<sneek>Welcome back raghavgururajan, you have 1 message.
<sneek>raghavgururajan, Blackbeard says: thanks :). I did all the changes but it is still not working :( I am sure now that it is related to menu-entries because if I comment that the file works and starts installing
<lispmacs>hi, what is the least expensive way to output a raw float value to stdout, assuming you start with some scheme double value? It seemed like the only way to do it with just the builtin scheme procedures is to initialize a 4 value bytevector, use f32vector-set!, and then use put-bytevector
<theruran>guix-vits: no, that's what I'm trying to get out of it. a stacktrace at least
<lispmacs>I guess I could write my own C function to just convert over the Scheme value to a float, and output that with a C function...
<guix-vits>lispmacs: idk, but try also #guile (interpretor).
<funfuna>I want boot a GuixSD on diskless machine(pxe+nfs)
<funfuna>What method should I use to make it's rootfs? How should the kernel parameters be written?
<guix-vits>raghavgururajan: possible it worth to try ask at Pine64 Community? The devices they sold are ARM-based, but expected to be either flashed, or to be used with an attached microSD or eMMC card (with payload).
<nckx>raghavgururajan: If you'd decide that flashing's your only option and Technoethical (or anyone) is willing to do it for a reasonable fee, seriously consider it. T models are a pain to flash, double so under time pressure.
<guix-vits>nckx: so, need to remove the m-board to access the chip isn't all the fun to anticipate?
<nckx>guix-vits: It's more the soldering of wires to the chip. -S and -T models can't be clipped.
<alextee[m]>in the UK i've seen people offering to flash libreboot for 40 pounds (~55 USD) on ebay
*kmicu finally sees someone reporting out‑of-inodes issue in Guix land.
<nckx>alextee[m]: I almost guarantee you there's a different (and higher) price for -T models though.
<guix-vits>Cool. Yet GRUB-as-firmware-payload is clearly lacks an "visudo-alike" tool.
<nckx>guix-vits: It does (kind of), but think of it this way: Raghav basically broke sudo and root log-ins and now can't run ‘# visudo’ 🙂
<nckx>In any other situation you boot up a rescue system, but, welp.
<nckx>Any ‘solution’ to that would be a back door.
<guix-vits>nckx: tbh -- i'm like such a back door in my m. phone: First reinstall of "recovery" was unsuccessful, but the old firmware (Samsung "download mode") allowed me to make the second attempt. Now it's run Lineage OS.
<nckx>guix-vits: If TWRP lets you re-flash a broken Android BIOS without connecting physically to the chip it's just a back door. Which doesn't mean it's not convenient. It's very convenient. For you. For the NSA.
<nckx>You don't consider yourself a target. That's fine too.
<guix-vits>nckx: NO, that way: Firmware isn't reflashed. TWRP installed instead of a stock recovery (with firmware tools). Different OS installed with the recovery tools (TWRP). If recovery installation fails, firmware is steel there, and ready to help.
<nckx>I still see a ‘if picking this lock gives you trouble, we installed a completely different model here just to boost your odds’ sign. But I'm the kind of person who *would* forget to change the password in all the places, so that's just me.
<alextee[m]>does anyone have an opinion on whether guix packages should ship VST plugins or not? VST is a proprietary format but there exists a reverse-engineered header that free programs use. a lot of audio plugins come in both LV2 (a free standard created by the community) and VST. im wondering whether packages should install both or just the lv2
<janneke>could it be that guile-ssh is a dependency that configure does not check for?
<nckx>alextee[m]: This is IRC. Everyone has an opinion. Is there a free user of VST plugins or only free plugins?
<nckx>Either way I think it's fine. We have plenty software that reads proprietary formats in Guix. As long as no non-free code is run or ever recommended I don't see any reason not to.
<alextee[m]>nckx: im not sure i understand your question. most free hosts support LV2, and free vst plugins usually get ported by the community quickly, so there's not really much of a need for vst
<alextee[m]>but okay, it's still all free software (it uses a reversed engineered GPL header) so i guess we can install both
<guix-vits>alextee[m]: lawyer is a must. Is this plugins or header ships with Fedora?
<alextee[m]>i mean free VST plugins and VST hosts use the reversed engineered header
<nckx>If there's a reason not to ship VST it would be technical: what advantages does it give over an LV2 version? If they're the same thing with a different header, and LV2 works in ‘everything’, why install VST?
<nckx>We don't (always) install the kitchen sink ‘just because’, e.g. we're phasing out static libraries.
<alextee[m]>it has no advantages over LV2, while lv2 has many advantages over VST. i haven't seen anything that's VST only because the audio community ports free plugins so quickly. so i guess there's no need for VST in guix
<alextee[m]>i personally need some vst plugins just to test support in my host, but that's for development use :-)
<alextee[m]>and really, the only reason vst is supported on free hosts is so that people can run proprietary gnu/linux plugins ...
