*dstolfa pulls ludo's changes and re-tests everything <bdju>has anyone managed to theme qt stuff (such as quaternion) dark on guix system? <drakonis>hmm, you might be able to do it with qt5ct for now <bdju>hm I have qt5ct in my manifest install, so I must've tried to use it and failed before <drakonis>you need to set an envvar for it to work <bdju>yeah I have in my command history launching it with that env var <bdju>do I also need to launch qt programs with that? <bdju>looks like I have that line in my .profile as well <bdju>just to clarify, have you actually personally gotten this to work? it could just be broken <ixmpp>do you guys have the equivalent of a nix-shell <bdju>hm launching quaternion with that env var manually also doesn't work <ss2>I'm not sure if qt5ct is working as expected. It fails to find any installed themes, and it never sets any theme (icon themes have never been set), and have been contemplating to make a bug report regarding it -- but haven't had the time, and it somewhat remains a cosmetic issue for me. <ixmpp>drakonis, what's your workflow <ixmpp>is it just gonna be manifests again <drakonis>uhhh you know you can just write guile and call out to the relevant functions, yeah? <drakonis>guix environment can gobble manifests btw <ixmpp>but like, do you guys have something that can hook into direnv nicely <bdju>ss2: glad to know someone else is having problems. I've also had issues with gajim and dino ignoring my gtk theme unless I set it again at launch with an env var. lotta bad theming problems. <ixmpp>i did that in nix with a shell.nix and the direnv hook for nix <ss2>bdju: but that hasn't got to do with qt5ct? They use gtk after all. <bdju>my gtk theme is set, it works in pcmanfm. it's just broken in a couple things <bdju>I've been to a few things on the archwiki. I kinda doubt I can get it to behave <bdju>it's on my list of "things that have been broken many months" along with no working audio in qutebrowser <ss2>why would you want to? <The_tubular>I'm trying to understand more about guix, this is what this vm is for <drakonis>is there any actual example of someone running a mail server with guix? <drakonis>it lets you read the docs available on the website from your terminal <The_tubular>guix remove: error: package 'bash' not found in profile <drakonis>wait but i dont understand what you're trying to do here? <ss2>The_tubular: packages may be removed from your profile, but that doesn't mean that they are removed from your “hard disk”, since said package, that was once part of your profile(s) reman in the store. <drakonis>also why are you still rooted, haven't you created an user? <drakonis>i dont think the vm defaults to being rooted, right? <The_tubular>What I'm confused about is that I installed packages with my system.scm <drakonis>also what exactly are you trying to acheive here? <The_tubular>Learn, drakonis and mess with guix, probably break it to be honest ^^' <drakonis>however bash is provided by something else lol <ss2>so, then it is removed now. <ss2>maybe it is installed in your user profile? <The_tubular>It deleted a bunch of stuff, but apparently the packages are still there <drakonis>perhaps bash is still on your system profile due to it being part of %base-packages? <ss2>The_tubular: have you removed the profiles where fish was installed? <ss2>once they are, then the store items can be garbage collected. <drakonis>The_tubular: that's going to backfire, badly. <ss2>if it was installed threw system.scm, then guix system delete-genereations n..m <ss2>please look into the manual, it is quite well explained how to be rid of profiles, etc. <The_tubular>I'm having trouble with the docs, i was spoiled with gentoo wiki <The_tubular>Also the things you though it was good for every linux distro, well I was wrong :P <drakonis>arch wiki is far more generic than gentoo's <drakonis>use info guix to access the docs in the terminal, don't worry, info isnt like man <The_tubular>But I'm confused why stuff isn't getting garbage collected <ss2>and lessons to be learned. Well, I had some.. <The_tubular>But like breaking this VM doesn't really matter, I just want to see how "low" you can go with guix <drakonis>the guts are incredibly exposed due to the nature of scheme <The_tubular>My plan is to drop it on a rasberry pi with barely anything on it with a system.scm and let it run for a while <The_tubular>But this is later, right now I'm still learning the basis ^^ <drakonis>work has been done on the side to achieve rpi support but i dont think its documented in anywhere official atm <jlicht>can I have a "git@..." url for my git-fetch origin? <The_tubular>So how can I tell something is in my profile or not, right now both my user are failing when I guix package --list-generations <The_tubular>I never installed anything with guix install, always by writing it in /etc/system.scm <jlicht>The_tubular: guix system --list-generations might show something <The_tubular>guix system: error: list-generations: unrecognized option <jlicht>The_tubular: sorry, without the "--" (so just guix system list-generations) <The_tubular>Sorry, I'm monopolizing chat, I'll go on with a lecture of "info guix" <The_tubular>I didn't get the difference between guix system and guix package <drakonis>hmm, help me out real quick with using guix deploy <drakonis>i'm trying to work out how to get the guix deploy authentication to work on a vps <The_tubular>I think their is a blog about that on guix, but it doesn't use guix deploy <The_tubular>I also should go read about guix deploy, this looks very interresting <drakonis>well, the blog post covers a specific usage of guix deploy <drakonis>i'm trying to figure out what i'm doing wrong with regards to using it in a vps <The_tubular>Umm, what kind of authentification does it use, can you use SSH ? <drakonis>i'm just working out how to do this correctly <drakonis>i guess i still need to allow my user to elevate permissions <raghavgururajan>> leoprikler: raghavgururajan: I think you can "simplify" the quoting styles by doing ("([\"'])command[\"']" all quotes) <raghavgururajan>Ah good trick. Thanks! Btw, even patching both 'program' and "program" doesn't work. :( <ixmpp>sneek: later tell abcdw hey, any plans to sort out gtk themes, etc <ixmpp>man needs that dark theme