, Guilers
<dsmith-work>wingo: Native Code! Woo!
<wingo>some time :)
<dsmith-work>But you have a direction. That's really encouraging.
<nalaginrut>oh where?! native code
<nalaginrut>oh, I see the blog
<wingo>hum, should have mentioned (beta) in my v2.1.1 tag; fixing...
<civodul>wingo: you're releasing today?
<wingo>civodul: i was going to get it uploaded, maybe send the note tomorrow, dunno
<wingo>it would be the same tarball as i uploaded before and people tested
<civodul>i was wondering about the collision with the Guix release, but maybe that's fine
<civodul>the more the merrier ;-)
<civodul>also, we may want to switch to the new web site at the same time
<wingo>ooh neat
<wingo>should i be uploading it to
<civodul>the web site is ready and i told sirgazil we'd sync the switch with "some other event"
<civodul>and i think we have one here ;-)
<wingo>oh good, let's switch it :)
<wingo>lol ncftp
<civodul>wingo: can you take care of it?
<wingo>civodul: the web site switch? sure
<nalaginrut>I think non-stable has to go
<nalaginrut>ACTION surprised 2.1 released before Artanis 0.1...
<civodul>wingo: excellent, thanks a lot!
<civodul>there's one entry point, which is 'export-web-site' in (website exporter)
<civodul>you just need to call it to get the HTML
<wingo>civodul: ok :)
<wingo>yay the tarballs uploaded fine:
<davexunit>what an exciting day in Guile land.
<nalaginrut>oh so quick
<civodul>meanwhile, i'm still building/retrieving the binary tarballs for Guix...
<wingo>civodul: sorry, i am an idiot :) where is the code for the new web site?
<civodul> :-)
<wingo>ok :)
<civodul>oh and in addition to export-web-site, the static parts (images, CSS, etc.) must be copied
<davexunit>perhaps it should be haunted at some point ;)
<civodul>yes :-)
<civodul>i noticed mthl did that for Guix's web site, looks nice
<wingo>civodul: to be clear, what i need to do is update the cvs checkout with the results from running the exporter and the static files, right? and update the manual
<civodul>right, and remove the current files to be sure
<civodul>you would put the manual in a separate sub-directory i guess?
<wingo>i wasn't thinking of changing it from how it is now
<wingo>dunno tho
<wingo>ACTION v ignorant :)
<civodul>oh in docs/master, right?
<civodul>sounds good
<wingo>yeah, not overwriting the 2.0 docs of course
<wingo>ACTION holds nose, does guix package -i cvs
<davexunit>I think you mean 'guix environment --ad-hoc cvs' ;)
<lloda>hello wingo, civodul, mark_weaver, I'd like to have branch lloda-array-support merged in master before 2.2. I need to clean up (array-for-each-cell) which is now using VLAs and add tests for the same, but I'd like to see if this seems feasible to you in principle
<wingo>no prob, let's talk about it after the release is done
<lloda>lloda-array-support is already rebased on top of v2.1.1
<lloda>well, the commit before
<wingo>the reports about 20s compile times are a bit troubling
<wingo>on guile-snmp and such
<wingo>it turns out i remember how to use cvs
<nalaginrut>ACTION still doesn't know how to play CVS
<wingo>lol, spoke too soon.
<dsmith-work>$ git describe
<davexunit>I want to change to just giving projects ssh access to a directory on the web server where they can upload whatever pages they want.
<davexunit>without having to check build artifacts into a CVS repo.
<davexunit>but even just changing the whole system to git was flat-out rejected.
<davexunit>www-discuss is nothing but bikesheds and it's sad.
<civodul>let's register!
<nalaginrut>davexunit: yep, and drop CVS
<civodul> even
<nalaginrut> ?
<civodul>led by sirgazil, davexunit, and paroneayea
<civodul>would be cool no? :-)
<davexunit>the ideal really would be to just let project maintainers rsync whatever web pages they wanted
<davexunit>without a version control system interfering
<civodul>yeah rsync would work just fine
<paroneayea>oh wow NICE
<paroneayea>the new design is up!
