IRC channel logs

<paroneayea>ACTION back on stumpwm

<paroneayea>so nice to be back in tiling land again :)

<aeva>:)

<paroneayea>too bad guile-wm isn't far along

<paroneayea>maybe someday!

<alezost>ACTION also has a wish to switch from stumpwm to guile-wm some day

<fps>ok, so the package xmonad is defined in a file called wm.scm. does that mean there's a module "wm"?

<fps>(use-module wm xmonad)?

<fps>oops

<paroneayea>alezost: aha, I hadn't connected you in both places mentally :)

<alezost>fps: module name is (gnu packages wm)

<alezost>fps: in general (gnu packages foo) means there is a file gnu/packages/foo.scm

<fps>alezost: ty

<fps>oh, just thinking about dds's [distributed data stores]

<fps>i wonder if any of the new ones like ipfs or morphis support the following scenario

<fps>let's say users u_1, ..., u_n locally have a copy of a file which is identical for all users

<fps>these users start storing the file into the network, at slightly different times

<fps>so some blocks of the file have been stored by user u_i, alleviating u_j from having to send the file over the network again

<civodul>fps: 4G of RAM, 740T for /gnu

<fps>civodul: 740 _tera_ bytes?

<civodul>err, 740G

<civodul>we have plan to change that, but it takes time...

<civodul>ACTION -> zZz

<civodul>good night/day!

<fps>civodul: how much traffic do you get per month?

<fps>eh ok.. nn

<fps>i do have some boxes available that are comparable and mostly idle at the current time ;)

<fps>prepare a qcow2 that i can deploy without hassle and we might be in business ;)

<fps>anyways, off to bed, too.. nn

<lfam>What are #make-flags applied to? Just the build phase or any invocation of make (for example, in the install phase)?

<mark_weaver>lfam: all invocations of make by the standard phases

<mark_weaver>i.e. the build, check, and install phases. search for 'make-flags' in guix/gnu-build-system.scm

<joeyh>fps: IIRC, ipfs uses a pull model, not a push model. So, a node that wants to get a file may get peices from u_i and u_j, concurrently

<joeyh>that part of it works more or less like bittorrent

<fps>joeyh: and in morphis, iirc, multiple stores cause the file to spread over more nodes close to the hash wrt the XOR metric

<fps>but it still has to be sent over the net

<fps>but i'd have to look at the sources again

<rekado>sneek: later tell civodul Yes, I'll take a look at azr3; maybe tonight or over the weekend.

<sneek>Okay.

<fps>i just wonder about it because there might be some relevance to using a dds to serve binary packages

<fps>mainly because my upstream and that of many other people sucks ;)

<fps>an on topic question though: after i changed my config to include the desktop service, xmonad, yadayada, i had to reboot to get the display manager

<fps>is that expected?

<fps>[i suppose i also might have used the init system to get the display manager running, but i would have kind of expected it to be started once the system had been reconfigured

<fps>]

<fps>also:

<fps>jack2 should live in gnu/packages/audio

<fps>so i have (use-modules gnu packages audio) and appended jack2 to the packages list

<fps>but jack2 is an unbound variable

<fps>hmmm

<fps>for some reason in a "sudo emacs" i cannot do M-x guix-edit

<fps>oh ok, cause the variable is called "jack-2"

<fps>ugh

<fps>but guix package -A jackd shows the package's name, not the variable..

<fps>ugh

<fps>um, and the package seeems to be quite broken. this one is actually quite amusing.. hold on :)

<fps> khttps://imgur.com/hb2Txq7

<fps>seems to be the wrong python version :)

<fps>but to barf on precisely that statement

<fps>lel

<fps>anyways, will reask later. channel is still zZz'ing :)

<rekado>fps: oh, the jack-2 error is on me.

<rekado>the build system requires one version of python and it seems that the scripts need another.

<rekado>(I'm using jack-1 on my machines, so it hasn't bit me.)

