<reepca-laptop>So I've got this weird situation where I can move the mouse and the cursor will move, but everything is unresponsive, including the keyboard (pressing num lock and caps lock doesn't turn any of the lights on).
<leoprikler>reepca-laptop: is this after the upgrade to gnome 3.32?
<roptat>zig: rebuild the package with guix build foo --check -K, then you can use diffoscope to find where the two versions differ
<reepca-laptop>leoprikler: not sure, I don't believe I have gnome installed, but I can check the current guix's version
<roptat>Once you know, you'll have to find a way to make it reproducible :)
<reepca-laptop>leoprikler: guix package -s gnome shows 3.32.2, but guix package -I gnome shows it's not installed.
<roptat>Usually, it's just a timestamp issue, so you can substitute a fixed date instead, sometimes it's a file system ordering issue, so you just sort the files before passing them to the command, etc
<reepca-laptop>This particular issue has happened several times before, just slowly, once every few weeks or so
<leoprikler>Then it doesn't seem to overlap with anything I've experienced recently.
<leoprikler>just for the record though, what kind of keyboard/mouse are you using (specifically how are they connected to the pc)?
<zig>leoprikler: roptat: thanks I will try diffoscope.
<zig>in the meantime, I am trying to create a relocatable guile program. I just did 'guix pack -R guile-nomunofu'. The generated tarball, contains everything i need, but the GUILE_LOAD_PATH is not setup, the guile that is built still point %load-path to /gnu/store/c7p869wvgaqd03anbvf82w09inw5q1b6-guile-next-2.9.6/share/guile/3.0
<rekado-out>gotta check why I'm even using /dev/sda instead of something stable
<__c>Good morning, all. I know there's concern about fingerprinting and some of Firefox's behaviours (which, I understand from the Firefox community, are often the result of forces outside of its control). However, there are no licensing reasons that I can see to not include Firefox in Guix. Would Guix accept a Firefox package?
<optima>rekado-out: on that topic: is a possible to use uuids?
<reepca-laptop>On starting emacs (even without init files) on my laptop it says "Warning: Lisp directory '/home/reepca/.guix-profile/share/emacs/site-lisp/guix.d/debbugs-0.20': No such file or directory", and fails to load any init files. email@example.com is installed, not sure why emacs is obsessing about 0.20...
<civodul>reepca-laptop: bah, that's from which commit?
<civodul>there have been several changes in this area over the last couple of weeks
<civodul>maybe apteryx_ can shed some light when they're around :-)
<__c>Apologies for the disconnect, I've caught the other messages via logs. Thanks for the response, optima. While I agree that there is icecat, that doesn't really answer the question of whether Firefox would be accepted.
<civodul>at the very least, we'd need to remove references to the Mozilla add-on pages
<zig>re relocatable guile program: to make it work, guile binary must be relocatable. what I did is do guix pack -R guile-next and then guix pack -R guile-nomunofu, and untar everything in the same directory. now it works :)
<civodul>so generally applying some of the things IceCat changes
<civodul>zig: though i'd recommend a single "guix pack" for both, so that the profile is correct
<__c>@civodul Why, though? Other software which can have non-free extensions (e.g. inkscape) aren't treated in this way.
<__c>It's usually understood that having the ability to load a non-free extension is not the same as being non-free oneself.
<__c>Ah, I see it: "A free system distribution must not steer users towards obtaining any nonfree information for practical use, or encourage them to do so. The system should have no repositories for nonfree software and no specific recipes for installation of particular nonfree programs. Nor should the distribution refer to third-party repositories tha
<__c>t are not committed to only including free software; even if they only have free software today, that may not be true tomorrow. Programs in the system should not suggest installing nonfree plugins, documentation, and so on."
<__c>Well, I guess the answer is "no" forever, then (barring a huge sea change at Mozilla)
<reepca-l`>civodul: I'm not sure. Have a bunch of upgrade processes running. I think the guix I had when I reported that issue was 4c16ffd383592854e2760004d2df354f85b32e57, but I'm also not sure that the emacs was up-to-date at the time.
***reepca-l` is now known as reepca-laptop
<civodul>__c: so we could provide Firefox as a package, but we'd apply some changes
<reepca-laptop>on a related note, for testing purposes I ran emacs -Q once and now for some reason emacs wants to start in non-windowed mode by default. The man page lists a -nw option, but I can't find a corresponding -w option...
<__c>civodul: true. It would tend towards Icecat in the limit, though, so I'm not that convinced that the effort is worth it 🤷🏾♀️ ... icecat is non-trivial already.