<civodul>woohoo again!
<davexunit>it's glorious!
<paroneayea>SO GREAT
<paroneayea>sirgazil did an amazing job
<civodul>we're living crazy times my friends
<wingo>holy crap this is the first time i've ever seen this thing and it's amazing
<nalaginrut>davexunit: could you please add Artanis?
<paroneayea>wingo: it's like we're some kind of welcoming programming community or something!
<davexunit>nalaginrut: hmm? I'm not in charge of this thing.
<davexunit>would be nice to maintain a page with an active list of guile projects
<wingo>and the links actually work
<wingo>like to the manuals and such
<wingo>v nice.
<davexunit>for example, I had no idea that guile-snmp even existed
<davexunit>until wingo mentioned it earlier
<davexunit>oh looks like we have pages for it :)
<nalaginrut>I believe we can add more to "Applications using Guile"
<davexunit>nalaginrut: send a patch to the website to guile-user?
<davexunit>or maybe guile-devel?
<davexunit>not sure what is best for this purpose
<nalaginrut>I don't know the proper way, I think it's not raw html, right? it's generated html I guess
<davexunit>nalaginrut: the site is created via a scheme program
<davexunit>using SXML and such
<davexunit>so you'll know just how to hack it ;)
<civodul>nalaginrut: git clone git://
<nalaginrut>civodul: thanks!
<paroneayea>I have to say
<paroneayea>I feel a lot more positive about the future of GNU just seeing this kind of design in place
<paroneayea>which sounds superficial, but it isn't!
<davexunit>outreach and presentation be important, yes.
<davexunit>darn it.
<paroneayea>hehe :)
<davexunit>I'm a fool.
<davexunit>but yes! I'm also feeling way more positive
<nalaginrut>yes, that's what I want to say too
<davexunit>I might submit the guile home page to HN
<paroneayea>davexunit: please do
<paroneayea>davexunit: I'll submit to Reddit
<wingo>running announce-gen i get this error
<wingo>Can't locate object method "new" via package "Digest::SHA1" (perhaps you forgot to load "Digest::SHA1"?) at build-aux/announce-gen line 165.
<wingo>i am in an --ad-hoc environment with perl-digest-sha1 and perl. what could the deal be?
<wingo>ACTION pokes civodul, who surely is doing a similar thing in guix right now :)
<paroneayea>is now a good time to start new Guile related accounts?
<paroneayea>civodul: btw I know you objected to Twitter, what if we drive a twitter account through GNU Social?
<holomorph>oh wow the new site is live
<thorwil>wingo: in case you haven't seen it: as discussed on the list, the "gambda" symbol could be used elsewhere
<wingo>oh neat :)
<wingo>i think it's cool
<wingo>i defer design decisions tho to the designers :)
<thorwil>there was no consensus on that level, but i kinda barged in, so no surprise
<thorwil>so if anybody has a use for it, contact me off-list, please, as i will unsubscribe (not in anger, only because i'm a fish on the dry there)
<nalaginrut>ACTION is sending the patch
<paroneayea>thorwil: maybe at some point I will... I actually really like the idea of writing a library named "gambda" :)
<paroneayea>that is
<paroneayea>if guile doesn't scoop it up itself!
<paroneayea>hey btw
<wingo>bah, how frustrating, i really don't grok perl :P
<paroneayea>wingo: civodul: is there a good "guile maintainers" email that I should set these social network thingies to?
<paroneayea>or should I just do a and for now
<wingo>paroneayea: no, just direct to me ludo and mark
<paroneayea>wingo: aha, okay, I'll do that
<wingo>you mean the email attached to the accounts?
<paroneayea>wingo: yes
<wingo>yeah dunno. guile-social@dustycloud works for me :)
<paroneayea>ok, I'll set the accounts to those
<paroneayea>since I haven't heard otherwise, I'm going to use sirgazil's compacted logo for Guile for now
<wingo>i edited announce-gen and it worked, stranggggeeee
<nalaginrut>wingo: could you take a look at my patch and apply it to the new site?