<fps>rekado: np, i took a look at the package definition

<fps>but didn't see any mention of python

<fps>oh, it inherits jack-1

<fps>ah allright, the module it lives in uses the python module?

<fps>rekado: is that the source of the error?

<fps>just as a note: guixsd is pretty much infintely more accessible than nixos ;)

<fps>i love it

<fps>joeyh: yeah, the pull model about getting blocks from different hosting nodes is the same in morphis..

<fps>joeyh: i just wonder about the special case where e.g. a subset of users have built the same derivation and want to store the result

<alezost>fps: but you can do "M-x guix-edit" in "emacs" without sudo, right?

<fps>joeyh: individually they might have weak upstream, but combined even uploading a large package could be done efficiently (at the cost of building it on several machines)

<fps>alezost: yes

<alezost>fps: did you install guix in your user profile (guix package -i guix)?

<fps>alezost: the result of "sudo su" is also very very limited (as in it can't even do "ls")

<fps>alezost: i don't think so

<alezost>I bet "sudo -E ..." will work

<fps>alezost: that would make some sense..

<alezost>I think the problem is that your root settings are naked, so sudo doesn't do much unlike

<fps>"naked" as in "underconfigured"?

<alezost>fps: did you do "guix pull" under your user? and not under root?

<fps>alezost: i hope not :)

<fps>i can redo it as root though just to be sure

<fps>actually i'm pretty sure i did it as root

<fps>as installing emacs after guix pull did not recompile everything, but went rather quickly

<rekado>fps: python is pulled in by the waf-build-system. I suppose it would be sufficient to add python2 to the inputs here.

<alezost>fps: ok. by naked I mean, I think there is not much in /root

<fps>alezost: i could live with using a second emacs just to inspect packages, but i suppose to hack them i'd have to use a root owned emacs process

<alezost>like .bashrc etc

<alezost>fps: I never start emacs under root

<alezost>I don't see a reason for that

<fps>alezost: yeah, i just had my config.scm in /etc/ and owned by root. i guess i could change that :)

<fps>alezost: i was just following the route suggested by the installation instructions

<fps>alezost: ok, so to hack a package, i'd fire up emacs, M-x guix-edit jack2

<alezost>does our manual suggest to have a root-owned /etc/config.scm? that's a very strange suggestion

<fps>alezost: one moment..

<fps> https://www.gnu.org/software/guix/manual/html_node/System-Installation.html#System-Installation

<fps>see 6.1.4

<fps>following that it naturally ends up owned by root

<alezost>fps: the package definitons are placed in store, so if you want to modify a package, better clone git repo

<fps>eh ok, getting into the "tribal knowledge" now :)

<fps>alezost: thanks

<fps>or maybe it is documented in the guix manual. i only ever looked at the guixsd manual yet

<fps>brb making coffee

<fps>um, https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=guix tells me zilch about how to submit bug reports

<fps>that's a bug

<fps>but how can i file it?

<fps>so meta?

<fps>s/\\?/\\!/

<fps>oh ok, there's a note in the contributing page following the link.. emails, ok :)

<rekado>fps: to send a bug report you can write an email to bug-guix@gnu.org

<alezost>fps: I have my guix git clone at "~/src/guix", so with (setq guix-directory "~/src/guix") "M-x guix-edit <pkg>" brings me to a pkg file in that git dir

<alezost>fps: "/etc/config.scm" was just an example. For me it seems very strange to put it there though

<fps>alezost: cool.. will try cloning the repo and see how that goes..

