<joshuaBPMan>Blackbeard[m]: That sounds pretty awesome! But for whatever reason, using X screws with my keyboard layout, and my mouse only moves up and down. Sway set dvorak as the layout, and my mouse always works.
<joshuaBPMan>And I want to use wayland if I can. I keep hearing that X is not not very secure.
<joshuaBPMan>sorry, pkill9: On guix system yes!!!! On Debian or another distribution probably not. guix system has a hard time configuring my mouse and keyboard layout. Sway just works. I have noticed some occassional sway issues with
<pkill9>another wayland compositor to check out is wayfire, it's also built on wlroots like sway
<joshuaBPMan>like, this morning I was listening to a video. the video was playing but it was not on the active workspace. aka my sway desktop only showed a terminal. After 20 minutes of listening to the video, I switched back to look at the video. The video was lagging. The sound was at 20 minutes in, but the video was at 10 minutes in. The video was moving faster to try to catch up.
<buenouanq>where they are standardizing a process instead of the product
<brendyyn>I mean I'm quite interested in what you think because the whole reason I'm learning to work on guix is because i expect it can succeed (for my definition of success), if it cant then id give up
<buenouanq>every single install of it then effectively becomes a distro
<buenouanq>I'm not sure how vastly popular it will become, but right now it's the obviously superior way to do package management and OS design.
<brendyyn>Do you not think that for example debian developers think highly of this project, that if guix had all the packages debian did, they would switch?
<buenouanq>Retrospectively, that we ever didn't do it this way just seems boggling...
<katco>is anyone using guix with purism's librem laptops?
<buenouanq>katco: I've preordered the Libre5 and am super interested to see if we can't put GuixSD on it at some point.
<katco>buenouanq: i'm interested in that as well, but i am currently, specifically, looking at the laptop. i'm unsure how guix would work with its TPM chip and coreboot, etc.
<buenouanq>brendyyn: I think that as soon as you really understand the benefits of Guix as a package manager, you can't help but start to build your whole OS around it - Thus GuixSD.
<buenouanq>So any Debian that uses Guix is needlessly crippled.
<buenouanq>every new install of it is effectively your own personal distro
<apteryx>brendyyn: I'm not too interested into discussing such a subjective topic (and it already has been -- search the mailing list archive), but I find Guix to be a great name; to me it is the least of concerns on the road to democratize Guix.
<apteryx>Blackbeard[m]: I use nmtui with network-manager (part of the base services)
<atw>katco: hello! Sorry I haven't followed through post-STL, work's kept me too busy to do much FOSS :(. I've been using GuixSD on a librem for a little over a year. A good experience! I think cbaines has one as well. I did have to one weird trick to get the backslash/pipe working
<brendyyn>buenouanq: Ok so to explain. If you look on distrowatch.com you will see that everyone and her granndmothers dog has created a GNU/Linux distribution. I'm hoping that over time, such people will start to think, "Hey, lets build a distribution with Guix System at its foundation" Here "distribution" means Guix System + custom destkop setup, wall papers, design, website, extra packages, different versions if
<buenouanq>brendyyn: yes, but I'm not sure they should be considered differnt distros. The differences between distributions of Guix System are trivial - While the differences between Ubuntu and Funtoo are not at all.
<atw>katco: we met at Strange Loop and talked about trying to figure out Andy Wingo's potluck plans
<buenouanq>even between 2 things both based on Debian aren't trivial
<brendyyn>buenouanq: well, such semantics are unimportant to my point ^_^
<katco>oh! hello! ha, i thought i'd be the one apologizing. i have been contributing quite a bit recently, but i also had been kept busy before that :)
<buenouanq>yes except if I ran distrowatch, I wouldn't let these be counted as different distros
<buenouanq>like I said, GuixSD changes the distro game entirely
<buenouanq>it doesn't map at all to how we have been thinking about these things
<katco>atw: i don't suppose you have a write-up of your experience on the librem with guix? specifically, how does it work with coreboot, tpm, heads, etc.? i'm a bit ignorant of most of that, so i'm not exactly sure how that would work
<brendyyn>You can pretend I said "spin" instead of "distribution", It' doesn't matter
<buenouanq>well if you're counting all the different config.scms as `distros' we already far suplant all existing ones
<atw>katco: no writeup, unfortunately, but I bought the hardware with totally-free distro support in mind. re coreboot: no problems there. re tpm: I'm not sure to what extent the tpm in mine is disabled. re heads: I don't think I use that but I have been meaning to get the librem key
<atw>and I did have to do this https://paste.debian.net/1078132/ to make the pipe/backslash key work. I mention that because I did not figure it out for a long time so I hope to save others the trouble. Maybe I should blog it!
