<paroneayea>uploading a test VM to rackspace. We'll see how this goes in a couple hours when it's done.
<Apteryx>daviid: Thanks. I'm using Geiser as well. It seems that debugging is very verbose and manual (everything is command driver from the Geiser's GUILE REPL with commands such as ,b, ,bt ,n ,s ,locals, ,finish, etc.)
<len-oba>I can not run bash scripts with ./scriptname.sh
<Apteryx>I'd be happy to be missing something (a Geiser debug mode?) where I can make all those actions shortcut driven and see where I'm at in the source without having to print the backtrace all the time.
<lfam>marusich: I can't reproduce your issue, although I also see "TextToSpeech: Failed to contact speech dispatcher." At the point where your mumble hangs, clicking Next has no effect at all for me. I think that's because I have no audio input devices available (mic disabled in BIOS)
<lfam>I can click Next and nothing happens, but if I click Back, it does go back
<lfam>I tried clicking Cancel, and I got a dialog about certificates, clicked through, and the application appears to have loaded normally
<lfam>There were recently some suprising changes in this area. It turns out that with Python < 3.5, if a test suite was not found, the test phase passed. With 3.5, this counted as a failure, and we found many packages whose tests were never run
<lfam>I'm not sure of the state of this issue with Python 2
<Apteryx>OK, so it seems this would attempt running "python setup.py test", at least for the package I'm looking at (python-tox).
<Apteryx>You are right that when no tests are found it's a pass.
<marusich>I'm not sure what I did. I installed alsa-utils into my profile, and later, I noticed that mumble was not hanging, and the microphone was working. I tried rolling back my profile, and it still works. I have no clue.
<lfam>That's weird! Maybe mumble needed some state file in order to work, and this file was created after the first run
<lfam>Apteryx: Note that many python packages require custom test phase replacements
<Apteryx>lfam: I guess. it can be tox, pytest, there are lots of options.
<lfam>I don't know *how* it works, but there is a lengthy test suite that runs for that package :)
<Apteryx>lfam: OK, cool! The interesting thing in the case of tox, it's that it's a testing framework and it seems to use itself for its test suite. So we'd need a some other tox to run the tox to be installed tests.
<lfam>Ah, a tox-bootstrap that does not run its test suite
<marusich>lfam, I think I figured it out. I don't know if ALSA can support multiple programs "using it" at the same time, but it seems that whenever I run qemu (configured to use ALSA for its back-end sound driver, so I can hear sounds produced by the guest), mumble hangs for me.
<marusich>Similarly, if I start mumble first, and then start qemu, qemu fails to produce sound and emits error messages related to ALSA saying "alsa: Reason: Device or resource busy"
<marusich>I happened to be running qemu at the time when I tried to set up mumble.
<marusich>And the moment I shut down qemu, mumble starts working.
<lfam>Yes, that's a limitation of "plain" ALSA, IIUC.
<lfam>It's a primary reason for the use of software mixers like dmix or pulseaudio
<Apteryx>lfam: no, the "--user" option of "pip install" ensures that the installed package go to a local site-package directory, sowehere under ~/.local
<Apteryx>And then, by some PYTHONPATH magic builtin Python, packages found in the local site-package dir have precedence over global system installed one.
<Apteryx>Doesn't really fit the Guix way of things but I was hoping to use this as a quick and dirty fallback for when a package is missing/outdated.
<marusich>My guess is that Icecat is blocking lots of nontrivial things by default in the interest of protecting my safety and privacy, which is nice, but I'm curious to know why some pages still might fail to function even though I've basically given them carte blanche to run their scripts.
<marusich>For now, I'm working around it by using GNOME's web browser, "Web", which is a bummer
<marusich>It'd be nice to be able to just use Icecat.
<civodul>when downloading libssh's source in a fixed-output derivation?
<rekado>I don’t understand the question. “guix pull” shows me what it will build, says “building paths” for “…-module-import-compiled” and “…-?id=a033b93…”, then says “starting download of ‘/gnu/store/kajx9..-?id=a033b93…’ from ‘http://git.libssh.org…’
<rekado>(I don’t have a usable setup on that machine, so pasting the whole output is a little tricky)
<civodul>so the error is not in 'guix pull' itself, but in the process that downloads from libssh.org
<civodul>so presumably changing the URL to https will fix it, no?
<rekado>I’m a little confused to see that ‘a033b93’ (first few characters of the patch id) cannot be found in master.
<rekado>(maybe an old patch belonging to this old version of guix?)
<ng0>what happend to gunicorn? I just had to search this thread of patches I submitted in september because I needed pysocks, and harmut wrote that gunicorn would be added to web.scm.. but I see not contribution of any gunicorn. is it in the python branch which is now being build?
<rekado>meh, this isn’t working. I even ran ‘guix download’ on the https URL of the patch, renamed the file in the store to the expected name (yuck!), and then reran ‘guix pull’, but the derivation for this patch is still executed and it still fails.
<jmd>Then please use your time to help write a free replacement for that firmware.
<bill-auger>or convincing ppl to buy only the 1% of machines that do run free :)
<davexunit>what you talk about on your own blog is your own choice, but here on #guix, the guix mailing lists, and in the guix source we won't include or recommend non-free software.
<davexunit>I highly doubt that 99% is accurate. many laptops can run a fully free OS
<dvc>that's a joke right? I'll just spend a weekend writing a firmware replacement for a complicated wifi card without documentation and write a toolchain for a reverse engineered cpu architecture and then get it FCC approved * sorry for the sarcasm
<davexunit>boot firmware is a separate issue, but even before I knew much about software freedom I ran debian main on an old compaq laptop and everything worked.
<davexunit>the usual problem with laptops is intel wireless chips, but there are many laptops that use atheros chips, such as the new model of the dell xps 13
<jmd>davexunit: the other problem is video drivers.
<davexunit>most laptops don't have a discrete GPU and use the GPU built-in to the CPU.
<ng0>I actually have one very old netbook which did not start the guix installer medium at all, an amd64 one. I once ran parabola on it, but I guess the hardware became broken over the years. So I can not report it as a bug because the hardware could just be broken by now
<davexunit>I'm just saying that setting aside boot firmware and intel's management engine, you can find a laptop that will run a fully free distro without too much trouble.
<jmd>But they stil need a proprietary video driver - or at least many do.
<davexunit>you are free to use skype on guixsd, but we won't provide a package for it or recommend its use.
<Steap>davexunit: in the latest Intel CPUs, the integrated GPU requires a non-free firmware if I'm not mistaken
<Steap>davexunit: hope you have lots of old CPUs :)
<rekado>Guix already makes it very easy to roll your own non-free kernel package (I say this as someone who has never before built a kernel from source). Giving users who don’t know how to use these features instructions to use proprietary software isn’t empowering them, unlike improving documentation on how custom kernels can be used.
<ng0>I'd like to spend money to support new products for example, but I'm at the lower level of income so that isn't going to happen.. often such products are rather expensive, but for a reason. fair prices, but above my level
<paroneayea>[df]: anything that's FSF RYF certified will probably work with GuixSD