IRC channel logs

<stikonas>lrvick: I think haskell there predates bootstrappability of other stuff in guix

<stikonas>well, they had a few attempts at haskell but so far no luckj

<andydude>Irvise: you mean hugs?

<andydude>Irvick: iirc, this guy talked about using hugs to bootstrap GHC: https://www.joachim-breitner.de/blog/748-Thoughts_on_bootstrapping_GHC

<stikonas>there are some newer updates https://www.joachim-breitner.de/blog/802-More_thoughts_on_a_bootstrappable_GHC

<andydude>I wrote a grep clone in Haskell

<lrvick>Hmm. Will keep an eye on the hugs path

<andydude>Also, there seems to be a Haskell=>C option https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/wikis/building/unregisterised

<lrvick>So maybe something along the lines of mrustc is possible then

<andydude>But that seems like it might be outside the spirit of bootstrapping

<lrvick>convert ghc to C, then compile it with gcc, then use that to compile ghc

<lrvick>that feels less insane to say now that I have seen mrustc

<andydude>What's mrustc?

<lrvick>mrustc is how rust is bootstrapped now. Mutabah straight ports old versions of rust to C++, compiles them with gcc, then you can use those to compile rust itself native

<lrvick>and bootstrap from there

<lrvick> https://github.com/thepowersgang/mrustc

<andydude>C++ makes a great compilation target

<lrvick>yeah it is the gcc->rustc bridge

<lrvick>so maybe can do similar with ghc

<lrvick>ghc source -> c++ source -> gcc -> ghc

<andydude>Zig also has a C++ impl

<andydude>but I believe it's part of the main repo

<lrvick>yeah, and zig is stupid easy to bootstrap

<lrvick>I already do it in stagex

<lrvick>zig was -built- for bootstrapping. Wish more languages thought about this early

<lrvick>literally just a "cmake" invocation to bootstrap zig

<matrix_bridge><cosinusoidally> Bootstrap from what though? 2.6MB wasm binary? https://github.com/ziglang/zig-bootstrap/blob/master/zig/stage1/zig1.wasm

<matrix_bridge><cosinusoidally> I'm not too familiar with the process, but it seems https://github.com/ziglang/zig-bootstrap/blob/master/zig/bootstrap.c builds a wasm to c converter then converts zig1.wasm into C?

<matrix_bridge><cosinusoidally> If so then you've got an large binary to audit.

<matrix_bridge><cosinusoidally> * n

<matrix_bridge><cosinusoidally> * a

<AwesomeAdam54321>cosinusoidally: Zig can be bootstrapped from version 0.10.0, which doesn't bootstrap from a wasm binary

<matrix_bridge><cosinusoidally> ah fair enough

<matrix_bridge><cosinusoidally> but does that involve walking up the versions one by one like rust?

<oriansj>AwesomeAdam54321: version 0.10.0 was written in zig itself; so you need a 0.9.* to build it from source if I remember correctly.

<matrix_bridge><Andrius Štikonas> But at least for zig there is still a path, even if not direct...

<matrix_bridge><Andrius Štikonas> Haskell or scala don't have any path ...

<lanodan>Yeah that said I wonder how long the 0.9.x compiler will work as it uses LLVM rather than something more stable.

<matrix_bridge><Andrius Štikonas> Well, one will have to build old llvm...

<matrix_bridge><Andrius Štikonas> Just like for rustc

<lrvick>Though if mrustc .74 ships, I can finally drop all old versions of llvm from the stagex tree...

<matrix_bridge><Andrius Štikonas> well, in my gentoo-bootstrap overlay I just used vendored llvm source

<matrix_bridge><Andrius Štikonas> which is a bit inefficient as you need to rebuild them for each rustc version

<matrix_bridge><Andrius Štikonas> but at least it reduces the amount of maintenance that I have to do

IRC channel logs

2024-08-19.log