goodness <ixmpp>for now i'll copy my nix-home configs <ixmpp>flatwhatson; your emacs native package, are you aware of the fact that every compile results in "Warning (comp): /gnu/store/xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx-emacs-yyyy-n.n.n/share/emacs/site-lisp/yyyy-n.n.n/zzz.el: Error: File error Opening output file" <zacchae[m]>Does GUIX try to manage your emacs `init.el`? I've installed multiple emacs packages with guix that I can't seem to access them (don't show up in M-x), so I'm wondering if I overwrote <zacchae[m]> * Does GUIX try to manage your emacs `init.el`? I've installed multiple emacs packages with guix that I can't seem to access them (don't show up in M-x), so I'm wondering if I overwrote something important <zacchae[m]>I want to try a `(require <packagename>)` statement, but neither the guix repo description nor the original git repo include what the package is called in emacs. <dongcarl>Installed GuixSD on an ancient iMac today... Installation went well, but GUI is not working. The GPU is a Radeon HD 4670, and when I boot with default flags in GRUB the black screen problem appears. When I boot with nomodeset, things seem to work until shepard is starting gnome (or is it gdm?) and then I get a solitary blinking cursor (no login <dongcarl>Cool fact: the WiFi on the iMac worked for the installation! <zacchae[m]>definitely an X problem. I get that same scenario any time I do `sudo herd restart xorg-server` <dongcarl>What's the Guix equivalent for `journalctl`? <zacchae[m]>Yeah, maybe my problem will happen to you in reverse <zacchae[m]>so if it is EXACTLY the same in reverse, you are screwed <dongcarl>Hmmm… still black screen with blinking server… <zacchae[m]>(basically turn it on and off again but more serious) <zacchae[m]> * (basically 'turn it on and off again', but more serious) <dongcarl>Yeah might be the move, gotta setup wifi tho <OJ[m]>Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmanifest <zacchae[m]>`guix package -m $HOME/.config/guix/manifest.scm` <zacchae[m]>you can generate it with one of the guix package flags <zacchae[m]> * you can generate it with one of the guix package flags and extend it yourself <OJ[m]>`guix package --export-manifests` yes <OJ[m]> * `guix package --export-manifest` yes <zacchae[m]>Anyone got any tips on how to debug my emacs not finding guix installed emacs packages? Do I need to restart a service or something? <OJ[m]><zacchae[m] "Anyone got any tips on how to de"> Sounds likely that you have a path set wrong. <daveed>zacchae: I don't know how to use emacs, but the directory for emacs plugins should be at $EMACSLOADPATH <zacchae[m]>The_tubular: Yeah, I've been doing a deep dive. I have to limit how much time I put in <vagrantc>The_tubular: i still some years into it get that feeling :) <vagrantc>well, mostly it's just the guile part of guix ... which admittedly, is a lot of guix <The_tubular>Also, I've heard that there was something like guix-home being merged soon, anyone heard about it ? <vagrantc>yeah, there's a recent thread on the guix-devel mailing list about it <zacchae[m]>OJ: I have `GUIX_PROFILE`, and I source `/etc/profile` is there more to worry about? <daveed>awesome, I've been reading about guix home recently and it seems very nice <moo[m]1><The_tubular "Also, I've heard that there was "> pog <daveed>The documentation is not the most clear at some points. <OJ[m]><zacchae[m] "OJ: I have `GUIX_PROFILE`, and I"> I haven't done this stuff for a while. I was a conscript just a little while back, so I owe you an answer. <daveed>zacchae: Is it set to ~/.guix-profile/share/emacs/site-lisp ? <zacchae[m]>`/run/current-system/profile/share/emacs/site-lisp` <apteryx>dongcarl: I'm guessing GNOME expects some basic 3D support, even in software, but your GPU/driver combo doesn't have any. Perhaps try something more old school like Xfce. <apteryx>as for the equivalent to journalctl; the closest to see the kernel log would be 'sudo dmesg', otherwise less /var/log/messages <daveed>zacchae: Again, I don't know how to use emacs. But I would ASSUME it doesn't matter. Does `/run/current-system/profile/share/emacs/site-lisp` contain the plugins? If not, maybe guix is giving EMACSLOADPATH the wrong value. <raghavgururajan>sneek, later tell efraim: In the config.scm you shared yesterday, I noticed that you were mount options for btrfs. Does autofrag runs as a service managed by shepherd? <zacchae[m]>dongcarl: apteryx Or maybe don't install a service at all and launch x manually. <daveed>The_tubular: A video by Andrew Tropin or another dev? <moo[m]1><The_tubular "moo Think it was in a youtube vi"> i'll look around <zacchae[m]>daveed: I think I just need to install emacs as a user as well. When I launch there are two emacs folders, one with the emacs packages I installed for the system, one for the user <The_tubular>So I'll be ready to install guix on my "soon to be" prof server, I've got a few questions left ... <The_tubular>1. I have a app that works on .Net core, anyway to amke this works on guix ? All I've seen is an old mesage in the email list <The_tubular>2. How is using guix for networking ? Like PPPOE, DNS server etc ? <daveed>zacchae: Let me know when you figure it out. I am considering learning to use emacs so it would be good to know how to install packages with guix. <zacchae[m]>I installed as a user and reran my GUIX_PROFILE commands, and now it works <zacchae[m]>Actually, I think it is a design choice. Programs should only draw from the intended packages, so it makes sense to keep them seperate. That way my system can update without worry of it affecting the user (or vice-versa) <wirez>why doesn't guix have its own gnu paste service and uses debian instead? <vagrantc>it's not worth setting up when there are working ones? <zacchae[m]>daveed: Actually, it looks like my emacs path updated on reboot (maybe from /etc/profile?). Now EMACSLOADPATH has the user directory first, then the system one. But this only happened after installing emacs as a user, so it may be a bug <zacchae[m]>does guix have working bluetooth audio with pulseaudio? pulse doesn't seem to be noticing my BT device. <zacchae[m]>Maybe there is a package I need. I did `guix search blu puls` and that only brought up `guile-ac-d-bus`, but I don't think that's