<paroneayea>wooo, the guix "see source" feature is pretty cool *cmhobbs installs guix.el <rekado->I wonder how to use --with-source properly. <rekado->I thought I could do "guix build -S hello" to get the sources, modify them, repack them and then install my modified version of "hello" with "guix build --with-source=my-hello-3.tar hello", but that doesn't seem to work. <rekado->well, it builds, but not with my changes. <rekado->I'm not sure it actually uses my modified tarball at all. <civodul>rekado-: the file name has to match the package name <civodul>to distinguish when several packages are passed on the command line <rekado->another question: how can I disable this automatic check for updates for GNU software? I will not be online when I demonstrate installing stuff and I don't want to wait for a timeout. <civodul>if your network interfaces are down, nothing will happen <civodul>there's no way to disable it at the moment <civodul>just make sure to ifconfig whatever down <zacts>night and day you are the one, beneath the sky and under the sun <rekado->my mistake. GNU hello does not rebuild .gmo files from .po by default, so changing the .po files has no effect. ***joehillen is now known as joehillen|away
<zacts>woah, my irc client is all effed up <zacts>debian emacs on beaglebone black <zacts>it shows you private messaging me <zacts>and in the minibuffer area it says #guix <rekado->would it be possible to avoid propagating inputs for Ruby and/or Python by symlinking the store items of the dependencies in the package output? <rekado->only one path would have to be considered at runtime (the package output containing the symlinks), and the inputs would not need to be linked to the profile. <rekado->we're already symlinking outputs across packages to get CUPS to find its filters which are provided by a separate package. <rekado->granted, that's because CUPS does not check an environment variable to find filters but assumes they are located in one particular location. <iyzsong>I think that should work. should good, and better than wrapper (for apps) IMO. ***tschwing_ is now known as tschwinge
<iyzsong>civodul: hi, I just send the 'gtk-icon-themes' patch. it rebuilds the icon-theme.cache file for each theme when GTK+ is referenced by profile. <iyzsong>I think the 'ensure-writable-directory' should move to (guix build utils), but it triger a rebuild of everything for me. <civodul>iyzsong: i think it'll wait until after 0.8.2 <civodul>iyzsong: BTW, would you like to post one or two screenshots? :-) <civodul>now to get the top-level .symlinks to work, bah <davexunit>the images aren't loading, but this is looking greeeaaaat <davexunit>I really need to get xfce running on my guixsd machine <Phlogistique>two nitpicks: - no mention of Nix - is garbage collection a "feature"? <civodul>rekado-: nice! could you update it to the new web site? *civodul has to go afk for a few hours <rekado->I don't have my keys on this disk yet (and no easy way to copy them); I don't think I'll be able to add the screenie myself. <davexunit>the current screenshots 404, but that's okay since we will replace them real soon. *rekado- goes back to working on the slides for the talk <davexunit>rekado-: the thumbnails show up, but if you click them it will bring you to a 404 page *davexunit fixes a couple typos on the contribute page <bavier>typo on the download page: "As of version , the..." <bavier>0.7 was the first USB install capable release <bavier>there's also a trailing "gnu.org" at the end of the 4 freedoms on the About page. <bavier>and the screenshots 404 when clicked on <davexunit>those screenshots will get replaced really soon, anyhow. <davexunit>I don't see a stray gnu.org in the source code <davexunit>bavier: fixed the guix version thing. the next time somebody deploys the site it will be visible. <davexunit>too bad our deployment has to be through CVS <davexunit>bavier: the version info was there, but someone forgot to unquote an expression :) <davexunit>I sent an email to the GNU webmasters to propose that GNU maintainers are given rsync access to /software/<project-name> <davexunit>so that people like us aren't forced to deploy our site by generating it, then checking it into a CVS repo for no good reason <rekado->finished/abandoned my slides for tomorrow. 20 minutes is really short, so I'm only focusing on functional package management principles and how this makes things easier for users. <rekado->obviously doesn't include the demos. <rekado->it's just a few slides: motivation, what is a function, how this maps to packages, properties gained for free, visualisations of build process and profiles. <davexunit>rekado-: the introductory slides with partial solutions is useful, I feel. <rekado->the rest is shown in the demo and I'd like to leave a few minutes for Q&A. <davexunit>rekado-: best of luck with your presentation. I gave a quick 20 minute talk about a year ago about guix at a hackathon. I'd like to do that again. <cmhobbs_>davexunit, re: your comment about working with nonfree software yesterday, i don't look down on you and follow a same path. it's unfortunate but it's life. we all dream of the libre utopia but we have to work in the real world <rekado->I'm very