<fps>alezost: yeah, it became clear to me from you generous people's comments that it's just a suggestion.. maybe a clarifying statement in the manual would help

<alezost>fps: re "rebooting after guix reconfigure": yes, it is expected; AFAIK there are plans to add support for using a fresh system right away, but currently you need to reboot to have a new system after guix reconfigure

<fps>alezost: ok

<fps>alezost: i wonder though: packages i install with system reconfigure are available right away

<fps>so it felt quite like nixos in that sense except for the missing service start

<fps>and the manpage also says "reconfigure switch to a new operating system configuration"

<alezost>fps: because they become available in /run/current-system/profile/bin which is in your PATH, but services can't be reconfigured so easy

<fps>alezost: ok

<alezost>yes, switching to a new configuration means changing a symlink for /run/current-system

<fps>so as a corrolary: switching to a new system with a service removed and then gc'ing might break the old service?

<fps>or are they not gc'ed for that reason?

<fps>btw: just as a sidenote: the creator of morphis even hosted his git repo on the morphis network for the lulz :)

<alezost>the old systems are placed in /var/guix/profiles/ and they are not gc-ed. Only if you remove those links, the old system things will be gc-ed

<alezost>btw I install almost all packages in my user profile, I don't see a reason to install them globally

<fps>alezost: ok. ty

<alezost>np, you are welcome to ask

<fps>another little issue: emacs is missing most of its icons in my configuration

<fps> https://imgur.com/gniMRHY

<fps>whcih doesn't hurt so much since i disable the menu and toolbars usually anyways

<rekado>fps: you may need to install one of the icon themes.

<fps>rekado: ok. i actually don't, since i have no need for icons in emacs, but other apps might need them?

<kmicu>fps: why fonts in your screen shot are so ugly? :)

<fps>alezost: about the point of having packages in the user profile vs. system. i'm tinkering with it in a vm and once ready might move it over to my real hd. wouldn't it then be useful to have all that stuff available immediately just by using the config.scm i created?

<fps>kmicu: you tell me :)

<fps>kmicu: might be a scaling issue with the screenshot on imgur? no idea how to get it to 100%

<fps>they are pretty ugly here, too, though..

<fps> https://i.imgur.com/gniMRHY.png

<fps>ah right

<alezost>fps: analogously to a system config, it is also possible to make a "user config" - a scheme file with manifest. So after "guix package --manifest=/path/to/my-user-manifest.scm" your user profile will be populated by the packages you want.

<fps>alezost: oh nice :)

<fps>rekado: just a quick question: that setq call goes into my .emacs.d/somethingorother?

<alezost>fps: (I think it was for me); yes it's a general emacs setting you put in ~/.emacs.d/init.el or ~/.emacs

<alezost>init: nice nick

<fps>alezost: oops, yes.. :)

<fps>ok, got it in .emacs.d/init.el and restarted emacs, guix-edit jack2 still gives me a read only buffer.. hmmm

<fps>and yeah i have a clone of guix.git in ~/src/guix

<fps>yeah, it still opens the file in the store..

<fps>i'll put it in .emacs and see if that's loaded and eval'd

<alezost>fps: check the value of guix-directory again

<alezost>look at "C-h v guix-directory"

<fps>alezost: still in the store..

<alezost>fps: do you mean 'guix-directory' points to store?

<fps>alezost: yes. putting the setq into .emacs changes something,though :)

<alezost>could you look at "C-h v guix-directory" and tell its value

<fps>sure.. reverting the change.. but i think it was just the .emacs.d/init.el wasn't evaluated

<fps>now describe-variable is broken :) um. i rather give up for now since i do have some work to do :(

<alezost>what do you mean by "broken"

<fps>C-h v guix-directory ENTER adds another dash to guix-directory

<fps>making it guix--directory

<alezost>I don't believe you :-)

<fps>um, shall i make a screencast? :)

<alezost>I'd like to look at it

<alezost>anyway after “M-: (setq guix-directory "~/src/guix")”, "M-x guix-edit" will definitely work as you want

<fps> http://imgur.com/lQmK2sl

<fps>no cast, but the state after pressing enter

<fps>if i press enter again i get guix-e-directory

<fps>and then pressing enter again gives me possible completions

<alezost>that's because guix stuff was not loaded, so guix-directory is an unknown variable

<fps>ok

<alezost>try “M-: (setq guix-directory "~/src/guix")” and then "M-x guix-edit"

<alezost>apparently your init.el file is not loaded

<fps>i added the setq back to ~/.emacs and now it gets evaluated..