<nalaginrut>I added the entry of Artanis to the main page
<roelj>Wow, the new website looks really good!
<wingo>all thanks to sirgazil!
<paroneayea>I also set up but I can't figure out how to hook it up to Twitter
<paroneayea>confirmed that the FSF is driving Twitter through GNU Social, I'm assuming if we took a similar route, that would go well
<wingo>i think i sent a 2.1.1 announce mail
<davexunit>paroneayea: there's a settings thing somewhere
<davexunit>and you can configure the bridge there.
<wingo>oh yay
<wingo>i remembered how to email, that's good
<cmhobbs>wow, great job on the new guile website, guys!
<cmhobbs>also, there's a broken link
<cmhobbs>let me dig it up
<cmhobbs>davexunit, did you write sly?
<paroneayea>davexunit: maybe doesn't support the bridge
<davexunit>paroneayea: I use which does
<paroneayea>davexunit: yeah doesn't allow new registrations
<paroneayea>maybe I should try another one
<cmhobbs>under Guile empowers users with "practical software freedom", the "Read More" button linkes to, which yields a 404
<davexunit>cmhobbs: oof. good find!
<davexunit>paroneayea: one sec
<paroneayea>davexunit: mattl is going to give us a account in a couple of days
<paroneayea>so we'll drive twitter from that.
<paroneayea>so I'll wait for that.
<paroneayea>in the meanwhile, we *do* have a twitter account now
<paroneayea>if civodul becomes enraged, I'll remove it
<paroneayea>bhowever, I plan to drive it from gnu social
<paroneayea>and promote federated alternatives on it
<paroneayea>so I hope that helps mitigate the issue.
<paroneayea>wingo: I'll promote the 2.1.1 release on those accounts too
<davexunit>ACTION waits for announcement to show up on guile-user so he can post to HN
<wingo>ACTION fixes the dead link
<mario-goulart>It hit guile-devel:
<paroneayea>davexunit: what's your gpg key fingerprint?
<paroneayea>and shortid?
<mario-goulart>congrats on the release, BTW. 2.2 is looking pretty nice!
<wingo>mario-goulart: tx!
<davexunit>paroneayea: shortid 0FF1D807
<davexunit>fingerprint = 8CCB A7F5 52B9 CBEA E1FB 2915 8328 C747 0FF1 D807
<paroneayea>davexunit: great
<paroneayea>davexunit: wingo: civodul: I'm sending you all the social account info
<davexunit>we should sign keys next time we meet in person
<wingo>ok, regenerated the web site with the news
<wingo>i think the release is done
<paroneayea>I failed to get any of the diaspora sites I tried to register on to work in 5 minutes
<paroneayea>so for now I'm not going to bother there :P
<paroneayea>okay, sent the account info
<wingo>congratulations OrangeShark, you are our first user #100 :)
<wingo>that i know of anyway :)
<wingo>in the channel i mean
<paroneayea>wingo: oh!
<paroneayea>did this merge bipt's latest branch of emacs lisp stuff?
<wingo>i think not
<wingo>not yet i mean :)
<OrangeShark>thanks wingo :D
<paroneayea>wingo: that might be nice to have by 2.2 :)
<paroneayea>wingo: ooh, the GOOPS stuff did land though?
<mario-goulart>wingo: small typo in your latest post: s/their langauge implementation/their language implementation/
<mario-goulart>amazing post. Whanks for writing it.
<mario-goulart>Thanks, even. :-)
<paroneayea> and both have some nice announcements on them now :)
<jchmrt>wingo: in your mailing list post it says: "We encourage you to test this release and provide feedback to adress@hidden". Is there any way to unhide this email-adress?
<davexunit>jchmrt: that's in the rendering for the web, the real email has it
<jchmrt>davexunit: oh, that's too bad for the people viewing it from hacker news
<jchmrt>maybe someone could comment the real adress on the post
<wingo>mario-goulart: thank you :-)
<OrangeShark>the new website looks great!