fortunate to work on free software for a living. (Some exceptions apply for software licensed for non-commercial use.) <cmhobbs_>i've managed to get my toolset (os included), most of my hardware, and my personal environment to 100% free software. i've also managed to get previous clients/employers to release their code as free software <cmhobbs_>currently trying to get the current employer to release theirs and i'm working on a side project that's also libre <cmhobbs_>if i start contracting again, i believe i'll try to find strictly libre gigs <cmhobbs_>though, i'll probably have to expand my skillset to do that <bavier>cmhobbs_: congratulations on your employers releasing their software <rekado->oh, my talk has been rescheduled. It's now supposed to take place at 2:20pm, not at 3:15pm. Could someone please update the news item on the guix website? <cmhobbs_>bavier, thanks! those are older battles. i'm still fighting that fight with my current employer <cmhobbs_>holy cow, the guix website got an overhaul <davexunit>cmhobbs_: yup! just happened this morning. not 100% done yet. <taylanub><wgreenhouse> taylanub: another virtue of that guixsd logo is that it can be expressed as ~V~ <cmhobbs_>also, with "guixsd", is the plan to move away from using guix as a package manager on non-guix distributions? <davexunit>cmhobbs_: to answer your questions... the logo came from sirgazil, the same person that created this new website <davexunit>and GuixSD has always been part of the project, but it doesn't have any impact on using Guix on top of another distro. <rekado->cmhobbs_: GuixSD is a logical extension from the packaging principles followed by Guix. A package in Guix must have all direct and indirect dependencies in the store; this includes the C library, the foundation of any system. <cmhobbs_>has non-free software in guix been discussed yet? what if someone packages something non-free? <davexunit>cmhobbs_: we just don't include it in the distro <rekado->cmhobbs_: the package recipes would be derived works from the GPLv3+ licensed Guix code. This does not apply to the non-free sources, though. <rekado->as a FSDG-abiding system, we obviously won't include any packages that recommend or enable non-free software. <rekado->any packages that you don't indend to publish can be used with Guix by setting GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH to wherever your private package module is located. <rekado->(this applies to non-free and free software packages alike) <davexunit>yeah, I have a couple of packages that I keep in my own little git repo <paroneayea>you suggested using substitute-keyword-arguments, but if I have to both make use of and extend the #:phases section, what's the recommended way to pull that out? <paroneayea>iirc there's no nice way to fetch something from a keyword list <bavier>paroneayea: substitute-keyword-arguments does that for you alread <rekado->the fan on my Thinkpad X200s runs constantly when on GuixSD. <mark_weaver>rekado-: FWIW, I don't see anything like that on my Libreboot X200 running GuixSD. <rekado->maybe related to the selected cpu governor or boost or similar <bavier>jackdaniel: we have some developers who are actively working on GuixSD on ARM. <jackdaniel>yes, I'm just wondering what arm support lacks right now <jackdaniel>sorry, not arm supported on arm, GuixSD of course <jackdaniel>or to put it the other way - what puts GuixSD aside Guix, if I'll put Guix on system with busybox <bavier>jackdaniel: Guix can be used as a package manager on top of other distributions <paroneayea>guess it's time to try the daemon offload feature <paroneayea>namely because my laptop on its dock will totally overheat if I try compiling things, and I need to sit at my desk setup to get things done :) <paroneayea>hm maybe that won't work if I refuse to make install guix ;) <paroneayea>guess I'll have to verify that my adjusted guile-emacs package fully compiles later. <bavier>hello aurelien, thanks for the link! <mthl>paroneayea: I was following the instructions for installing guix without 'make install' on your blog, and I think it will be more adequate if you indicate the instruction "sudo ./pre-inst-env guix archive --authorize < hydra.gnu.org.pub" before "./pre-inst-env guix package -i hello" :-) <mthl>paroneayea: It can be a good introduction to guix, to let the builders compile linux-libre :-) <paroneayea>I'm glad to see that quite a few people seem to have found this helpful so far <mthl>since it seems not recommended to 'make install' every time you pull from git, I was pretty unhappy with the 'guix pull' + build in current git repo. <mthl>so your article serves my needs <paroneayea>yeah I think that route is probably best for people who are hacking guix <phant0mas>I checked all the alternatives I was told at the ml, and bullcodes seems cool :-) <vmlinuz88>guix pull fails: "failed to set up the build environment for '/gnu/store/<alphanumeric>-module-import.drv' *jackdaniel makes his first attempt to instal GuixSD, fingers crossed <vmlinuz88>paroneayea mark_weaver Any ideas why this might be happening? This is from the latext version of guix, as of 2 hours ago. I just finished ./bootstrap && ./configure && make <mthl>vmlinuz88: with "./pre-inst-env guix pull" ? <paroneayea>vmlinuz88: I don't use guix pull, so I don't know... <vmlinuz88>I'll try to reinstall it by pull it from git and running bootstrap-configure-make again. <paroneayea>vmlinuz88: how about just blasting your current profile? :) <vmlinuz88>I'm not sure if it has anything to do with my profile. the problem seems to be with the /gnu/store <mthl>vmlinuz88: Guix was already installed when you "bootstrap-configure-make..." ? <vmlinuz88>mthl, no, I cloned the repo as per the instructions on paroneayea's blog, then ./bootstrap && ./configure && make <vmlinuz88>then I followed the rest of the instructions. Now I try to run guix pull, and I get that error. <mthl>vmlinuz88: I'm in the same situation that you described but i'm not having that problem :/ <vmlinuz88>by the way, paraneayea, I'm on Ubuntu now, and when I ran ./bootstrap && ./configure && make, gcc complains about not having libsqlite3-dev, autopoint, graphviz (for the dot command), texinfo, and libbz2-dev. You may want to add those packages to your blog post as dependencies for guix. <mthl>yeah he forgot some dependencies <vmlinuz88>on some distributions, such as Fedora, autopoint is included in the gettext package <mthl>vmlinuz88: by the way, if you don't "make-install" I think "guix pull" is not required, before "guix package -u" <mthl>because of the "./pre-inst-env ..." alias <paroneayea>so close to having a working guile-emacs package <paroneayea>alas, tests still get run despite my hopes to the contrary here! <bipt>paroneayea, looking at the definition of substitute-keyword-arguments in guix/utils.scm, it looks like the substitutions are only used if the keywords were present in the original list <paroneayea>er, parallel-builds? apparently is parallel-build <paroneayea>kind of frustrating that I had to wait for guile to fully compile two times in a row to find out that tests were still enabled both times, gah ;) <rekado->I'm looking forward to play with guile-emacs! *davexunit tries to update his config to use xfce <rekado->I have nothing in my config relating to xfce <rekado->I just installed the "xfce" meta-package and created a .xsession file that starts xfce when I log in. <rekado->If you do something cool with your config, please post it. Mine is embarassingly plain. <davexunit>rekado-: will do, the addition of %desktop-services has made my config more plain :) <paroneayea>davexunit: are you using guixsd on your work machine? <davexunit>I have a desktop at home that I run guixsd on <davexunit>using it motivates you to fix the things that need to be fixed :) <paroneayea>I don't run much on it other than backups and etc right now <paroneayea>I think I've decided that I'm going to do guixsd for mediagoblin's premium hosting <paroneayea>I'm tired of being paralyzed by the fear of doing system upgrades <paroneayea>davexunit: tbh I'm probably going to stub out some of the js stuff in the "fuck it I'm out" style of using the precompiled jquery, etc <paroneayea>it also means I'm putting opstimal to the side ;) *davexunit high fives paroneayea <davexunit>I'm taking a trip to delaware on saturday. I should have a decent amount of hacking time while I'm there, so I'll try to make sure that I push a wip-deploy branch for others to hack on <paroneayea>davexunit: next, I need to find someplace to do test deploys to <paroneayea>if I can do test deploys to rackspace cloud or something else using openstack <davexunit>openstack would be good, or anything that speaks a free standard <davexunit>as you know, right now I'm just spawning temporary local vms. <davexunit>we've gotta think about networking and state management. <davexunit>paroneayea: in that nix doc I see stuff like "EC2_ACCESS_KEY" <davexunit>does this mean that openstack has some compatibility with amazon ec2? <davexunit>that means we can write a generic EC2 adapter <davexunit>and it's possible to use it on self-hosted infrastructure <davexunit>so not only amazon, but OpenStack and Eucalyptus private clouds. <paroneayea>davexunit: though we should call it an openstack adapter ;) <paroneayea>I really don't want to promote amazon's evil stuff <davexunit>welll.... I'd save that name for something that speaks the real openstack API <davexunit>but I knew that at least Eucalyptus supported the EC2 API <davexunit>so it's possible to use an EC2 compatible service in freedom. <davexunit>guix system: error: symlink: Permission denied: "/var/guix/profiles/system-18-link" *davexunit shyly sneaks out of room <davexunit>I pitched Sly to YCombinator and Sam Altman told me "I don't like foxes" :( <davexunit>HOLY CRAP the new slim login screen looks AWESOME <davexunit>but I like the idea of pitching Sly like a startup <davexunit>"how will me monetize you ask? two words: plush foxes" <davexunit>paroneayea: oh that's interesting. didn't know that. <davexunit>I may not like Docker, but they have one of the all-time cutest logos <davexunit>hmm, how do I use the bash completion stuff again? *davexunit searches through docs and email <paroneayea>so well executed, no wonder people fall head over heels at first look! <davexunit>how does one source the entire bash_completion.d directory? <davexunit>now to figure out how to theme this thing...