<fps>sorry, for ignoring the M-: comment, i was just already adding it back ;)

<alezost>ok, so does it work now?

<fps>now it complains: [hold on]

<fps> http://imgur.com/0MQo2kM

<fps>i wonder if typing y is the right thing to do :)

<alezost>it's a general emacs complaining about local variables: guix git repo contains ".dir-locals.el" file

<alezost>"y" is safe

<fps>ok, thanks :)

<fps>nao i can hack the package definition. yay

<fps>rekado: btw: are you responsible for packaging all the other audio stuff, too? awesome :) now we just need to get more plugins going :)

<fps>btw: what's your workflow for submitting PR's to the packages?

<fps>drats, need to work, but this is more fun

<alezost>fps: look at (info "(guix) Contributing")

<fps>alezost: ok

<alezost>by the way you can read the manual in emacs by evaluating: “M-: (info "(guix) Contributing")”

<fps>once i have info installed.. /me scrolls back...

<alezost>fps: "guix package -i texinfo"

<fps>:)

<alezost>ACTION has to go

<rekado>fps: yes, I packaged a couple of audio tools because I'm using many of them myself. I have a dedicated audio workstation running GuixSD.

<rekado>I recommend the calf plugins.

<rekado>use them all the time.

<rekado>BTW: running JACK in realtime mode is work in progress. For now I just use the "-r" flag.

<fps>ok

<fps>rekado: did i ask you about a soundcloud account before?

<rekado>I don't think so.

<fps>rekado: sooo, you got a soundcloud account where i can listen to your stuff?

<fps> http://soundcloud.com/fpsio has some of mine :)

<rekado>I still have one but I haven't been using it in a very long time.

<rekado>I no longer publish unfinished music online. (And all music is unfinished, so it probably means I won't publish any music anymore.)

<fps>:(

<fps>music is never finished

<iyzsong>soundcloud still want the flash plugin to work :-(

<rekado>iyzsong: right.

<fps>true... i open chromium just for it ;)

<rekado>that's why I wrote soundCLI, but it's bit rotten.

<rekado>fps: I'm working on a prog rock album, though, so I might publish the tracks once the recordings are done/abandoned. Probably not on SoundCloud, though.

<fps>rekado: fair enough :)

<kmicu>SoundCloud does not require Flash™ browser plugin.

***tschwing_ is now known as tschwinge

<fps>kmicu: it started to again some time ago

<fps>or at least it stopped working in firefox without flash

<kmicu>I’m using SC daily and I have no Adobe Flash™ on my syste

<fps> http://imgur.com/6MWfCrE

<fps>icecat

<fps>brb phon

<kmicu>fps: http://i.imgur.com/a5EBrj5.png

<kmicu>(Remember that you need a wrapped binary with paths to GStreamer and ‘media.gstreamer.enabled;true’ in your FF/XUL based browser.)

***init is now known as E4xoi

<fps>kmicu: um, ok. then the error message of soundcloud is just wrong :)

<fps>which is not surprising

<kmicu>Yes the error message is misleading.

<iyzsong>ah, good to know :-)

<davexunit>ACTION tries to fix xflock4

<kmicu>fps: of course you can also use Emacs https://github.com/r0man/soundklaus.el but SC’s API does not support reposts on your personal stream yet.

<davexunit>fixed xflock4. patch is trivial so I'm just going to push it.

<davexunit>cleans up 18 generations of system builds

<davexunit>oh wow there's a lot of stuff to gc now

<davexunit>went from 51GiB of disk space used to 38GiB

<iyzsong>lol

<fps>kmicu: uuuum, ok :)

<davexunit>despite being a guix user for some time now, I am still pleasantly surprised from time to time with how much easier it is to inspect the system than anything else I've used.