<civodul>wingo: congrats, and a big thank you!
<dsmith-work>Ah. Reading the NEWS just reminded me. Geiser doesn't wortk with 2.1. Pretty sure I sent jao a patch.
<paroneayea>what a great morning for Guile :)
<civodul>"beaucoup-bucks language implementation"
<civodul>ACTION laughs before his screen :-)
<dsmith-work>The s/make-program/load-thunk-from-memory/ and s/objcode/bytecode/ change
<civodul>the blog article is very cool
<civodul>AOT + some sort of JIT sounds like the grail, indeed
<paroneayea>civodul: what blogpost?
<dsmith-work>paroneayea: wingolog
<paroneayea>damn, so much to promote this morning
<dsmith-work>Wow 104 nicks in here
***rafik is now known as turbopape__
<paroneayea>ACTION promotes wingo's post
<paroneayea>whoo, that's a lot of use out of the new guile social accounts already :)
<paroneayea>new site design, new release, wingolog post
<paroneayea>all in one day!
<turbopape__>paroneayea there was a new guile release today? I might have missed something. ..
<paroneayea>turbopape__: yep, of 2.1.1
<paroneayea>what will become the 2.2.x series
<turbopape__>Great news :)
<paroneayea>yeah, a great day!
<turbopape__>And with a cool website and a logo
<turbopape__>... wonder how this was not advertised in the mailing list...
<davexunit>Guile 2.1.1 release announcement on the HN front page, btw
<OrangeShark>turbopape__: it was mentioned in the new release
<turbopape__>Might be a non question, but, do js and elisp fronts support continuations, tco and all?
<davexunit>people are digging the new website!
<davexunit>marketing really works!
<paroneayea>lots of positive responses
<davexunit>looks like we're onto something here
<turbopape__> Indeed. I think it's time Guile gets a twitter account, by the way.
<paroneayea>turbopape__: just did
<paroneayea>and also
<civodul>paroneayea: didn't you say it's not an "official account"?
<paroneayea>civodul: it's going to be driven by GNU Social
<paroneayea>same way the FSF one is
<paroneayea>ACTION edits the description to point to and statusnet
<paroneayea>er gnu social
<paroneayea>civodul: Matt Lee is setting us up a gnu social instance next week
<mouldysammich>Hey! The new website is freaking sweet!
<sleblanc>Congrats on the new website, it looks very good while remaining usable
<davexunit>sleblanc: thank you!
<sleblanc>I would like to suggest adding Lilypond to the list of applications using Guile, as it uses Guile extensively to produce its sheet music
<davexunit>the guile community needs to get lilypond onto guile 2.0
<paroneayea>hey, we're top of Reddit right now
<paroneayea>reddit /r/linux :)
<davexunit>nice :)
<davexunit>there are some responsiveness issues
<davexunit>on the guixsd site too
<davexunit>would be nice to fix those eventually
<davexunit>implementing bootstrap's "responsive images" is just a few lines of CSS, for example.
<OrangeShark>sleblanc: GNU Lilypond is listed here
<mike121>question: will SMOBs continue to be supported past 2.0.x?
<OrangeShark>I noticed the Ragnarok project listed in Networking is linked to a gitorious repo which is no longer available
<davexunit>mike121: I believe so, yes.
<mike121>davexunit: thanks. the pre-2.0.12 docs call them "heading for eventual deprecation"
<davexunit>I could see them being deprecated, but I can't see the guile maintainers having any choice but to continue to support them for a long time
<davexunit>due to the number of applications that use them.
<rekado>the new Guile website is beautiful! I cannot help but wonder why Lilypond is not mentioned as one of the big applications using Guile. It's using Guile 1.8, but this isn't a very important difference for users and those who would like to extend Lilypond with Guile.
<rekado>ACTION goes afk for a few hours
<civodul>mike121: SMOBs have to live on
<civodul>i wouldn't want more C API churn
<civodul>but there's a new "foreign object" API that is meant to replace SMOBs in the long term
<csed>Oh hey, new website.
<csed>And SICP in the bibliography.