<katco>atw: cool. i'm still debating whether i want a librem or something else, but i'm leaning heavily towarrds purism. maybe we should have some kind of package for bootstrapping librem images for guix ;p
<katco>also, even when package do very little, it gives me confidence to see them named in the distro. it signals to me that someone has already gone digging and declared "this is all you need to do for support". and if they're wrong, there's a flag in the ground to start from
<katco>i think i'll put an email out to the mailing list just to collect everyone's experiences into one thread
<atw>and we have bootloaders for several ARM devices, so why not this too? Maybe with enough weekends I can get a server going and distribute substitutes and handy disk-images. I got GuixSD installed on my hosting provider (with difficulty, should have tried DO :P) so it should be possible
<katco>yeah, right? i am also looking at getting guix on some single-board arm machines. and with all my guix usage, i need to get a substitution server setup for my network
<katco>i'm not sure if you're aware, but i work at DO :) we have a BYO image feature now. i half-heartedly tried to use guix's image, but it didn't work. i didn't have time to look into why
<atw>hence why I mention it! My server is sorta frankendebian
<atw>I should try DO. I don't know how many hosting providers have byo image, but I think it's rare
<dongcarl>sneek: later tell civodul Hey I'm wondering what the motivation behind `a49c57a7` was... I need to statically link libssp for my cross-compile, and those files are usually under `gcc:lib`, but of course because of the aforementioned patch, the cross-gcc doesn't have a `lib` output. What could I do?
<apteryx>raingloom: the description of the inetutils package could be better... Ideally this should have found it: guix package -s . | recsel -e 'description ~ "\bping\b"'
<apteryx>but it doesn't, since the description of inetutils is simply: "Inetutils is a collection of common network programs, such as an ftp client and server, a telnet client and server, an rsh client and server, and hostname.".
<apteryx>Feel free to hack a better description for it, mentionning the common commands it contains.
<atw>katco: you're right, maybe not so guix-involved
<sneek>civodul, dongcarl says: Hey I'm wondering what the motivation behind `a49c57a7` was... I need to statically link libssp for my cross-compile, and those files are usually under `gcc:lib`, but of course because of the aforementioned patch, the cross-gcc doesn't have a `lib` output. What could I do?
<civodul>i guess that commit was a simplification, as it says
<civodul>but if you use -static-libgcc and similar options, it should just work no?
<lprndn>Does Guix system use a wrapper for xsessions?
<pkill9>is it possible to get the defined module path in that module? i want to modify 'search-patches' so that it searches <directory-this-module-is-in>/patches, which would retain current functionality but let external channels use a 'patches' subdirectory, currently it's hardcoded to "gnu/packages/patches"
***Glider_IRC_ is now known as Glider_IRC
<roptat>pkill9, I don't use channels but in the case of GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH, you can add patches at the top-level directory
<lprndn>Yeay! Just so you know, it does! And now I have a workinf lightdm service! :D
<quiliro>there is an acquaintance which was jailed without probable cause for cracking onto the Ecuadorian president's and his family's computers and phones...the incarceration process has been very irregular and he is to be 90 days in prison even if they cannot prove anything
<quiliro>his name is Ola Bini and is a friend of Julian Assange
<brendyyn>ok but i dont think boycotting entire countries is going to make a difference
<wednesday>quiliro: How do I not purchase products from my own country(uk)? and why wouldnt I?
<quiliro>brendyyn: boicot is a powerful form of making a change...it does make a diference
<pkill9>out of curiosity, how might a GUI settings editor be implemented for guix? would it generate a config each time and reconfigure the system with it
<jonsger>civodul: do we have inside a guix pack any information about how it got created?
<kmicu>brendyyn: like all things from Suckless it’s a terminal emulator with very minimal deps https://st.suckless.org/ (nice if you have basic needs and compile your stuff).
<brendyyn>pkill9: This is something I've been thinking about too and am wondering what people think. Currently, as buenouanq says, everyones Guix system installation is like a separated distro with no standard way of managing it
<brendyyn>Perhaps it will require creating some new convention for laying out ones operating-system conf file
<brendyyn>then the gui could save its own config, inherit modify and output /etc/operating-system.scm. I really don't know
<kmicu>You could start by using Customize system from Emacs. It’s basically the same thing.
<reepca-laptop>hm, I'm not very acquainted with autotools, and I'm wondering how to substitute $(libexecdir) into guix/config.scm.in from the Makefile. I know if I was doing it from the configure file generated from configure.ac, I'd just put an AC_SUBST, but I can't do it from there because the variables the value of libexecdir is based on might change at any time up until 'make install'. The same variable is used in nix/local.mk, but instead of
<reepca-laptop>being substituted it's just defined as a C preprocessor macro.
<reepca-laptop>pkill9: shepherd services have an 'enabled?' slot. This can't be set at definition-time, though, it has to be set by invoking the "enable" method after the service is created. I can't see an easy way to put that in the generated configuration file, though. You can, however, control whether they get automatically started via the 'auto-start?' field of the <shepherd-service> that's used to extend shepherd-service-type.
<bavier>dongcarl: or do reepca-laptop's `guix build foo` inside the environment, whatever works
<laalf>for xfce to lock/suspend you need to execute "xfconf-query -c xfce4-power-manager -p /xfce4-power-manager/logind-handle-lid-switch -n -t bool -s true". this enables logind to handle the lid switch. shouldnt this be default? should i write an email about that?