what I want <The_tubular>Talking about go, I had plans to make a package for crowdsec <wirez>can you use guix in a proprietary embedded context like game console and not release source? <iskarian>The_tubular, that is quite the go.mod in crowdsec... <iskarian>wirez, I am not an expert, but I believe the answer is yes, as long as you do not prevent the user from installing other software. With the usual GPL caveats about distributing source. <zacchae[m]>iskarian: The GPL requirements just prevent you from "bundling" anything you make with the proprietary code. i.e., if you make a system that uses both, then you could not legally distribute that system as you could not satisfy both licences <nckx>You have to release your Guix source. <wirez>is it basically that if you're gonna distribute gnu software either as software or as a hardware device, you have to give source to it? <dongcarl>Any code snippets to adding an authorized key for guix system? I understand adding to /etc/guix/acl is not enough? <nckx>wirez: To the GNU (that is, GNU GPL-licenced) software, and anything that derives from it, absolutely. <iskarian>Ah, I was thinking that simply including a GPL program was okay, as long as you provided source, and did not modify it or link to it. <wirez>if i sold a game console running guix + my code, is it enough to give full source or do i have to let the hardware's software be replaced by the user? <nckx>iskarian: Well, the question was ‘and not release source’, so I take it at face value. <nckx>‘Just drop .pubs into a directory.’ <wirez>using debian pastie makes guix look small time. should add a package which kickstarts a reproducible pastie service and put it on a guix domain <iskarian>I don't think that's even in the top 10 things "mak[ing] guix look small time" :p <nckx>wirez: We're good, thanks. <nckx><software replaced by the user> So attempting to prevent users from installing their own software on their own hardware is sometimes called ‘tivoization’, and it's one of the things that the GPLv3 was made to prevent. So it's definitely not something desirable. <nckx>Let's s/So //. That's better. <dongcarl>I'm just doing a reconfigure, then a `guix offload test`, and it says that the key is not authorized :-( <nckx>Does the reconfiguration complain? Does the key show up in /etc/guix/acl? <dongcarl>nckx: Huh it does, but the unauthorized public key in the `guix offload` error is different than the one my target offload machine's /etc/guix/signing-key.pub... <nckx>[So glad it prints that now, I don't think it used to.] <nckx>Is it a familiar key? It has to come from somewhere. <dongcarl>Is there a way to ask the guix command what signing key it's using? <nckx>The build machine should just use its own /etc/guix/signing-key.pub . <nckx>and corresponding .sec . <dongcarl>Yeah sorry if I miscommunicated but it is using its own signing-key.pub... <nckx>I don't really understand the question. <nckx>Hm, it's also light out & birds are chirping me to sleep. I should heed their song. Good night/luck… *nckx draws curtain, opens coffin. <sawshep>Does anyone have experience developing with Ruby on Rails (or Ruby in general) on Guix? Bundler likes to complain that Ruby's /gnu/store folder is read-only. I've tried re-installing ruby and ruby-rails systemwide, per profile, and in environments (all with gc'ing inbetween), but I get the same error. <dongcarl>Ah I just needed to authorize my old iMac's signing key on my build machine... <zacchae[m]>Is there a way to spawn a second, similtaneous, x session from GDM? <irfus>zacchae[m]: iirc, with gdm you could just switch to the vt it initially spawned on to open another session from there <raghavgururajan>nckx: Can I pick your brain on this (https://issues.guix.gnu.org/49210)? In the first message I have mentioned the problem. In v2, I tried patching both the form of 'foo-program' and "foo-program" occurances. But didn't work. Thoughts? <The_tubular>Wow, this IRC web clients put the "(" in the link lol <The_tubular>Nah as I just said, the link raghavgururajan linked is broken for me <hrnz>well, there is no easy way to determine the link boundary <hrnz>there are valids urls with trailing ) after all <hrnz>a possible heuristic is to check whether the parentheses are balanced <hrnz>the guix issue tracker? it does. <zacchae[m]>irfus: when I do that, it just takes me to a "lock screen" (I can still switch back with C-M-f#), and signing in just takes me to my existing session <char>is there a way to guix build locally, so that the artifacts are just in the current directory? <iskarian>char: on a guix checkout, `./bootstrap`; `./configure --localstatedir=/my/directory/var --with-store-dir=/my/directory/store`; `make`; and optionally `make install` <char>thanks iskarian, but I meant if some project contains a guix package definition and I want to build it and just have access to artifacts. There is no way to use whatever build system is in that package definition? <iskarian>by artifacts, you mean whatever would usually go in /gnu/store/...-package-ver? <iskarian>Do you want the artifacts to possibly use things in /gnu/store, or must they be standalone? <char>probably just stand alone <iskarian>maybe something like `guix pack -L /my/dir/with/package/definition my-package` <char>That looks amazing. thanks again <iskarian>hmm, is it just me, or does guile have like 4 different approaches to exception-like behavior? <The_tubular>Is eshell comparable to a "normal" shell like bash ? <The_tubular>I've read online that it had trouble rendering ncusres stuff, is that still an issue ? <iskarian>I have not used eshell, but if it didn't work before, I doubt it does now... have you considered vterm? <iskarian>it is a traditional terminal emulator... in your emacs! <iskarian>okay, technically, vterm itself is just a terminal emulator, but there are some emacs packages which embed it like eshell <iskarian>ah, I think I may have assumed that you are trying to do this inside of emacs, because you mentioned eshell <sawshep>eshell is special because you can call emacs lisp functions from within it <iskarian>as far as i recall ncurses works by interacting with the terminal through the shell, but eshell does not run on a terminal so.... <The_tubular>Unless I do my work and eshell and when I call