<davexunit>in particular, 'guix size' and 'guix graph' are constantly coming in handy.

<fps>davexunit: uh, thanks for that pointer.. checking them out :)

<civodul>Hey Guix!

<sneek>civodul, you have 1 message.

<sneek>civodul, rekado says: Yes, I'll take a look at azr3; maybe tonight or over the weekend.

<davexunit>hey civodul

<civodul>hey, davexunit!

<fps>kmicu: oh, no tracks posted on your part.. but your reposts might be interesting, too :)

<fps>or i misunderstand SC ;)

<fps>kmicu: if you liked that one beat, i got the sample from milt jackson's awesome "sunflower" album. track "people make the world go round"

<fps> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGB5TKYf1B8&index=3&list=PL1853BD2312C85718

<fps>;)

<fps>one of my all time favorites

<fps>i think it even has freddie hubbard on trumpet...

<fps>iirc it's a hubbard tune from his album with the same name..

<fps>oops, it was "polar ac" :)

<fps>awesome lp, too

<kmicu>I think we should talk about such things on a music related channel #lad/#musnix/#ardour/#non/#lau or even #u-he — that trumpet is a pure perfection ;)

<fps>kmicu: hmm, possibly. i usually try to take into account how busy a channel is when deciding whether OT chitchat is ok. does this channel have a different policy?

<kmicu>Yep, but no point in increasing a noise to signal ratio for people reading #guix logs. Also we can engage more people on linux/libre audio related channels and discover more gems.

<fps>kmicu: oh right. forgot about the logging. point noted..

<davexunit>gah, nodejs 5.0 released.

<davexunit>we're still on pre-4.0, prior the un-forking of io.js

<davexunit>I tried to upgrade awhile ago but it's not a simple "bump the version and compute the new SHA" update

<lfam>I'm trying to add a patch to gnu/packages/patches but when I try to build the package that references it: "Throw to key `match-error' with args `("match" "no matching pattern"[...]"

<lfam>Never mind, I think I found the / a problem

<avoine>what would be the argument to build an environment with all the packages in %base-packages?

<avoine>The closest I can get is: guix environment --container --ad-hoc -e '(@ (gnu) %base-packages)' -- bash

<avoine>but I have the same `match-error' that lfam had

<davexunit>avoine: 'guix environment' currently doesn't allow expressions that are lists.

<davexunit>but I've been meaning to propose a patch that changes this.

<avoine>ok

<davexunit>I normally only evaluate expressions, typically with --load, that have a single package.

<davexunit>but a list is a pretty natural extension.

<civodul>yes, it would be nice to allow lists

<davexunit>yes, and it won't be a hard patch to write.

<davexunit>avoine: I'll try to make this happen soon. or you can hack (guix scripts environment) yourself so you don't have to wait for me :)

<avoine>davexunit: I'll try, I still need to learn myself some schemes ;)

<davexunit>avoine: :)

<davexunit>thanks for reporting the missing functionality.

<davexunit>now I know that there is a user out there that wants this.

<davexunit>bumps it up on the ol' priority list.

<lfam>When applying patches in package definitions, how is patch invoked? -p1 or -p0?

<taylan>lfam: should be -p1 usually

<lfam>Or, how can I generate patches with git diff that can be applied when building with Guix?

<lfam>Okay

<davexunit>git format-patch -1 sha-goes-here

<Steap>lfam: you can specify the "-p" argument in the package definition

<Steap>iirc

<bavier>lfam: the 'patch-flags' field of origins

<bavier>if you need something other than '-p1'

<lfam>I can apply the patch by hand against the source tarball I downloaded, but it fails when done from within the build process against what should be the same tarball. The matcher can't find the hunks to match against

<lfam>Well, not the tarball, but the unpacked tarball

<davexunit>lfam: tar xf $(guix build -S the-package); cd the-package; path -p1 whatever.patch

<davexunit>s/path/patch

<davexunit>remember to remove the patch from the package recipe first

<davexunit>rekado: that ruby-permutation patch you posted is interesting to me. it's GPL2 licensed!