<nckx>guix-vits: While there's no shortage of bad fake legal advice in the free software community, we don't need to go lawyer-hunting for everything. This isn't advanced licence combinatorix. The licences are clear, this is a purely ideological question (are we helping actual users or just vaguely encouraging proprietary software).
<nckx>alextee[m]: Then you've convinced me there's no point in installing both. Dunno if that was your intention 😛 We can always revisit this later.
<nckx>I reading this as ’should we install the DLLs, which are free software, and can be used in Wine’? That's all true, but… no, of course we won't.
<nckx>I'm only a very end user of this audio stuff though.
<alextee[m]>no intention, just wanted an opinion :D nckx thanks, i think i agree too that we shouldn't ship vst plugins
<alextee[m]>i'll close one of my patches that added a vst output to a plugin
<guix-vits>alextee[m]: i was just read an "README" (possibly it was links Web-browser) about "can't be distributed together because...", so i'm scarred about all of this things. Just, header is free -- but format isn't. Can it be shipped from substitute servers? So on...
<guix-vits>See, in the link: "author has had no involvement in its creation. (original VeSTige)" -- looks like an legal-protection clause.
<alextee[m]>guix-vits: you need to sign an SDK agreement to get the official sdk, so anything built using the sdk is nonfree, but afaik there's no problems if you use this header
<guix-vits>with all of my admiration to nckx: legal stuff is never "trivial", as it's not designed to be a such.
<alextee[m]>guix-vits: well, not that this is a defence, but ardour has been using it for more than a decade and it seems to be fine, so does LMMS
<alextee[m]>and they're pretty popular, even outside free software
<guix-vits>Then i should consider that someone other already taked the care about all of this.
<nckx>guix-vits: We've all had our licence WTF moment and I understand your weariness (the scars will heal, though 😉), but throwing up your hands because now everything legal is a black box that tells lies is not a solution. Nor is it true. I didn't ever use the word trivial, by the way.
<nckx>There was a trend for (*cough* famous *cough* insufferable) hacker types to assume that they were experts in everything, including licences because how hard can it be right? lol lawyers aren't people.
<nckx>Then lawyers and generally sane people started yelli^W clearly stating, ad nauseam, that you can't apply your kind of logic to different fields and to let lawyers do the lawyering.
<nckx>It's important not to over-correct in either direction.
<guix-vits>nckx: True. Also: indeed, "clear" aren't suppose "trivial"; my bad.
<nckx>Sorry for the rant, it was really just me forwarding a rant from a free-software-sympathetic law student who was alienated by the free software community. Something we're good at, by the way. Go us!
<janneke>PurpleSym: afaics, gnu/tests/ssh.scm is always compiled, and requires (ssh session)
<PurpleSym>That sounds like a bug. Maybe we can conditionally disable it via `if HAVE_GUILE_SSH` in gnu/local.mk?
<nckx>janneke: I made a Guix on a Fedora that, according to ‘dnf list installed’ has no guile-ssh.
<nckx>I'm limited by my complete ignorance of Fedora though.
<guix-vits>Yes, but currently it's not installed (next month).
<guix-vits>One day i decided to see how the people cater to the mass users, to update my views.
<guix-vits>It happened after i'd read learncpp for a while, and tried to create a console app that will mimic `less`. Went to Fedora to look up the things, and their administration.
<NieDzejkob>Huh. I connected my phone via USB to tether internet, and had to `sudo herd restart networking` to get an IP, as otherwise dhclient ignores enp0s20u4. Then, my running firefox instance can't resolve domains, but can connect to IPs (visiting 22.214.171.124 works).
<NieDzejkob>(That's without DNS-over-HTTPS, I guess I'll try with DoH enabled next time)
<nckx>guix-vits: It makes more sense for a distribution like Fedora, where user creation was an imperative, ad-hoc scripted business, and all packages are system-wide. Less so for Guix, where packages were never allowed to create random users but you instead use declarative system services to do so.
<nckx>This should really be possible from NM without involving Guix but I don't know how (I use NM but no VPNs). I see that ‘Edit connection’ in nmtui has a ‘DNS servers’ and ‘Ignore automatically obtained DNS parameters’ option. 🤷
<nckx>That'll probably only work while the VPN is connected but then so will resolv.conf.
<joshuaBP`>nckx: I'm also using sway....I don't actually have the network manager applet running...I should give that a try.
<nckx>joshuaBP`: You don't need to, I just use i3status to show ‘Yes Wi-Fi good’ and nmtui to connect to new networks.
<sneek>noobly, guix-vits says: regarding frequently failing network, try check the output of `ps -e|grep dhc`. I'd similar issue because of multiple instances of dhclient running simultaneously.
<roptat>We don't talk about non free software on official guix channels (except to say they're bad :p)
<roptat>Firefox itself is free software, but encourages users to use non free sohtware. We could provide a free version (using a similar liberating procedure as for icecat), but nobody worked on it yet, as far as I can tell
<NieDzejkob>noobly: Guix ships with IceCat, which, after you turn off some extensions, is in my experience exactly equivalent to stock Firefox