something that needs a terminal, I alias it to something that is going to make me quit emacs and launch it trough a terminal <sawshep>I suppose it could, iirc eshell has a unique configuration file similar to .bashrc. But emacs also has many packages that provide the functionality of the ncurses programs you might want to run within emacs. <leoprikler>The_tubular: w.r.t. dotnet core, it's not in the main repo, because you can't bootstrap it. There might be packages for it out there, but you essentially have to treat it as a blob. <leoprikler>if your app runs on mono alone however, it should work <The_tubular>Also what does it mean that I have to treat it as a blob ? <The_tubular>Like I understand that it can't be bootstrap, but what are the implications ? <leoprikler>you're basically running code that you don't understand that could do anything <leoprikler>in theory yes, you can get any random binary from the internet to work if you just put in the right patchelf calls <leoprikler>why such a dotnet package would necessarily have to do <leoprikler>but patchelf essentially patches ELF files to correctly set up the interpreter (ld.so) and runpaths, so that dynamic libraries are resolved correctly <The_tubular>Oof that looks complicated. I guess it's not in nonguix ? <leoprikler>It might be in that channel, but we don't talk about it here. <leoprikler>Note that that channel itself asks you not to talk about it on our platforms as well :) <The_tubular>Yes, it's there, is there somewhere I can ask support about this? <sawshep>Anyone know how to package rust applications? I'm having trouble understanding what packages to put in the inputs section to satisfy the Rust dependencies (also I'm bad at Scheme). I'll post a paste of what I have so far. <sawshep>I've looked at some other Rust programs for reference, but they all seem to be handling dependencies in different ways. <leoprikler>sawshep: you only have crates-io, but ansi-term is in crates-graphics <sawshep>leoprikler: That'll do it. I've now noticed many similar mistakes. Thanks for the help! <sawshep>Hmm, I'm trying to build a project to see if a patch will work, but I can't run any compilers! How do I rememdy this? <dongcarl>Hmmm what's a way to persistently add a kernel parameter to the default grub entry? <sawshep>ope, you have to be in an environment to use compilers <bricewge>Let's say I want to add the user alice (already defined) to a new, not yet definied, group, the group admin for example <sawshep>I need to use the ldd program, but it seems it does not exist in guix or I am not allowed to run it. Any suggestions? <karthik[m]>Guix OS is mandatory to package new apps or package manager is enough? <sawshep>karthik[m]: The package manager is enough; if you checkout the source the packages are all in scheme files under gnu/packages/ <karthik[m]>Maybe its a good idea to move package recipes to separate repp? <MysteriousSilver>Hello #guix! Is there an emacs master branch package with native compilation enabled? <bricewge>The_tubular: Send it to guix-patches@gnu.org, it is preferred to use git send-mail to send patches <The_tubular>Aight, I'll try to figure out how git send-mail works <MysteriousSilver>can i edit /etc/fstab manually, or is it recommed to do through guix configuration? <sawshep>MysteriousSilver: You should do it via guix configuration. If you don't your changes may not save between generations <Guest64>Can someone tell me how to make a persistent guix usb? I tried with `guix system image -t iso9660 --volatile installation.scm` but it didn't work. <wirez>does guix track the same linux kernel that other distros track? <sneek>wirez, nckx says: <software replaced by the user> Attempting to prevent users from installing their own software on their own hardware is sometimes called ‘tivoization’, and it's one of the things that the GPLv3 was made to prevent. See section 6. IANAL; ask your own lawyers to read the GPL to you. <sneek>wirez, nckx says: Apart from ‘share your modifications to GPL software and derivatives’, this means: don't be an arsehole, don't try to be clever by (ab)using things like code signing. The GPL is quite clear on that. If you or others can update the software in any way (and almost every device does this nowadays), the user must be able to replace it with their own. <wirez>sneek: no i don't mean working to prevent, only not putting work into a mechanism to make it easier <wirez>liek a custom image loader or something <wirez>how far behind main linux is that? <bricewge>I would say most of the time it's in sync with it, we are at 5.12.13 ATM <wirez>seems safer to run a kernel with no blobs <wirez>have security exploits ever been found in the blobs in main linux? <OJ[m]>I have an issue with missing icons in GTK programs. <pkill9>which TLD is better for a portfolio type website, .online or .info? <pkill9>that is, for applying for IT jobs? <wirez>unless you only work online, then .online <wirez>on guix, can you install a package with a different build setting than default without too much work? like xrdp without --enable-ipv6, if it was the default <wirez>curious how flexible guix package system is <OJ[m]>Inherit a package then override one or more definitions. <asdf-uio`>MysteriousSilver have you followed the instructions in the cookbook or only installed the package? <asdf-uio`>I get into stumpwm directly from gdm because I have no other window manager or desktop environment installed. <wirez>OJ[m]: to override a pkg does that mean you can't use an upstream build cache and now gotta build from source or? <atuin>Is the helper function `guix-emacs-autorload-packages` supposed to accept an argument (a guix environment path)? <atuin>like this: `(guix-emacs-autoload-packages guix-env)` <OJ[m]><wirez "OJ: to override a pkg does that "> You'll build from source, yes. <wirez>OJ[m]: is the override pretty small/simple and in the same format as the default pkg? <wirez>in some pkg systems it's actually a big hassle to override the default settings of a pkg <OJ[m]><wirez "OJ: is the override pretty small"> Same format and you don't have to rewrite everything. <Guest92>It works ok, but I always have to log in again after a reboot <Guest92>Any suggestion on how to troubleshoot? <Guest92>I mean I always have to log into my nextcloud account, it does not stay configured in the nextcloud client ***jonsger1 is now known as jonsger