<davexunit>could there be gems that depend on it that are violating the GPL since most Ruby gems are expat licensed and no one pays attention?

<fps>ok, let's see if i can get the renoise demo (totally non free) packages just with the help of the guix manual :)

<fps>adventure time while i wait for my image processing job to finish running

<fps>*packaged

<davexunit>'guix system container' now in master :)

<bavier>yay!

<fps>the one thing nixos has over guix is github ;)

<davexunit>easy on the trolling ;)

<fps>hehe

<Sleep_Walker>you can put there some mirror if you find it usefull, can't you?

<davexunit>some people already have mirrors of guix on github

<bavier>anyone else notice problems viewing commits at http://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/guix.git/

<bavier>?

<bavier>viewing the commits between "doc: Mention Nix in the intro." and "gnu:fish: Add python input" bring me to a "No repositories found" message

<fps>Sleep_Walker: just generally speaking gh does make creating PR's etc, extremely straightforward.. how would a mirror help?

<davexunit>well we're definitely not going to use github's pull request system.

<davexunit>beyond software freedom issues, many of us, myself included, think it is not very good.

<fps>um, i do need a little advice though. how do i read an error like this:

<fps> https://i.imgur.com/oSouy1b.png

<fps>i know the package definition is still broken, but what does this tell me? :)

<fps>oh

<fps>i suck :)

<bavier>fps: if you're working out of a git repo, you'll want to use ./pre-inst-env

<fps>bavier: nah, i just tried creating a file called ~/nonfree-audio.scm and tried to see where that takes me :)

<fps>and then tried things like nix package -L . -A renoise

<fps>oops, muscle memory

<fps>s/nix/guix/

<fps>and also: guix build -L . renoise

<bavier>fps: did you see the "missing field initializers" message?

<fps>bavier: yeah, but it's a warning, no?

<fps>i'll add them then

<fps>oooh, the things in the module definition turn into paths

<fps>aha!

<fps>um, running the install.sh script in the tarball takes me into G-Expressions. i don't quite feel up to that yet ;)

<bavier>fps: in the "renoise" tarball?

<fps>bavier: yep

<fps>hold on, i'll try to figure out how to ssh into the guixsd system in the vm

<fps>then i can finally stop creatig screenshots ;)

<bavier>fps: you shouldn't need G-expressions to run a script. You should be able to do something like (system* "install.sh") from a build phase

<bavier>fps: see e.g. the 'autoconf phase of the rtmidi package

<fps>bavier: ok. thanks.. so i shouldn't use the trivial build system either?

<bavier>typically the gnu-build-system is a good starting point

<fps>ok, got ya

<bavier>or any of the other *-build-system, which can then be tweaked with 'modify-phases'

<civodul>davexunit: yay for 'guix system container'! \\o/

<davexunit>civodul: :)

<davexunit>someone reported an issue with the guix-environment-container.sh test. it's a valid issue. for some reason the '/' mount point shows up in the output of a file we count the lines of.dsnjkl;cdgfhj,k.l gsdtuilo gasdfghjyuil sdgfuil qweaf qguip

<davexunit>ummmm

<davexunit>sorry about that

<davexunit>I can't even begin to explain how that happened

<davexunit>things are getting a little silly here at 4pm on friday at the office.

<civodul>don't smash your keyboard ;-)

<davexunit>but yes! valid test issue to fix.

<davexunit>/ mount point shouldn't be there.

<civodul>but but, there's always a / no?

<davexunit>but it should be filtered out for the test

<davexunit>I'm not concerned with it there

<davexunit>only the mappings

<davexunit>gotta go!