<civodul>__c: yeah, maybe, we'd need to see how much that would give us
<civodul>i'd also be interested in having Tor Browser
<__c>Would it be possible to help someone (i.e. me) to develop a Firefox package? I hesitate to ask because "To establish lasting freedom, just giving users freedom isn't sufficient. It is necessary also to teach them to understand what it means and to demand it", and I'm not sure if such a request messes with that principle.
<vagrantc>civodul: i think tor browser also supports downloading arbitrary potentially non-free extensions
<bdju>I would think that you could make similar changes to the ones icecat does, but based on firefox stable instead of ESR so long as you had enough people to keep up with the releases.
<civodul>vagrantc: right, so that would need to be patched as well
<ng0>civodul: if you (or anyone else) manages to package it, and then reach out to tor's browser team, i think the last email conversation i had with them was public and could be referenced to save some time
<civodul>bdju: yeah, i don't know how much work that'd be
<ng0>depending on how the package ends up, you could clal it torbrowser (with brnading)
<__c>civodul: many thanks for pointing me to the right document. It does have some interesting links, too... and it leads me to another question. What about Firefox, if it was packaged WITH a good set of extensions by default?
<nixo_>janneke: thanks, that works, but I realized the mtime is already correct. But julia writes the time inside the object .-. so It's more difficult.. I thought in the build env time is already faked
<puoxond>The only difference between the commits is a change to Emacs.
<ng0>__c: one take away from my interaction 2 years ago is that you could check if they have improved the license reporting (in firefox or in torbrowser), there were some undeclared licenses in firefox 2 years ago
*reepca-laptop facepalms. Forgot that emacs packages are listed individually in EMACSLOADPATH, and the profile hasn't been re-sourced, so of course it's still looking for version 0.20...
<nixo_>I hate julia more than ever: faketime "1970-01-01" julia -> segfault
<reepca-laptop>Hm, what's the proper way to get a "like-login" environment? Just running bash -l leaves a bunch of the old environment around, and running env -i bash -l leaves necessary stuff like $HOME unset
<nomr>How do I reduce the load on my system when guixbuilder is thrashing? Usually I would hit ctrl-z on build process to pause it while I want to use system responsively, but here it is just a socket to a daemon =S
<nixo_>civodul: yes finally it worked! thanks again
<jlicht>civodul: I guess I can mount things as a loopback device with a pre-defined delay, but it still seems quite involved to make sure you do not trigger unrelated problems (e.g. I want to simulate slow disk i/o for the running test, not the actual test runner)
<jlicht>it's probably easier to just run the tests and an actual slow system instead :-)
<roptat>jlicht, I did something similar for reproducibility : I mounted /tmp as a disorderfs to test for ordering issues in a few instances. If you mount a slowfs on /tmp, you don't slow down guix, but you slow its builds down :) (slowfs is an example, I don't know if it really exists)
<jlicht>roptat: a! disorderfs is exactly like what I'm looking for!
***nckx changes topic to 'GNU Guix | ⚠️ Savannah (‘guix pull’) is still troublesome | 1.0.1 is out! get it at https://guix.gnu.org | videos: https://guix.gnu.org/blog/tags/talks/ | bugs & patches: https://issues.guix.gnu.org | paste: https://paste.debian.net | Guix in high-performance computing: https://hpc.guix.info | This channel's logged: http://logs.guix.gnu.org'
***ChanServ sets mode: -o nckx
<brettgilio>Hey, nckx do you have a name? Curious who you are.
<nckx>brettgilio: Right, just read your mail, sorry. Had 0 time for Guix this week(end). That's core-updates stuff that is. If that sounds intimidating: it's not, just ‘git push … upstream/core-updates’ instead of master.
<cbaines>I'm all for making it easier to submit patches
*Digit installed guix, and using it on main rig, and enjoying it 9x more than expected... but pity it doesnt want to get hijacked by bedrock, not having the init where expected (and i expect many other things unique too)
<mjw>I got guix installed on top of pureos (a debian derivative) and although it seems to work nicely I quickly hit lots of compile warnings/errors because of ... urgh https://issues.guix.gnu.org/ gives a 502, sorry.
<mjw>Well, the reason is that the guix profile sets CPATH instead of C_INCLUDE_PATH
<mjw>Setting C_INCLUDE_PATH (as in that bug report I found) seems to work perfectly.
<mjw>But when looking at gcc.csm I see it is only done for some gcc versions.