<jab>morning #guix! I've got GNU Guix System installed on a Dell Optiplex 7020. Worked like a charm! <jab>It cost me $250. It has 3TB HDD and 30 GB of ram. It'll be nice having an older but decent server in the house. <jab>dstolfa: Yeah, I keep seeing more people on the mailing list talk about how it's really hard to get Guix System installed on their hardware. I figured, that I might as well install it on cheap old computers and sell it to 'em. <dstolfa>heh, i never found guix difficult to get installed. i only bumped into one hardware support issue that i just resolved with an external adapter, but it sure would be nice to have more libre hardware out there <nckx>dstolfa: Well. I am enjoying my week-end amidst my tree friends, I am hap. Yourself? <dstolfa>weekend things and all that as well :) <dstolfa>gf made some fresh sourdough so also gaining some weight <jab>nckx: thanks! I'm just trying to be useful. A $150-$170 desktop machine that will run Guix System is pretty rad. <dstolfa>jab: i'd definitely point people to it that aren't able to set it up themselves :D <jab>dstolfa: sourdough is awesome! I have made that is a while. Probably because I'm not a great sour dough bread maker. <jab>dstolfa: thanks. my main site is gnucode.me. <dstolfa>well, i'm definitely not a good bread maker in general, but my gf sure is :D <jab>I feel like there should be a shop.guix.gnu.org. :) <jab>dstolfa: it's not that amazing. :) It's just a blog. <jab>but I'd be open to hearing your comments. I'm trying to make my own version of patreon basically. <dstolfa>jab: while looking at the about, page i noticed perhaps an old nick: "My irc nick is joshuaBPMan"? <char>Can submit a patch with multiple packages as long as they are related? ***cage is now known as cage_
<nckx>jab: What's the power cost of one of those babbies? I've also toyed with the shop. idea. People can donate now, of course, but it's really not the same. <nckx>Not sure about selling actual hardware, I was thinking stickers 😛 <bricewge>char: If they are dependent, yes it's better that way <char>so if some are not dependant, but just commonly used together, it would be better to sumbit a different patches? <nckx>char: Patch no (one package per patch), bug # yes, but if they are truly independent package I prefer separate #s. #s are cheap. <nckx>Always different patches. *bricewge discover that a user can be a member of a group several time in Guix, noice <char>nckx: what about the mailing list, could I send more than one patch in a single email? <nckx>dstolfa: A friend o' mine tried for decades to gain weight. Always failed until he got married. Just sayin'. <nckx>char: If you send patches as attachments I think it's fine to attach >1 to one mail. <nckx>Some people prefer you don't send attachments but patches as mails (as git send-email does), but I don't share their workflow so I can't comment. <nckx>Keeping patches limited to one logical change is the most important thing and is most appreciated already ☺ ***jonsger1 is now known as jonsger
<Guest92>It works ok, but I always have to log in again after a reboot. <Guest92>Any suggestion on how to troubleshoot? <Guest92>I mean I always have to log into my nextcloud account, it does not stay configured in the nextcloud client. <nckx>Guest92: Welcome! Does nextcloud-client produce any logs (or even output when started in a terminal)? <char>Is anyone else concerned that, the minify-build-system doesn't work for ECMAscript 6? <nckx>Guest92: It sounds like settings aren't being saved (‘duh, nckx’) or maybe it's trying to talk to a keyring but doesn't quite manage. <nckx>Please also consider sending a bug report to bug-guix at gnu.org. IRC & mail both reach a different audience. <nckx>Or the same audience in different moods :) <nckx>char: Concerned? Is it fundamentally incompatible? Else I'd expect ‘someone’ to fix it once their favourite toy needs it. <char>nckx: the current uglify-js package (used for minify-build-system) can handle "let" or encanced for-loop. both are considered very standard now. The strange thing is that the current uglify-js package is defined in gnu/packages/lisp-xyz.scm ?? <nckx>It is written in Common Lisp. <nckx>I'm not much of a fan of implementation-detail.scm either but it sometimes makes sense. <nckx>Could it not (for certain values of) simply be updated to a newer version that supports let & friends? Or is upstream dead? <char>I think it would have made more sense to define it in uglify-js.scm or minify.scm and import lisp-xyz. Common lisp version hasn't been touched since year 2015, and the same author did a complete rewrite in Javascript (which does support ecma6). <nckx>‘Rewrite in JavaScript’ often means ‘dependency hell’. <nckx>And would be a plausible explanation for the current package's age. <Guest92>nckx: Thank you! I don't see anything when launching nextcloud from the terminal. <Guest92>nckx: Yes, that makes sense. Maybe I should check permissions or this keyring thing you mention. But I don't know where to start... <char>If I update it though, the new uglify-js obviously wouldn't go in lisp-xyz, but then who knows where that is being imported. I wouldn't want to break things. Maybe just make a new package js-uglify-js <nckx>gnu/packages/javascript.scm <nckx>Guest92: Me neither, I'm afraid. I don't use one, nor do I have a NC server with which to test. <char>It seems that Pierre Neidhardt moved it out in year 2019, but it somehow made it's way back <Guest92>nckx: ok, thanks. I'm new to Guix. How can I find the directory where a program I installed (nextcloud-client) will write to? How does that normally work in Guix? <char>Guest92: find ~/.guix-profile/ -name nextcloud-client, then ls -l the dir to see where the symbolic link points. there might be a better way. <Guest92>char: Thanks! But find ~/.guix-profile -name nextcloud-client gives me nothing <char>the / after .guix-profile is necessary <Guest92>char: find: warning: ‘-name’ matches against basenames only, but the given pattern contains a directory separator (‘/’), thus the expression will evaluate to false all the time. Did you mean ‘-wholename’? <Guest92>find ~/.guix-profile/ -wholename nextcloud-client/ <Guest92>find: warning: -wholename nextcloud-client/ will not match anything because it ends with /. <Guest92>find ~/.guix-profile/ -wholename nextcloud-client <Guest92>And that last command gives me nothing <Guest92>That Nextcloud directory is owned by root <dhruvin`>The latest patch for brightnessctl breaks my current setup of specifying udev rules. <dhruvin`>Sorry I'll complete later, please continue Guest92. <Guest92>Well, I am not sure if I should start playing with permissions <Guest92>I guess I should go for the bug report I was suggested. <Guest92>I am not that expert to guess where the problem is. <Guest92>dhruvin: I think you can go on. Cheers! <dhruvin`>The latest patch for brightnessctl adds support for elogind. <dhruvin`>What is the canonical way of using brightnessctl with guix? Inside exwm, if it helps. <dhruvin`>Also, the description of said package may no longer be true. <ixmpp>btw do any of you have fonts working properly? <char>ixmpp: my fonts are working fine, what is happening to yours? <ixmpp>i've installed packages in my profile but still no emoji, except for one or two which are entirely black and white and tiny <char>ixmpp: well thanks for making me realize that emoji isn't working for me <ixmpp>i was hopeful guix-home would have solved some of this but seems not <ixmpp>i don't even understand what's wrong <dstolfa>ixmpp: every font i've installed works properly, but then again my font usage is pretty minimal <ixmpp>i'm mostly worried about emacs too but i just turned on doom-modeline and it looks horrific cause it's all unicode placeholders <GuixGuest>Hi there. I'm a bit confused with guix licensing. I'm dreaming about throwing away ugly docker files, apt install / yum install/chef/ansible, etc and replace it with one single tool - guix. In big enterprise. Of course there ARE software under closed-like licenses. Some companies share all their code, some not. However, big enterprise, while <GuixGuest>achieving theirs' goals also can contribute back and improve the guix itself. It can improve popularity, enlarge the community, etc. If I have private projects is it legal to create my-private-channel.scm, make definitions of my private packages and keep it in my private repository? As result I will end up with multiple channels – guix official <GuixGuest>and my proprietary one. So, I can contribute back to guix and continue work with my private packages in big enterprise. In other words all my modification of guix.git repo goes public, while my-private-packages.scm/my-private-os-definition.scm stays private. <dstolfa>ixmpp: odd, usually what i do is just install the font as part of my manifest, and then i run fc-cache -rv <dstolfa>GuixGuest: as pkill9 already said, yeah that sounds reasonable. the GPL doesn't require you to open source anything, it just requires that if you do distribute something to end-users that includes GPL'd code, you have to abide by what the GPL says *dstolfa -> watching a series <raghavgururajan>> pkill9: which TLD is better for a portfolio type website, .online or .info? <GuixGuest>dstolfa, if I used guix as packaging tool and now I'm going to install my-private-tool to a customer should I open-source my package definition? or my-package? or nothing, because I used guix as is? <GuixGuest>package definition as code means code (gpl protected) or not... <GuixGuest>so, can I create my-channel.git repo under another license (company-private) and put my private definitions here? <dstolfa>you don't have to open source anything, i'm no lawyer, but i think that the only thing that would be required to be free software as per the GPLv3 here is your package definition and any modifications made to guix itself, but the code of the package itself can remain whatever it is <dstolfa>so, your package definition would download a tar.gz or something from somewhere, that could be under any license. however, the package definition itself i believe has to be GPLv3 <dstolfa>(and so do any changes to guix itself <char>dstolfa: fc-cache-rv isn't making unicode work for me; I even installed noto *dstolfa -> watching series, for real now <pkill9>which is better, <firstname><lastname>.name, or <firstname>-<lastname>.name? <GuixGuest>dstolfa, so if I put definitions of package into my private repository, is this repository still must be under gplv3? It is clear for me, if I fork guix.git and make modifications - results in gplv3. But in my private repo with alone guix.scm with define-package? If it must be gplv3 anyway it looks like "no go" for an enterprise. <char>dstolfa: I did fc-cache -rv again and it worked! ixmpp make sure you install the font that has the characters you need. <char>GuixGuest: I'm also not a lawyer, but I don't need why your private repo needs to be gpl. <char>Actaully, I just realized why: because you are going to be using (guix download) (guix build-system ...) <nckx>GuixGuest: You should really consult your (or any reputable) lawyer on whether your repository is a derived work of GNU Guix. I say yes, it is, and must abide by the terms of the GPL3+, but maybe I'm wrong. <nckx>Of course I don't think I am 😉 <char>Assuming it does have to be gpl, why is that a deal breaker? <nckx>(So many licencing questions lately. Well, 2. I guess that's… good?) <nckx>GuixGuest: I'm also confused why you say it's a ‘no go’. <char>nckx: because guix is so epic, and imo, it seems some parts of it were designed specifically for enterprise cicd. <katco>iskarian: your go patches look great! i will attempt to test/review on monday. i'm not a committer, so i can't give you an official +1, but i can lyk what i see. thanks for the patch! <char>nckx: you said the new uglify-js should go in gnu/packages/javascript.scm why is that better than lisp-xyz? <nckx>Er, because you said it's written in JavaScript, and it's for handling JavaScript, and it's not written Lisp? It's just obvious to me. <GuixGuest>char, it is important, because, in my case, I'm trying to "sell" new tool to our dev-department, I'm offering all to go against the stream (docker/ansible/k8s/packer/podman/rhel/centos), use "hard-to-quickstart" tool, force dev/devops to learn scheme, refactor ci/cd, etc. With no clear benefits. Honestly speaking, not benefits, but law risks or <GuixGuest>security risks. Our sec department will not be happy if we open-source our package building code with all resources, urls, etc. Some code must be closed, strongly on-prem, etc. <char>Is this an internal tool? <GuixGuest>even link to private unaccessible git repo may be not allowed in public <nckx>So *your* enterprise, not *an* enterprise. Still my heartfelt commiserations ☹ <char>gpl doesn't mean you have to make code public on the internet. <nckx>Only if you're handing out modified binaries to people based on (original or modified) GPL'd source code. <nckx>It's true that you don't have to put it on a public server, but you do have to give copies to anyone who receives such a binary from you and asks for the source, so ‘a public git repo’ is simply the easiest way for most orgs to comply. <GuixGuest>thanks for your answers. Need some time to think about.. and probably ask company lawyer explicitly.. <nckx>Yes, I strongly recommend that, since unfortunately it's not your decision to make. The company lawyer(s) may be excellent, or they may be ignorant, it doesn't really matter if their ‘no’ is final :-/ <char>thinking gpl code has to be public is a common misconception that your company lawyers might also hold saddly. <nckx>Anyway, it all hinges on how ‘based on’ in my previous comment is interpreted. If your lawyers say your proprietary-garbage.scm that imports Guix & Guile modules and only does meaningful things when fed to GNU Guix running only on GNU Guile is not ‘based on’ either, well, you wouldn't have to distribute any of your custom code. Again, I think it's not correct, but nor am I a judge. <GuixGuest>I see guix is really really underestimated, it IS the silver bullet in packaging, can't wait times it widely used in enterprise (like k8s) <nckx>(They could try to argue that Guix is a ‘system library’, but honestly: if management like Guix, and don't like the GPL, it's far more likely they'll Do A Violation than bother with excuses. That's the sad truth.) <nckx>GuixGuest: Thank you for the kind words; as a token of gratitude I shall shut up. <nckx>(One more: there are orgs like the SFC and (ostensibly) the FSF that can better help you with the hard legal questions. They might take long to answer but their answers will be better informed.) <char>I second nckx to ask a gpl expert lawyer <char>nckx: in regards to location of uglify-js, it is written in javascript yes, but mainly meant to be run by node (not browser), so maybe node-xyz.scm. Also it is used to handling javascript, but mainly by minify-build-system so maybe in minify.scm. <nckx>If you submit a patch updating uglify-js by 6 years to the latest ES6 version that actually works and allows Guix JS packaging to leap forward, the villagers will be so grateful you can probably put it in char.scm if you'd want. <nckx>I mean, don't, but it would be a luxurious problem to have ☺ <raghavgururajan>> leoprikler: raghavgururajan: I think you can "simplify" the quoting styles by doing ("([\"'])command[\"']" all quotes) <bricewge>Is it possible to execute "modify-services" on essential-services? <boeg>I chose xfce when I installed guix with the graphical installer. If I want to try out gnome3, kde, or something like that, how would I do that, so they are available alongside xfce in GDM login screen? Is it explained somewhere in the manual? I looked but maybe not hard enough? <TheAsdfMan>Hi, I'm trying to build a custom kernel, but i can't get it to boot the file-systems service fails to start then the rest of the services fail to start aswell, What i want to know is how do i debug this i want to know at which step the file-systems service failed, is there a log stored somewhere? <char> boeg: I think you can just add the gnome service in /etc/config.scm then do a system reconfigure. I think kde is not available though. <boeg>char: ah I see the gnome-desktop-service-type. I looked for kde so that's what tripped my up, I think. Thanks <boeg>Is kde not supported by guix? <char>boeg: I think there is some licensing issue. <dstolfa>i thought it was just that work needed to be done and it's not supported yet <char>I read that somewhere, probably incorrect based on what dstolfa said <dstolfa>i'm pretty sure that trisquel ships KDE, so i would be very surprised if it was an issue for guix *nckx 's only KDE licencing issue they can remember is from the literal nineties… <bdax>is guixsd tied to glibc? I'm interested in musl based distros and statically linked distros (I have no real reasons beyond interest) <stikonas>bdax: no, it's not tied to glibc some parts use other C libraries, but most build helpers might be tied <stikonas>e.g. early in the commencement.scm mes C library is used <bdax>hm interesting, I suppose it's largely uncharted territory atm <ixmpp>> char: dstolfa: I did fc-cache -rv again and it worked! ixmpp make sure you install the font that has the characters you need. <ixmpp>that's part of the problem, i don't know what fonts i need :( <ixmpp>char; which fonts do you have installed? <ixmpp>all i have to compare against is my nixos setup, and that hides away most of the fonts <ixmpp>26-06 18:22:10 ixmpp: > char: dstolfa: I did fc-cache -rv again and it worked! ixmpp make sure you install the font that has the characters you need. <ixmpp>26-06 18:22:10 ixmpp: that's part of the problem, i don't know what fonts i need :( <ixmpp>26-06 18:22:19 ixmpp: char; which fonts do you have installed? <ixmpp>26-06 18:22:35 ixmpp: all i have to compare against is my nixos setup, and that hides away most of the fonts <char>ixmpp: font-google-noto has emojis and other unicode. <char>Is there no predefined mit license? <nckx>MIT is expat or x11. Expat is most common. <nckx>If it doesn't mention the X Consortium → expat. <ixmpp>char: Oh, do you have them installed globally, not per-user? <char>ixmpp: I just installed it on my user profile <ixmpp>Maybe i have *too many* fonts <ixmpp>Wish there was an easy test util <char>I'm getting a strange error with -L option. If I do guix build -L ~/guix/gnu/packages ... for every package file, it gives warning failed to load <insert-package-here>... hint: file should start with (define-module (<insert-package-here>)). Each one does start with that (after a bunch of comments). Should I report a bug? <ixmpp>not the path to the actual files <ixmpp>modules have directory hierarchy <char>nckx: suprisingly, the new uglify-js was not dependency hell. There was only two, and one was already packaged. <leoprikler>raghavgururajan: no, you need to capture the quote that's actually used and use that in a string-append <leoprikler>(string-append kwote store-path "/bin/command" kwote) <char>ixmpp: using ~/guix still causes some issues with file actually missing define-module <iskarian>regarding those legal questions: perhaps it would be in guix's best interest to eventually have a page or FAQ addressing them? "we are not lawyers or your lawyer, but here's what we think is likely okay and not okay to do with guix ..." <char>iskarian: I would appreciate that. It would be simmilar to the very help page about gpl license, but specific to guix. <iskarian>It's like "call for a quote": most people are just going to move on because they want to have an idea if it's even in their ballpark before they spend effort on it <nckx>The_tubular: The (free) CDDL is incompatible with the (free) GPL2 in that you can't *distribute* combined binaries. There's no restriction on building or using them, however, so it's fine to include. <nckx>The_tubular: That is, you'll never get a substitute. <The_tubular>Does that mean you have to recompile the whole kernel ? <nckx>It's kind of a neat hack Guix gets to do because of the way it happens to be designed. <nckx>The_tubular: No, it's a module. <char>iskarian: yes that is what I refer to. <nckx>s/building or using them/building or using them together/, for added precision. ***iskarian is now known as Guest4466
<boeg>Can I add xorg configuration - like configuration you'd normally add to files in /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d - via my guix config? I have a set-xorg-configuration block where i set the keyboard-layout. Can I there also add other random configuration? Like i want to add something like Section "InputClass" ... EndSection ? <mekeor[m]>boeg: afaics in the manual, there is an "extra-config" field/parameter just at the same spot as "keyboard-layout" <boeg>mekeor[m]: right, i was not sure if that was for such stuff. Ill give it a try <raghavgururajan>danialbehzadi[m]: Thank you and congrats on your first contribution. :) <nckx>It's 37 versions behind. <sawshep>boeg: You might've figured this out, but your DE's and WM's need to be installed system wide, and then you need to restart the greeter for them to appear in the menu <Reventlov>Hello. Small question: can you add some channel directly in the guix system configuration ? <civodul>Reventlov: nope, though it depends on what you want to do exactly <civodul>for instance, you could specify a /etc/guix/channels.scm file in the system config <civodul>such that when users run 'guix pull', that'll read that file by default <Reventlov>My goal is to have the fewest locations where to put my config, so I was thinking about just packing everything in the configuration. <sawshep>Anyone know how to make bundler install gems in a different directory? I'd like to use Ruby on Rails for a project, but bundler tries to install gems in Ruby's /gnu/store directory <dstolfa>sawshep: i assume that this is a ruby gem configuration thing, not guix <cbaines>sawshep, I think GEM_HOME is the relevant environment variable <dstolfa>seems like you may have to modify GEM_PATH to include your GEM_HOME too if it doesn't by default <dstolfa>at least according to the trustworthy internets <sawshep>Hmm, so I progressed further with `rails new my-site` when I had $GEM_HOME set to ~/.guix-profile/lib/ruby/vendor_ruby/gems, but now it complains it can't find rails in my gem sources. I'll experiment with changing my $GEM_PATH too. <sawshep>ok, so it still complains about read-only filesystems when I properly set my GEM_HOME and GEM_PATH. <cbaines>sawshep, ~/.guix-profile will eventually be a symlink to a directory within /gnu/store, so that will be readonly as well <nckx>Oh, good, then we're only .04 versions behind. <projectmoon>Guess they're adopting the Firefox and Chrome versioning scheme 🙃 <sawshep>Perhaps I can do something similar to a Python virtualenv in Ruby. I've tried running `guix environment ruby-rails` but that still complains. <cbaines>sawshep, if you want rubygems to write to a writeable directory, then set GEM_HOME to that. Personally I use direnv and it's layout_ruby function for that purpose <char>sawshep: if you want ruby on rails available in the environment, you need to use --ad-hoc or define a package with ruby on rails as an input then do guix environment your-package <char>What is suggested way to test packages new packages before they are upstream? guix pull ~/guix ? <dstolfa>char: you can use ./pre-inst-env guix to do it, or if you prefer, you can set up a channel to your local git repository with your changes and use `guix pull --disable-authentication` and then just use guix <bricewge>Reventlov: It works well to specify a channel in your operating-system but it need some changes before being submitted <zacchae[m]>I'm migrating my old emacs config to my guix machine. Is there anything guix specific I need to worry about? For instance, if my config installs a package, but then I install the same one through guix, how does package loading get resolved? <char>dstolfa: If I add it as a channel, how does it know what to do with all the duplated packages? <dstolfa>sorry, i meant replace guix's channel from savannah to your local repository :) <dstolfa>you could do it in ~/.config/guix/channels.scm <rndd>char: but u need guix sources to be available in your channel <char>zacchae[m]: You don't have to use the guix emacs packages, you can continue to use package.el <rndd>btw, did anybody try pipeware in guix? <ngz>zacchae[m]: It depends on your load path. The first one loaded there wins. <char>I found with common lisp, I had to add something in init file to add to the load path. I think emacs would be similar <boeg>sawshep: yes, thank you 👌 <zacchae[m]>char: I mean, guix is the superior package manager, so I think I'd want to use that when possible <zacchae[m]>ngz: you mean the `EMACSLOADPATH` shell variable? <zacchae[m]>in case any one is wondering, elpa (`~/.emacs.d/elpa`) is loaded first, then user installed guix emacs packages, then system installed guix emacs packages